First order from BH - RC Groups
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Sep 18, 2009, 02:50 PM
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First order from BH

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Last edited by flyandi; Oct 05, 2009 at 08:23 PM.
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Sep 18, 2009, 03:47 PM
EDF Addict
You can do a pick-up.....I know others have. Just call and tell them you want to pick up, and they will refund shipping.
Sep 20, 2009, 03:19 PM
Registered User
I talked with customer service on Friday and even I had to wait a long time (about 16min), the girl offered me to pick it up event on the same day. Cool! :-)

Takes me about 30min to get to Monterrey Park WITHOUT traffic, but as always, Los Angeles is a traffic mess and the whole 101 was "red" (3h each way, probably). So, I am waiting for the delivery :-)
Sep 21, 2009, 05:08 PM
Registered User
Just got off the chat with customer service and asked for the confusing delivery date. The provided link in the confirmation e-mail said that the delivery is expected today (09/21), however I got advised that I shouldn't use this and rather go to UPS directly using the tracking ID. She stated several times that the order is not yet processed at all.

Question: Why does the system indicates that the "expected shipping" date is today, if the order was not even processed yet?

However, that brings me to my next concern: My credit card was already fully charged on Friday.

Question: How can my credit card already get charged, if the order is still unprocessed. I could be wrong, but isn't it considered as "fraud" if you charge for something but then indicate that you didn't do it?

Again: I hope that I will get a brand new Plane (Fresh Out Of The Factory) - new in box and unopened - in the time indicated on the website (max 3 days, which will be tomorrow).

Btw, I ordered Thursday evening (Friday + Monday + Tuesday = 3 business days) :-)
Sep 22, 2009, 11:40 PM
Registered User
Latest Update:

I checked frequently the UPS tracking link today and the latest status was still "Billing Information Received".

I contacted customer support via chat and asked if my order was shipped. After about 25min I got the answer that my order was shipped today and I have to wait until tonight to see an update in the UPS tracking system.

Unfortunate the status has not been updated and I wonder if UPS has picked up the package yet (shipping means that it's on the way, right?).

I still hope that the package is on the way and that I am able to fly the plane on this weekend :-)
Sep 23, 2009, 12:38 AM
Registered User
Just talked with UPS and they confirmed me that the package was not picked up by UPS today :-(
Sep 23, 2009, 01:06 AM
Registered User
Why I am reporting here on my first order at BH?

Mainly because the opinions about BH are so divided and I had to experience it myself. From what I read it sounds that BH had a lot of issues the couple years but on the other side improved recently.

Still, several individuals are reporting serious issues. Problems are product and customer service related.

I am reporting my real experience with BH and stick to the facts that I collect. I am a business owner myself and I had to learn to deal with clients, too.
I am not here to complain, but maybe my report will help to identify the actual issues and how to solve them (which is in BH's responsibility).

Summary so far:

* Customer Service: Long wait times (approx. 20-30min in average) at the chat. That includes from waiting for the operator to the "I will pull your order, please wait" - message. Needs drastic improvement.

* Customer Service: Confusing information about delivery times. The link in the order confirmation e-mail calculates a approx. delivery date which is not fulfilled by BH -- I use the Yahoo eCommerce Platform myself and you can configure that every easily to avoid any confusion. The system automatic calculates the delivery date based on historical data.

* Pre-Charge of Credit Card: I think this is the biggest concern. Telling the customer on a support chat that the order is not yet processed but the customer can verify that the card was already charged (CHARGED, not AUTHORIZED, which would be ok) releases very bad feelings.
It even could be considered as "fraud" in some cases - especially if the credit card was fully charged and no product was sent in a reasonable time period. There is a merchant code in the industry which says: Authorize if ordered but Charge if shipped -- Authorize means that banks reserves the funds for the order and individuals normally can not access the reserved funds until it is cleared by the merchant or the bank itself.

* 1-3 days business days handling times: Don't give customer expectations if you can not guarantee them. In my case it goes into the 4th day without shipping. This is clearly a violation of the terms that are described on the website. It doesn't matter if the shown time range is average. Customer will take it as you write it and rely on it.

I am still curious if the actual product will be as reported by so many users (missing or damaged parts, 2nd hand parts, used parts, etc) or if it will be as expected (new in box, everything included and working).

I will keep you posted.


Sep 23, 2009, 03:20 AM
What tree??.......Doh!!
Seahawk One's Avatar
Hey Andy,

I feel your pain.

First, I think perhaps you should have taken them up on picking it up yourself. But hey- I'm Monday morning quarter backing here.

I'd like to share with you my experience.

I ordered one of Banana's F-117 on Sept 8. I got the automated email same day where I could get my status updates. ETA 09.11.09. Cool I thought, I get to play with it on the weekend

True to their word, it takes em 1-3 days to get it into UPS's hands. On Sept 10 (that would be two days later), UPS tracking indicated "Exception, Rescheduled" for Tuesday Sept 15.

So be it.

It wasn't here for the weekend but hey- the 7th (day prior to my order) was a holiday. I finally got my 117 and she looks good. Happy as a clam. Flies decent. That experience wasn't too bad, wasn't perfect, wasn't super fast, but hey I didn't pay extra for expedited shipping. If I did, I'd have been pissed!

Soooooooooooooo- Sept 16, I've been drooling over their B2. Kit's available. Based on my last experience and like I said, wasn't too bad (there is a slight ding on one of my wings but hey- its FOAM, I kinda expect it- did I say "it's foam?" I'd have issues if it was torn or worst). But I digress.

I end up ordering the B2 on the 16th, figuring it will be out in a couple days. Same automated email as before. Tracking number provided two days later, on the 18th with delivery date of Sept 23, 2009. It's sat there with the following status "BILLING INFORMATION RECEIVED" until 10:06PM today By my count, that's 4 business days.

Whatever- I'm glad to see my package in UPS's hands as they are pretty predictable once it's in their system- that is the package, not just a tracking number. Rescheduled ETA- Friday Sept 25, 2009.

Maybe they have a billion orders. Or maybe there's just one person in their shipping department with a thousand orders to ship out and four hundred thousand to check in (Exceed F/A-18's and all the other out of stock foamies!)

Note tho- I'm not blaming or pointing my finger at Pete tho he hasn't answered any of my PM's but that's ok as I got the guys on the forum to help answer questions.

I am a bit flustered because during the same time frame I've ordered from Hobby Lobby, EJF (a big kit ordered on the 17th that came today), TWO orders from Hobby City (one from the US warehouse, and another from China or Hong Kong, or where ever they are. All of those I've recieved (doing my part in helping the economy). I have an order from Tower Hobbies that will be here in two days. Oh- I ordered some things from 6mmflyrc same time around when I ordered the F117 (came before the F117).

But wait- there's more!

WITH that SAID: I decided to also test out NitroPlanes I ordered some crap from them (crap is good). Long story short, placed order on Sunday 09.20.09, same/similar automated email reply as Banana (hmmmm), tracking number provided on Monday 09.21.09 with ETA Wednesday Sept 23, 2009. I was thinking, cool- a bit faster.


It has been in the same "BILLING INFORMATION RECEIVED" since Monday, it was supposed to be here at my home tomorrow....

But wait- there's more!!!

At 10:02PM today, UPS tracking has been updated indicating package is in their system OF COURSE with a revised estimated delivery date. Also THIS Friday Sept 25, 2009 as my B2.

Here are the things that make me go hmmmmmmm......

Both NP and BH use YAHOO stores. I'm not gonna say they are one and the same, I've read several statements from both that they are not the same nor are not related. But they do use the same e-store front.

I am wondering if that is HALF the problem. Like many products, there are some good, and bad. Hobby Lobby, Tower Hobbies, Hobby City/King etc etc do NOT use Yahell. As my post is getting as long as my deliveries (are taking), I'll not digress and speculate more on the yahoo system as I think we can hold business 400 classes to discuss on how to operate a business. I just found it interesting. Also, what is weird is that in the yahell tracking page it says the following:

Scheduled Delivery: Sep 23, 2009
Shipped to: SEATTLE, WA, US
Service Type: GROUND
Signed by:
Delivered to: BALDWIN PARK, CA, US
Date Delivered: Sep 22, 2009

Date delivered Sept 22 ?????? What's that mean? Did BH or NP go to a UPS drop off or distribution center (Baldwin Park) and drop off the packages? OMG- I hope not, but I can't explain how or why it would give a delivery date. Maybe, the tracking number was provided on one day and once its packed, labeled and what not- UPS finally gets it in their hands (hopefully they picked it up but now I just don't know....)

Again, not pointing fingers. I think there's a lot to learn here and the issues at hand shouldn't be Pete's issues to handle (assuming he isn't the one and only guy that orders the stuff we want from China, Tests em, creates videos- crashes a few- requested mods to manufacturers, test new stuff again- somehow finds time to read our crap on the forums, look at his co-workers wondering why he's taking the bad rap for their lack of experience/knowledge/care. Then he needs to figure out who to respond to, figure out if he even wants to read crap in his PM folders. Gawd forbid he's the one that packs everything up too! I just don't think he can do all that, nor should he be expected to. We need him for the other things. I hope his management can read posts like this. That is if the don't want/expect/plan to be a fly by night online hobby store. We've all got money to spend- they have profits to collect, but they are pinning everything on one guy. Least that's my opinion. I love the fact that they try tho. I mean, we get to stay on hold on the phone or in their "online chat" with people who (Gawd bless them) are simply not there for the hobby, just there for a job in an industry they simply don't know. Kudo's to them for coming back everyday and trying. BH management- man, w-t-h? how long is it going to be? how long is it going to take for you to realize your short comings?

Pete, bare with us, we need you (I saw you said something like considering of giving up). I think most of us know it's not so much (literally) you as the issue- Systems, business plan and focus need addressing by the higher ups. It's sloppy. Time for you to clean up your act as the holidays are right around the corner.

OK, I'll leave it at that, as I'm starting to get negative- I just hope that one day soon, companies like this can use information given to them that increases their profits, becomes a good household name, and ultimately creates happiness for the customers that have bought and want to spend more with.

I look forward to Friday. Andy, I hope after reading this, your package status is updated in a positive way.

Sadly, there is a another kit I'd love to have that BH has in stock. Ughhh

At the very least, they eventually ship out, so if I do end up ordering in the future, I just won't set any expectation on the delivery date and plan to have it two weeks later.


Sep 23, 2009, 09:48 AM
Registered User
Quick morning update:

UPS gave me the wrong information. They received the package yesterday and it is on the way, status changed to "OUT FOR DELIVERY. Yeah :-)

@Neil: I agree that Yahoo seems to be a weak part here. It might be a good option when you start, but once you established it is probably a good idea to invest in something bigger :-)

I am waiting for UPS to deliver my new plane :-)

More updates later.


Last edited by flyandi; Sep 23, 2009 at 12:04 PM.
Sep 23, 2009, 06:39 PM
Registered User
It arrived and guess what, UPS hasn't update the status yet.

Quick Update: At first glance, I noticed a few scratches outside on the packaging (probably made by UPS). Inside I found another box with the plane inside. The inner box had not the usual extra protection and fit very tight around the shipping packaging. Maybe they saved the extra protection because the delivery was local (LA area).

The inner box was already opened. I noticed that most parts where sealed in plastic while the canopy and the bombs were placed on the top without the usual protective plastic.

Attached some pictures which I quickly made with my iPhone - I apologize for the bad quality.

Conclusion: So far it looks promising - the Jet seems to be in a good condition (brand new). I will examine more tonight when I am back home.


Sep 23, 2009, 06:55 PM
What tree??.......Doh!!
Seahawk One's Avatar

Looks great and most importantly glad the F-15 has landed at it's new home!

Sep 24, 2009, 02:09 AM
Registered User
I just finished building the jet. Of course I couldn't wait and totally screwed up the plane (well not that bad). The main wings were the most complicated part of the plane. You need the glue them and the epoxy didn't want to bound. I carefully removed the wings again and sanded it. Then I used to much epoxy and I got epoxy fingerprints all over the plane. A total mess - Oh well - the wings are now mounted to the fuselage and secured with additional tape.

Overall it looks good, except of the many many fingerprints all over the fuselage and the wings. I haven't applied the decals yet, because I probably going to repaint it (the fingerprints are nasty).

But let's start from the beginning. The jet arrived completely sealed and no part was missing. It's a little bit odd, then the complete manual comes on a CD-ROM, but well - modern times! :-)

I checked the electronics after completing the plane. Everything was working fine but the stock TX/RX seems that they are not very sensitive - but no problem. I accidentally had the reverse mode on the throttle and after turning on the battery, I experienced a full blowing jet fan.

After aligning all control surfaces, I made a full check of all functions and also tested the motor. The motor is running a little bit funny, but I had it on very low settings. The servo's are a bit loud but well it is acceptable.

Overall I already love this plane. It looks good, has good scale size.

The next test will be the flight test. It is my first EDF and I was reading that this F-15 is a good entry plane into EDF jets. Any tips would be great :-)

I will write an summary once I completed the flight test.


Last edited by flyandi; Sep 25, 2009 at 01:39 AM.
Sep 24, 2009, 05:13 PM
What tree??.......Doh!!
Seahawk One's Avatar
double check, triple check CG. If anything be slightly forward, than aft if not spot on.

Many bench test the fans which can take up to a minute. Primarily to check power output/amp draw. Do you have access to the fan? always good to check the nut is tight/secure.

Are your throws within spec? You mentioned that you aligned it. I interpret take that as centered.

Sounds like you did it already- range check is always good. Also- look/listen for servo binding. They may be loud when you ask them to move. But if they are loud when your hands aren't on the controls- check those for binding or worst. Going to maiden with a bad servo is never good.

BTW, what do you mean by the motor is sounding funny? Hopefully not out of balance or off center. Should be pretty smooth, like a shop vac, except higher pitch and tons more avail rpms (compared to the vac). Maybe look for videos of this model, and listen to the motor when they taxi and the like. If it sounds the same, no worries- if it is different, check, recheck.

Looking forward, and G/L!
Sep 24, 2009, 11:14 PM
Registered User

Plane Crash :-(

Hi everyone,

Today is a sad day :-( The plane crashed during the first flight.

I fully charged the battery in the morning and I went to a near by park in the afternoon. I did a range check, everything worked fine. I did some test run's and taxied around a paved way in the park.

I performed different test runs on the motor including low/middle/high speed. Everything worked fine and had the right sound.

I double/triple checked all servo's and the control surface. I did some high speed taxi test to get the feeling for the jet. (hey the plane never took off during the test, like my T-28 would do - seems that the jet need a long runway to take-off).

I checked the wind - weather was clear, a bit smokey (CA Wild Fires) and sunny (as usual in California) - a kid and his father were following the action.

I put the plane into the direction of the wind and slowly pushed throttle to maximum. The jet responded quickly and it took a good distance to take off. WOW - great vertical - seriously the plane was taking off very nicely. I brought the plane on to a safe altitude and adjusted the controls.

Still - WOW - the jet is really easy to handle - it roll's perfectly and my centering of the control surfaces was nearly perfect - It flew straight - I had only to adjust the elevator a bit, but that's it. The jet is pretty loud, but I actually like that :-)

Now comes the sad part :-( After a few test in mid air with full thrust, I slowed down the plane a little bit and after about another 1min I suddenly didn't hear the strong noises anymore. The motor and/or servos stopped working.

The jet was pretty close to me and I tried to sail it down, but I guess the whole electronic failed -- after maybe 10-15s it slowed down so much that it went into a stall - straight down - recovered a little bit shortly before impact - but was too close to the ground already- IMPACT. The dad shouted: "Ohhh" and they quickly continued their walk.

Well, everyone can imagine what happened next. I ran to the plane and was about to cry - man - it looked really really bad. Foam debris everywhere.

I collected all the different pieces, put them in my car and went back to work - trying not to think about it.

So now I am back home and I tried to figure out what happened. I was reading in the forums before that some people had similar problems and crashed their planes.

I checked the battery - still 12.26V - checked the electronics -- the initial servo click/clack is coming up after about 20s wait time (after the battery is connected) and I hear even the "beep" from the ESC, but after 2s I hear another "beep" and again the servo "click/clack". That repeats every 2-5s now. It seems that the "board computer" is "restarting" all the time :-(

So, I have no idea what happened -- I don't believe that the motor has problems -- it seems more that the electronics malfunctioned after there were under full load.

It's a wonderful plane and seems to be really good quality. The impact was pretty hard, but only the front got completely damaged - the tail is intact.

I hope BH can help me to rebuild this wonderful piece of engineering. Well I will contact them tomorrow and see what they can do for me.

Type: F-15 Eagle Aggressor
Color: Blue Camo
Total Flight Time: ~2min
Accident Cause: Stall and ground impact after failure of board electronics.
Fatalities: 0 (1 injured)

Have a good night everyone.


@Smokey: Yeah, I checked the CG based on a reference I found here in the forum (original Freewing specifications).
Last edited by flyandi; Sep 25, 2009 at 01:38 AM.
Sep 24, 2009, 11:38 PM
Registered User
I sent an e-mail to BH with a request for an exchange because I believe that I received a plane with bad electronics.

Let's see what will happen.



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