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Jan 11, 2020, 09:24 AM
Space Coast USA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by solentlife
The problem with sites such as Battery University and tech papers of 'old' are technology evolves and the basics get changed - not a lot - but there is change. If you check out when the info was written ... its generally quite old.

One of the major changes in the cells is the composition of the electrolyte ... the 'plates' and how well it reconstitutes when charged.
Before anyone jumps on me - I know we are not talking Lead Acid wet jobs ... but the factors are still valid.

We see introduction of Nano Technology, despite many people poo-pooing Nano - it is still a change to the cells ... we now have LiHV versions pushing the LiPo to its max at 4.35V ... and so on. Even the Polymer used in some has been altered.

Now we basically sit with a general do it for all situation to cover the range.
I think it has been well proven that charging to levels less than 100% SOC increases cycle life.
Are you in disagreement with that?
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Jan 11, 2020, 12:28 PM
Youtube channel : solentlifeuk
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hoppy
I think it has been well proven that charging to levels less than 100% SOC increases cycle life.
Are you in disagreement with that?
Where did I disagree with that ?? Of course not.

And you know full well that any charge amount above max storage incurs penalty of cycle life - but incremental depending on level of charge ... so not charging to full will incur less damage to cycle life.

It may be better to reword it though ... "charging to levels less than 100% SOC increases incurs less reduction to cycle life than if you charge to full 100%"

Because all charging actually incurs cycle life costs ...

My post about old sites and info is purely to illustrate that many of such sites have not updated to keep up with new tech such as Nano and HV as example.
Jan 12, 2020, 12:39 AM
Quadaholic
--Oz--'s Avatar
That is exactly where HYPERION gets their extra capacity from (HV) and their total crummy reputation in life cycle from (40 cycles and their crap is ready for the trash can, grrrr)
Jan 12, 2020, 11:35 AM
Space Coast USA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by solentlife
It may be better to reword it though ... "charging to levels less than 100% SOC increases incurs less reduction to cycle life than if you charge to full 100%"

.

Or, "The lower the charge voltage level the more cycles the battery can deliver".
The table from the above reference:



Charge level *(V/cell)
Discharge cycles
Available stored energy **
Table 4: Discharge cycles and capacity as a function of charge voltage limit. Every 0.10V drop below 4.20V/cell doubles the cycle but holds less capacity. Raising the voltage above 4.20V/cell would shorten the life. The readings reflect regular Li-ion charging to 4.20V/cell.
Guideline: Every 70mV drop in charge voltage lowers the usable capacity by about 10%.

Note: Partial charging negates the benefit of Li-ion in terms of high specific energy.

* Similar life cycles apply for batteries with different voltage levels on full charge.

** Based on a new battery with 100% capacity when charged to the full voltage.
[4.30] [150250] [110115%] 4.25 200350 105110% 4.20 300500 100% 4.15 400700 9095% 4.10 6001,000 8590% 4.05 8501,500 8085% 4.00 1,2002,000 7075% 3.90 2,4004,000 6065% 3.80 See note 3540% 3.70 See note 30% and less
Jan 12, 2020, 11:40 AM
Space Coast USA
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Thread OP
Quote:
Originally Posted by solentlife
It may be better to reword it though ... "charging to levels less than 100% SOC increases incurs less reduction to cycle life than if you charge to full 100%"

.

Or, "The lower the charge voltage level the more cycles the battery can deliver".
The table from the above reference:
Jan 12, 2020, 11:41 AM
Youtube channel : solentlifeuk
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All assuming of course that the battery is being used within its designed power delivery limits ....

Which I think many of us can say we've been there - got the T Shirt !
Jan 12, 2020, 11:47 AM
Aspiring 3D pilot
TrueBuld's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by hoppy
Or, "The lower the charge voltage level the more cycles the battery can deliver".
The table from the above reference:



Charge level *(V/cell)
Discharge cycles
Available stored energy **
Table 4: Discharge cycles and capacity as a function of charge voltage limit. Every 0.10V drop below 4.20V/cell doubles the cycle but holds less capacity. Raising the voltage above 4.20V/cell would shorten the life. The readings reflect regular Li-ion charging to 4.20V/cell.
Guideline: Every 70mV drop in charge voltage lowers the usable capacity by about 10%.

Note: Partial charging negates the benefit of Li-ion in terms of high specific energy.

* Similar life cycles apply for batteries with different voltage levels on full charge.

** Based on a new battery with 100% capacity when charged to the full voltage.
[4.30] [150250] [110115%] 4.25 200350 105110% 4.20 300500 100% 4.15 400700 9095% 4.10 6001,000 8590% 4.05 8501,500 8085% 4.00 1,2002,000 7075% 3.90 2,4004,000 6065% 3.80 See note 3540% 3.70 See note 30% and less
That link does not work for me Hoppy ;(
Jan 12, 2020, 12:58 PM
Space Coast USA
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Thread OP
Quote:
Originally Posted by TrueBuld
That link does not work for me Hoppy ;(
Hmmmm works for me.
https://batteryuniversity.com/index....ased_batteries


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