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Apr 17, 2019, 02:22 AM
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Gluehand's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by marisd
Does it ring a bell with anyone here?
It won't identify the engine though, but the needle valve looks like an early Webra......
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Apr 17, 2019, 05:29 AM
Registered User
Looks post-war German with some late features. The bead blasted finish is a cost saving measure, so I could be wrong if it is "factory". Intake screams FOK to me.
Apr 17, 2019, 06:10 PM
Registered User

Mystery diesel


Some more clues. Crankshaft intake valve is timed for reverse running direction. Cylinder porting is similar to Webra Mach 1with radial exhausts and multiple internal transfer flutes in the bore. Piston has aluminium wrist pin yoke, threading into piston. There's a tiny brass grub screw on the side to stop it from unwinding. Steel conrod with bronze big end bush. The steel ring over front bearing housing is there as support over cracked crankcase wall at the front. Unfortunately front ball race is a sloppy rattle fit now, so not a runner, despite excellent fits otherwise.

NVA is in two pieces, threaded into crankcase, not a known commercially make. Spinner threads onto front prop washer a bit like the Schlosser 2.5. Three holes in spinner for tightening are drilled at 45 degrees to shaft axis. Go figure!
Apr 18, 2019, 12:57 AM
Registered User
edholly's Avatar

Unusual throttle on a pair of AM's


Never seen these types of throttle before.

The one on the green head AM10 works pretty good - 10.800 down to 5,500 . It is a barrel inside a tube and the barrel slides horizontally across. Full throttle is when the holes line up and throttled when the holes are mis-aligned. It has a vernier adjustment with a screw at one end and the actuator hole the other end. Wouldn't be that easy to rig up as would probably need a bell-crank to activate it. The photo shows the holes as though the barrel has rotated - that is not the case it only slides left and right.


The one on the blue headed AM15 works by having a flat area around the needle valve that rotates - full throttle the flat is vertical, throttled the flat is horizontal thereby choking off the intake. The nva has a hole drilled either side. But as diesels require very little air passage .... when throttled closed .... it only knocks off a couple of thousand revs. Mind you my PAW 06 throttle doesn't do much better !

Has anyone seen these before ?
Last edited by edholly; Apr 18, 2019 at 04:42 AM.
Apr 18, 2019, 02:14 AM
I like real wooden aeroplanes!
Sundancer's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by edholly

Just noticed have spelt unusual incorrectly - but can't edit it ...
To edit either headings or attachments Ed, select "Edit" then select "Go advanced", you will then be able to edit your heading.
Apr 20, 2019, 08:48 PM
Alpha Whisky
AlphaWhisky's Avatar

ED Bee - r/c


Many moths ago I dabbled with fitting an Enya r/c carb to an ED Racer and the result was very good - good enough to consider installing into an airframe and flying. May still do that one day ...

Following that experiment, some months ago I wondered if it would be possible to do the same exercise with an old ED Bee.. Initial dabbling was not very successful so that exercise went on the back burner while I pursued other modelling avenues.

Last week I got the old Bee out again. This morning we ran it in its normal configuration. It ran just fine so we replaced the backplate for the one altered with the ex-PAW 80 r/c carb fitted.

It wasn`t too long before we got it running.... Although it throttled up and down, it wasn`t really very exciting. I took a few pics of it going and then we packed everything away as the weather turned bad.

Conclusion ...? Unlike the earlier ED Racer experiment, this one doesn`t really appeal to pursue further. I have a soft spot for the ED Bee - it was the first engine I owned as a kid back in the 1950`s. I still get enjoyment in flying them in simple stick n' tissue models, but I really don`t think it has much future as a throttled R/C engine ......

And now back to the building board ...

Alan W
Apr 20, 2019, 08:55 PM
Alpha Whisky
AlphaWhisky's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by AlphaWhisky
Many moths ago I dabbled with fitting an Enya r/c carb to an ED Racer and the result was very good - good enough to consider installing into an airframe and flying. May still do that one day ...

Following that experiment, some months ago I wondered if it would be possible to do the same exercise with an old ED Bee.. Initial dabbling was not very successful so that exercise went on the back burner while I pursued other modelling avenues.

Last week I got the old Bee out again. This morning we ran it in its normal configuration. It ran just fine so we replaced the backplate for the one altered with the ex-PAW 80 r/c carb fitted.

It wasn`t too long before we got it running.... Although it throttled up and down, it wasn`t really very exciting. I took a few pics of it going and then we packed everything away as the weather turned bad.

Conclusion ...? Unlike the earlier ED Racer experiment, this one doesn`t really appeal to pursue further. I have a soft spot for the ED Bee - it was the first engine I owned as a kid back in the 1950`s. I still get enjoyment in flying them in simple stick n' tissue models, but I really don`t think it has much future as a throttled R/C engine ......

And now back to the building board ...

Alan W
I seem to have had a problem attaching pics - I`ll try again ...
Apr 21, 2019, 12:06 PM
Registered User
krafty's Avatar
The carb position in the picture of the running Bee is 90 degrees rotated from the picture of the static Bee. The static Bee has the normal position for the carb. Was this intentional?
Apr 21, 2019, 02:20 PM
Single-task at best...
tim hooper's Avatar
I know I posted this a few months ago (before flight testing), so forgive any repetition, please!

I retro-fitted a homemade carb to this 1947 ED mkII, using a length of tx, aerial as an inlet duct. It's soft-soldered to a nut which screws onto the inlet spigot on the rear of the cylinder. The carb is epoxied into the other end. I had to reduce the inlet to 4mm diameter before it would suck fuel - that's the green plastic tube.

In practice this lash-up works far better than I ever hoped. I don't have a tacho, but the engine slows enough to let the model to taxy across the grass to the strip to the runway.

In flight, the engine burbles into a 4-stroke as the throttle is reduced, and resumes 2-stroking as the throttle is opened again.

I'm very pleased!

Tim
Apr 21, 2019, 02:33 PM
Registered User
JMP_blackfoot's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by tim hooper
In practice this lash-up works far better than I ever hoped. I don't have a tacho, but the engine slows enough to let the model to taxy across the grass to the strip to the runway.
In flight, the engine burbles into a 4-stroke as the throttle is reduced, and resumes 2-stroking as the throttle is opened again.
I'm very pleased! Tim
I have the same experience with an Enya 09 throttle adaptation to my CS Deezil. Very nice engine with surprisingly good throttling. I cut the intake tube and turned down the end to fit either the original spraybar or the Enya carb.
Last edited by JMP_blackfoot; Apr 21, 2019 at 09:55 PM.
Apr 21, 2019, 04:28 PM
Alpha Whisky
AlphaWhisky's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by krafty
The carb position in the picture of the running Bee is 90 degrees rotated from the picture of the static Bee. The static Bee has the normal position for the carb. Was this intentional?
No - didn`t consider that. The pic of the static Bee was taken a while back and experiment in this condition not successful. I converted the engine back to regular cofiguration and test-ran it a few times this past weekend just to prove it was OK. We then swapped the backplates over out at the flying site and fitted the carb with the needle in the vertical position just to match the regular setup.

As mentioned in the report, it worked inasmuch that the engine throttled up and down, but idle was not reliable and I decided not to pursue it further. Next experiment along these lines may well involve a Mills 1.30 ...?

Alan W
Apr 21, 2019, 07:32 PM
ffkiwi
Quote:
Originally Posted by AlphaWhisky
No - didn`t consider that. The pic of the static Bee was taken a while back and experiment in this condition not successful. I converted the engine back to regular cofiguration and test-ran it a few times this past weekend just to prove it was OK. We then swapped the backplates over out at the flying site and fitted the carb with the needle in the vertical position just to match the regular setup.

As mentioned in the report, it worked inasmuch that the engine throttled up and down, but idle was not reliable and I decided not to pursue it further. Next experiment along these lines may well involve a Mills 1.30 ...?

Alan W
I think the intake timing would be a long way off with the backplate in the position shown on the test stand-which might well explain the indifferent results....you did yourself no favours at all setting it up like that.....

ChrisM
'ffkiwi'
Apr 22, 2019, 01:38 AM
RoyalAustralianEasyMoneyE arner
Alan bring it out next time we catch up and well play with the position of the backplate, Id like to see if it makes a difference

Ill be in touch
Cheers

Quote:
Originally Posted by AlphaWhisky
No - didn`t consider that. The pic of the static Bee was taken a while back and experiment in this condition not successful. I converted the engine back to regular cofiguration and test-ran it a few times this past weekend just to prove it was OK. We then swapped the backplates over out at the flying site and fitted the carb with the needle in the vertical position just to match the regular setup.

As mentioned in the report, it worked inasmuch that the engine throttled up and down, but idle was not reliable and I decided not to pursue it further. Next experiment along these lines may well involve a Mills 1.30 ...?

Alan W
Apr 23, 2019, 07:00 AM
Alpha Whisky
AlphaWhisky's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by ffkiwi
I think the intake timing would be a long way off with the backplate in the position shown on the test stand-which might well explain the indifferent results....you did yourself no favours at all setting it up like that.....

ChrisM
'ffkiwi'
OK Chris. I`m happier playing with airframes than the intracacies of engines so don`t really know ...? I would have thought that as the inlet setup on the disc on the inner face of the backplate is permanently related to the pin on the back of the crankshaft it wouldn`t really matter which of the four possible fixing positions of the backplate was selected.

How would you suggest we proceed with this, and why...?

Alan W
Apr 23, 2019, 10:09 AM
Sticks, Tissue & old Diesels
brokenenglish's Avatar
Hi Alan, the only thing you need to do to "proceed" is to restore the backplate to its proper orientation.
To answer your question, the aperture in the disc allows mixture to be sucked into the crankcase when that aperture is aligned with the carburettor tube. But, for this to happen, the valve has to be open when there is a partial vacuum in the crankcase, and not when there is pressure in the crankcase. i.e. the disc valve must be open when the piston is at the top of its stroke (suction into crankcase) and not when the piston is at the bottom of its stroke, because the crankcase pressure that's blowing mixture up the transfer port would also prevent mixture induction if the inlet valve were open. On your ED Bee, proper backplate orientation ensures that the inlet valve opens at the right time (when the piston is "up").
I'm not sure that's very well explained, but the bottom line is that rotating the backplate results in the inlet valve being opened at different piston positions, and only the proper "piston up" position will allow the engine to run as it should.
Last edited by brokenenglish; Apr 23, 2019 at 01:00 PM.


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