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Old Jul 17, 2011, 10:44 PM
Specializing in RC since 1972
Temple, GA, USA
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Originally Posted by Prof100 View Post
Where on this this thread is there a list of recommended modifications to make this plane a reliable and fun plane. I have the Skysurfer figured out and modified / improved a couple of them?

My plan is to use a MicroDan 2505 2535 KV motor with a 6x4 APC sport prop.

--ESC with be a 40 amp Hobbywing switchmode BEC because I have it in stock.

--Servos will be HXT900 because I have plenty of them in stock as well.

I will look at the hinging of the new AXN as well as the control horns and clevises and changes if they they look weak.

Is the spar sufficient for the plane when you increase the power system? If yes, that's good, but if not what's the standard fix?

Thanks in advance for your advice.

Bill
Make sure the spar caps are glued on well. Use a 6x4 (I use a 6x3.5) prop. Important to buy a standard 3mm (I like collet style) prop adapter. The stock one just doesn't work right on a pusher setup. Use a 3S 2200 LiPo for proper balance. You may have to trim the battery compartment 1mm or 2mm wider. (Eventually) Adjust your aileron linkages for more throw and set your aileron rates as high as possible (over 100%). Maybe mix a little rudder into the ailerons for a faster roll.

The spar is a monster compared to the Bixler. I would estimate it is 10x stronger. No need to change it.

Do something to hold the wings in. They will eventually be loose enough to cause a problem. Even tape will work for this.

Use the glue that comes with it. It works. It stays flexible, but takes a whole day or two to dry well. I have seen a (crystalized) CA'ed horizontal come off in flight, but not one glued with the stock glue.

Motor magnets will come loose eventually. Just glue them back in (CA or even Shoe Goo etc.). Careful to put them in the way they came out and not backwards. Servos may come loose. Neither of the two I saw come loose (elevator and aileron) caused serious flight problems.

Remove your linkages and pre-flex all control surfaces like the SS but easier.

You may need to replace the ESC. The old 20a ESC's would burn up after 1 to 100 flights. The new 25a's may be better. I mounted my ESC outside on the black canopy by cutting two slits, a big one that the ESC can go through, and a small one that only the battery connector needs to go through.

AJ had some bad luck with servos, but I have not seen any failures in the several ships that I see regularly. May be good batch bad batch thing. YMMV. The servos look like SG-90's (they're blue too) in mine.

Mine will still go straight up (barely) in the first minute of a fresh battery on the stock motor and an MA 6x3.5 prop. That is the only prop I have used other than stock. My motor tachs 19,700. At that speed, you really need a well balanced prop. I can run 10 minutes WOT, cut and land immediately and the motor (even the core via the base) is barely warm. I estimate 60mph / 100kph top speed.

My two year old is still stock except for the ESC, prop and prop adapter. Even the hinges are the stock foam.

It acts like a trainer with a 2S LiPo. With a 3S you need to launch at 60% power with a firm toss angled up a little.

Beginners out there should know that you should fly at 60% power if you have a 3S LiPo, or it will get away from you like a big block Vette with a 16 year old behind the gas pedal, and speed makes crashes expensive.

Cliff
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Old Jul 17, 2011, 10:49 PM
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Rtlee117's Avatar
United States, NC, Lincolnton
Joined Jan 2011
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Spare Parts?

I wanted to say thanks again to all those who helped me with the ideas for wing retention.

Now I have another question. Does anyone know a reliable place to get spare parts? I've done a few faceplants and would like to get another fuselage and maybe a wing. Any help would be greatly appreciated.
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Old Jul 17, 2011, 10:52 PM
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Canton, Michigan USA
Joined Jul 2007
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Originally Posted by theothercliff View Post
Make sure the spar caps are glued on well. Use a 6x4 (I use a 6x3.5) prop. Important to buy a standard 3mm (I like collet style) prop adapter. The stock one just doesn't work right on a pusher setup. Use a 3S 2200 LiPo for proper balance. You may have to trim the battery compartment 1mm or 2mm wider. (Eventually) Adjust your aileron linkages for more throw and set your aileron rates as high as possible (over 100%). Maybe mix a little rudder into the ailerons for a faster roll.

The spar is a monster compared to the Bixler. I would estimate it is 10x stronger. No need to change it.

Motor magnets will come loose eventually. Just glue them back in (CA or even Shoe Goo etc.). Careful to put them in the way they came out and not backwards. Servos may come loose. Neither of the two I saw come loose (elevator and aileron) caused serious flight problems.

Remove your linkages and pre-flex all control surfaces like the SS but easier.

You may need to replace the ESC. The old 20a ESC's would burn up after 1 to 100 flights. The new 25a's may be better. I mounted my ESC outside on the black canopy by cutting two slits, a big one that the ESC can go through, and a small one that only the battery connector needs to go through.

AJ had some bad luck with servos, but I have not seen any failures in the several ships that I see regularly. May be good batch bad batch thing. YMMV. The servos look like SG-90's (they're blue too) in mine.

Mine will still go straight up (barely) in the first minute of a fresh battery on the stock motor and an MA 6x3.5 prop. My motor tachs 19,700. That is the only prop I have used other than stock. I can run 10 minutes WOT, cut and land immediately and the motor (even the core via the base) is barely warm. I estimate 60mph / 100kph top speed.

Mine is still stock except for the ESC, prop and prop adapter. Even the hinges are the stock foam.

Cliff
Cliff,

Thanks, great tips. I will try the stock motor and maybe even pre glue the magnet with thin CA before assembly. Since mine is the ARF I will be using HXT900s. Flexing the foam hinges is a must for me and this class of plane, but you are reinforcing the need.

Bill
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Old Jul 17, 2011, 11:02 PM
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Australia, VIC, Melbourne
Joined Jan 2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rtlee117 View Post
I wanted to say thanks again to all those who helped me with the ideas for wing retention.

Now I have another question. Does anyone know a reliable place to get spare parts? I've done a few faceplants and would like to get another fuselage and maybe a wing. Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Try to pick up the body only version from either HK or Lowpricerc

http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/s...otor_ARF_.html

or

http://www.lowpricerc.com/product_in...roducts_id=749

they are both under $40 and I think the HK US warehouse has them (backorder) also. Also consider just using the hot water treatment
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Old Jul 17, 2011, 11:11 PM
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United States, NC, Lincolnton
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Originally Posted by mutha View Post
Try to pick up the body only version from either HK or Lowpricerc

http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/s...otor_ARF_.html

or

http://www.lowpricerc.com/product_in...roducts_id=749

they are both under $40 and I think the HK US warehouse has them (backorder) also. Also consider just using the hot water treatment
Yeah, thats what I had found. I just dont wanna spend $80 (with shipping) for just a new fuselage and a wing. I would have tired the hot water thing but I didnt know about it before I glued things back together and I have been told once you glue them the hot water doesnt work.
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Old Jul 18, 2011, 12:27 AM
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Australia, VIC, Melbourne
Joined Jan 2011
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Originally Posted by Rtlee117 View Post
Yeah, thats what I had found. I just dont wanna spend $80 (with shipping) for just a new fuselage and a wing. I would have tired the hot water thing but I didnt know about it before I glued things back together and I have been told once you glue them the hot water doesnt work.
Depends on what you have glued .... I have had mine in tatters glued it then hot watered it (using epoxy glue) and got it to look like earlier pictures I have uploaded ... see the flaps vid I did ...
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Old Jul 18, 2011, 03:17 AM
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Lincoln, CA
Joined Oct 2006
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Originally Posted by Rtlee117 View Post
Yeah, thats what I had found. I just dont wanna spend $80 (with shipping) for just a new fuselage and a wing. I would have tired the hot water thing but I didnt know about it before I glued things back together and I have been told once you glue them the hot water doesnt work.
For the most part, that is true. if you can gently re-break the parts at the exact fracture, you can get some of the shape back. But, not much. sorry you didn't find out about Elapor Soup earlier.
AJ
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Old Jul 19, 2011, 08:58 AM
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Thompson, Ohio
Joined Mar 2007
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Amen to regluing the spar covers. I had one I noticed coming loose so reglued it a couple weeks ago. Other side looked fine, but a couple days ago I noticed it along with the spar hanging down and before I could land it all of a sudden my little cloud fly just augered in.

Broke in half right behind motor and split the nose...Nothing that can't be fixed. Kind of ironic I just read your post after it happened. Guess everyone should reglue to play it safe like you said... I am an example of what may happen if you don't.....
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Old Jul 19, 2011, 09:52 AM
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Finally my 2212/6 new motor arrived...

I unglued the motor support and cutted the stock motor cables (wich was some painfull after all fun that little motor has given)

Any advise on how to bolt the new motor there? Should i use the X mount or should i bolt the motor directly to the support.. (using the X mount would require trimming out some of the stock motor mount or using a different way for the cables

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Old Jul 19, 2011, 01:55 PM
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Canada, ON, Toronto
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Originally Posted by JLT_GTI View Post
Finally my 2212/6 new motor arrived...

I unglued the motor support and cutted the stock motor cables (wich was some painfull after all fun that little motor has given)

Any advise on how to bolt the new motor there? Should i use the X mount or should i bolt the motor directly to the support.. (using the X mount would require trimming out some of the stock motor mount or using a different way for the cables

I used # 4 wood screws ( I think 3/8 in length) - only two will fit - but it works great. I check for looseness after every flight to be sure but no issue at all.
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Old Jul 19, 2011, 02:02 PM
Specializing in RC since 1972
Temple, GA, USA
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Originally Posted by JLT_GTI View Post
Finally my 2212/6 new motor arrived...

I unglued the motor support and cutted the stock motor cables (wich was some painfull after all fun that little motor has given)

Any advise on how to bolt the new motor there? Should i use the X mount or should i bolt the motor directly to the support.. (using the X mount would require trimming out some of the stock motor mount or using a different way for the cables

Bolting the motor directly to the support would require getting longer screws and very carefully cutting them to exactly the correct length to keep from screwing them in too far and cutting the motor windings, but if the black plastic mount is thin enough for the current screws to work, that would be OK, but not removable without cutting things up.

I would probably trim the flange off the black plastic motor mount and glue a larger piece of plywood on to allow me to bolt the X mount on correctly. Glue type is important. I would use a flexible foam glue and let it dry for 2 days, not epoxy and probably not CA. For that matter, it looks like you have the black plastic mount removed. I would just glue the plywood to the airplane unless the plastic mount in between would make the glue joint stronger.

It would even be reasonable to trim off the X mount tips and glue the X mount to the black plastic mount with the same flexible glue. Remember to bolt the motor on the X mount FIRST!

Full disclosure. I have not done this.

Cliff
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Old Jul 19, 2011, 03:00 PM
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[QUOTE=theothercliff;18804595]Bolting the motor directly to the support would require getting longer screws and very carefully cutting them to exactly the correct length to keep from screwing them in too far and cutting the motor windings, but if the black plastic mount is thin enough for the current screws to work, that would be OK, but not removable without cutting things up.
[quote]

The problem is that if i use the X support , either glued or bolted to the stock motor mount.. it still neds to be glued back to the fuselage and it will still need to be cutted out in case of replacement.. basically i cant think of a way of installing any motor support that allows bolting and unbolting without having to cut or de-glue anythinh out of the fuselage.. im open to any ideas here.. tought granted motor replacement or extraction should be rare and far between.. actually this is the first time i remove the support voluntarelly (it was loose some months ago so i glued it back) and after installing this new motor , unless something goes wrong or the motor is bad , it shouldnt be removed in a long time to come..
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Old Jul 19, 2011, 04:08 PM
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The Netherlands, LI, Gennep
Joined Feb 2011
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may I give a suggestion regarding your motor mount?

I would try to use TWO towerpro mounts.

One screwed onto the motor, one screwed onto the mount. Opposite to another.
Finally you can use a small metal tube (1 cm) with which you can mount the pair together.
Is this understandable? (enclosed a picture of what I am trying to say)
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Old Jul 19, 2011, 07:31 PM
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North Dakota
Joined Apr 2010
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USA warehouse

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rtlee117 View Post
I wanted to say thanks again to all those who helped me with the ideas for wing retention.

Now I have another question. Does anyone know a reliable place to get spare parts? I've done a few faceplants and would like to get another fuselage and maybe a wing. Any help would be greatly appreciated.
They are in stock at USA warehouse...$60 to your door but hurry, as stock seems to run out fast on a lot of items and takes forever to replinish.
( The old slow boat from China deal )
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Old Jul 19, 2011, 08:09 PM
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Canton, Michigan USA
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Ordered the ARF from Hobbyking USA on July 5th. I had to get on line with HKing in Hong Kong to trace it. It was finally picked and packed today. STILL NO SHIPPING NOTICE. 14 days to pick and pack is ridiculous. I am picturing some small garage with one guy working part time shipping HK parts and planes. He must have been on vacation for the first two weeks of July. Geeze, what a bush league operation.
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