Espritmodel.com Telemetry Radio
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Old Oct 24, 2008, 04:55 AM
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Christchurch, New Zealand
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DSM2 transmitters always take much longer than a DX6 to bind an AR6000; they have to be sure they're not going to get the bind message from a DSM2 RX, so they wait a bit longer than a DSM2 receiver's maximum scan time before switching to DSM1 mode.
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Old Oct 24, 2008, 09:25 PM
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Southwest Ohio USA
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More fun with computer radios:

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showt...t=elektron+400

Buzz
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Old Oct 24, 2008, 09:42 PM
Dave North
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USA, CA, San Jose
Joined Apr 2004
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Some of that looks awfully familiar doesn't it? At least all the functions sorta worked... (I remember how freaky it was to figure out you had to reverse the flaps on the 6102 if you had to reverse the ailerons... )


Dave
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Old Oct 24, 2008, 10:00 PM
sKrude up, Rejected!
DogFly.'s Avatar
United States, CA, Santa Barbara
Joined Jun 2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Andrew McGregor
DSM2 transmitters always take much longer than a DX6 to bind an AR6000; they have to be sure they're not going to get the bind message from a DSM2 RX, so they wait a bit longer than a DSM2 receiver's maximum scan time before switching to DSM1 mode.
Hi Andrew,
Thanks for the info, I'm still curious, my friends dx7 has no delay when using ar6000's
Dave.
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Old Oct 25, 2008, 05:51 PM
Dave North
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USA, CA, San Jose
Joined Apr 2004
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Fix For Elevon Routines

Found a fix for the Elevon problems (fixes them all, I think).

This is slightly complicated, but bear with me. In the end, you get everything working plus a bonus feature at the cost of only one mix.

First, plug your right servo into the aileron plug and your left servo into Aux 1 (the Flap plug). I've only tried this on one plane, so I don't know if those might be reversed in some setups.

Then set your Wing Type to Dual Ailerons. Now check your aileron control -- it should work normally for an elevon plane (elevator is not yet working). If it doesn't, you'll probably end up having to reverse your plugs to make things work right.

Next, go to Mix 1 and set Elev -> Flap with both rates (D & U) at 100%. In my case that was -100%, but you may have to use +100 percent in your setup. Check function; at this point it should look like an Elevon plane with a boatload of travel. Don't fret about that -- the extra travel will "fix" your trim buttons! And don't forget to set "Trim" to ACT in the lower right corner of this screen.

Now, if you want differential it should work perfectly. If it goes in the wrong direction, you'll have to back up and reverse the plugs (move the servo in Ail to Aux and vice-versa) and redo the other settings to reverse them. Ultimately it means you'll have all the function back at the cost of a single mix.

But you get some payback for that mix: your Flap switch will now work! Probably the best use for it on an elevon plane is adjusting the elevons to max glide duration in case you want to do some thermals and don't want to try and see what the little bugger is doing at 400 feet...

Undoubtedly your elevon travel will now be too great. If you go to Dual Rates and reduce your top rate down at least to 80% of full, your trim buttons will now be completely safe to use -- the endpoint travel will not be greater than your allowed travel, so the weird "button effects" go away.

As far as I can tell, this is a complete fix. Would be delighted to hear if anyone hits a snag... also this leaves the option of another mix open (if you're using rudder and want a mix, or wish to do a throttle -> "flap" mix to get the torque roll out, for example).


Dave
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Old Oct 25, 2008, 06:33 PM
Richard Cox
Thousand Oaks, CA
Joined Dec 2003
648 Posts
Thanks for the research, Dave. I don't have a DX6i, but a fellow at the field has one for his Stryker, and we all scratched our heads when we saw what the elevons were doing. Exactly what you described!. I'll point him to this post.

Speaking of wierd programming, the DX5E has a different fault. I started a thread here, but basically, the reversing switches operate AFTER the mixing. Thus there is no way short of changing linkage to get elevons to operate correctly. I have not fully investigated the trim issues. Since there is no EPA, sub-trim or custom mixing, you are stuck with their less-than-useful mixing feature. I guess that's what you get for $100.

Spektrum must have different guys doing the code for each product, and they are not pilots! And nobody is testing the products before they are released.
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Old Oct 25, 2008, 07:01 PM
Dave North
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USA, CA, San Jose
Joined Apr 2004
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Cox
...the reversing switches operate AFTER the mixing. Thus there is no way short of changing linkage to get elevons to operate correctly.
I'm having troublie picturing it, so I'll just ask to be sure: exchaging the plugs in the receiver won't do it?
Quote:
Spektrum must have different guys doing the code for each product, and they are not pilots! And nobody is testing the products before they are released.
It sure looks that way! I'd be kind of embarrassed to release stuff in this state, so I guess maybe there are some folks at SpektrumHorizonHobby that aren't all that happy right now.


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Old Oct 26, 2008, 03:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by timocharis
I'm having troublie picturing it, so I'll just ask to be sure: exchaging the plugs in the receiver won't do it?
In his case the Rx has no servo plugs to swap. It is an integrated Rx with linear servos on a single board.
--
Steve
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Old Oct 26, 2008, 10:50 AM
Dave North
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USA, CA, San Jose
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No wonder I couldn't "picture" it! Argh. Now that's a nasty problem.


Dave
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Old Oct 27, 2008, 01:30 PM
Richard Cox
Thousand Oaks, CA
Joined Dec 2003
648 Posts
Even with a receiver and standard servos, the problem is not cured. If the servos go the opposite direction with elevator input, swapping them doesn't help.
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Old Oct 27, 2008, 09:59 PM
sKrude up, Rejected!
DogFly.'s Avatar
United States, CA, Santa Barbara
Joined Jun 2008
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Well I found a cure for my dx6i, I bought a dx7, now I just have to learn the programming, program my planes in, and bind them!
I wish there was an easier way to move my models over .
Dave.
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Old Mar 07, 2009, 03:32 PM
Go ahead... Build it to crash!
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Conroe, TX
Joined Apr 2007
2,630 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by timocharis
Found a fix for the Elevon problems (fixes them all, I think).

This is slightly complicated, but bear with me. In the end, you get everything working plus a bonus feature at the cost of only one mix.

First, plug your right servo into the aileron plug and your left servo into Aux 1 (the Flap plug). I've only tried this on one plane, so I don't know if those might be reversed in some setups.

Then set your Wing Type to Dual Ailerons. Now check your aileron control -- it should work normally for an elevon plane (elevator is not yet working). If it doesn't, you'll probably end up having to reverse your plugs to make things work right.

Next, go to Mix 1 and set Elev -> Flap with both rates (D & U) at 100%. In my case that was -100%, but you may have to use +100 percent in your setup. Check function; at this point it should look like an Elevon plane with a boatload of travel. Don't fret about that -- the extra travel will "fix" your trim buttons! And don't forget to set "Trim" to ACT in the lower right corner of this screen.

Now, if you want differential it should work perfectly. If it goes in the wrong direction, you'll have to back up and reverse the plugs (move the servo in Ail to Aux and vice-versa) and redo the other settings to reverse them. Ultimately it means you'll have all the function back at the cost of a single mix.

But you get some payback for that mix: your Flap switch will now work! Probably the best use for it on an elevon plane is adjusting the elevons to max glide duration in case you want to do some thermals and don't want to try and see what the little bugger is doing at 400 feet...

Undoubtedly your elevon travel will now be too great. If you go to Dual Rates and reduce your top rate down at least to 80% of full, your trim buttons will now be completely safe to use -- the endpoint travel will not be greater than your allowed travel, so the weird "button effects" go away.

As far as I can tell, this is a complete fix. Would be delighted to hear if anyone hits a snag... also this leaves the option of another mix open (if you're using rudder and want a mix, or wish to do a throttle -> "flap" mix to get the torque roll out, for example).


Dave
Thank you thank you thank you. This fixed it for me. I found that reversing the ail/flap channel plugs did not reverse servo direction, so I just reversed both channels in the tx and that worked fine. It's nice to see the full and balanced throws again.
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Old Mar 07, 2009, 05:26 PM
Dave North
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USA, CA, San Jose
Joined Apr 2004
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fuegodeth
This fixed it for me. I found that reversing the ail/flap channel plugs did not reverse servo direction, so I just reversed both channels in the tx and that worked fine. It's nice to see the full and balanced throws again.
Great! Jazzed me too when I found it.

I think what you did is the only way to reverse the servo direction. The only reason to reverse the plugs is to get differential to work correctly iirc.


Dave
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Old Apr 02, 2009, 09:37 PM
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Dave - thank you SO much for posting this thread. I was about to throw my Dx6i out the window tonight, but I thought I should jump on RCG to find out if anyone else was having the strange elevon issue. Low and behold, I found your post! Thanks for the step-by-step instructions on how to resolve the issue.. you've saved me a lot of time and headache! Great job.
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Old Apr 02, 2009, 10:34 PM
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Nebraska USA
Joined Mar 2008
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I've put over 100 flights with my DX6i/elevon planes over the past year and noticed these symptoms, but just tried to ignore them with some subdued cursing under my breath. I just came across this thread and wanted to add my THANKS!, Dave, for putting me onto the path of redemption. Great work! Also, thanks to MinneFlyer for bringing this thread back up.

Hey, Spektrum, you owe Dave for his Beta-testing - how about a firmware upgrade?
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