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Old May 02, 2012, 05:59 AM
It only takes one good idea
dag214's Avatar
Fishers, Indiana
Joined Oct 2004
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bdelapen View Post
ok, here's a quick, no-frills edit of some of the footage from the emaselle at seff.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=doxyv5m8kka

enjoy!

- birger
kewl!!!!!!!!!

dag
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Last edited by dag214; May 02, 2012 at 07:58 AM.
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Old May 02, 2012, 06:10 AM
It only takes one good idea
dag214's Avatar
Fishers, Indiana
Joined Oct 2004
5,820 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by kgfly View Post
Great photos and videos, thanks for sharing them.

I started off confused by several of the stills at the start of the Emmaselle video in that the plane was heavily banked one way but the ailerons were clearly set for the opposite roll direction. It was only when I saw the moving images that the graceful slow motion reactions of the plane made sense of those stills. There is a lot of inertia and it takes time for the torque from the ailerons to take affect. Fascinating to watch
The Emmaselle is a fun plane to fly, and it is hard to measure ones talent as a pilot.

Last year I let a buddy of mine (who is a good 3D pilot) fly her, he stated that the Emmaselle scared the sh_t out of him. He said it was the hardest plane to fly he had ever seen. After that he started calling my Chuck (Chuck Yeager), as he feels he was one of the best test pilots. He said the Emmaselle did not climb at all, he stated that it always took full inputs to get it to turn, and he said he thought it was always going to stall.

To be honest I believe he has become so accustom to over powered planes and light wing loads that he has actually forgotten some of his pilot skills. The Emmaselle does fly like a truck, if you are not a rudder pilot you may crash her. But as the reincarnated barn-stormer I am, her and I fit just right together.

You have to lead her into everything you want her to do, and always stay about 5 seconds ahead of her. But to me, she is one of the funnest and most beautiful planes I have ever had.

Rock ON!!!!!!

DAG
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Old May 02, 2012, 06:21 AM
It only takes one good idea
dag214's Avatar
Fishers, Indiana
Joined Oct 2004
5,820 Posts
Now for 36 info.

Work has me slammed until this weekend. I hope to get the fuse flipped back onto her back to I can work on the #3 and 4 nacelle bottoms. Once that is done I will be set to get back to the wiring and getting all my electrical systems done.

DAG
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Old May 02, 2012, 07:27 AM
Registered User
Indianapolis, IN
Joined Oct 2010
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Nice work, what field do you fly at here in the Indy Area? I wouldn't mind coming to see the B-36 when it takes flight as well as the Emmaselle.
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Old May 02, 2012, 07:53 AM
Flutter-Bys are fun
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United States, MI, Honor
Joined Dec 2005
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Dag,
The photos of the B-36 sitting on the ground at SEFF show just how big and glourious it looks. All the flight surfaces on her, cones set out to keep people from walking into her, and the looks on some of the faces as they gaze upon the B-36, are just great.

What a show. I could immagine her sitting there in all her silver glory. Now she will be something to see, all that silver, going to be a sight to see.

I have watched every video of SEFF, you put on a great show with the Emmaselle.

Conehead
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Old May 02, 2012, 01:11 PM
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United States, FL, The Villages
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You shoulda been there! MUCH more impressive in person.
Don
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Old May 02, 2012, 02:15 PM
Too much to do not enough time
BobaFett1138's Avatar
Wisconsin
Joined Sep 2010
273 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by dag214 View Post
Yep, That was my Emmaselle. Was a very hot couple of days, but a good turn out.

Thanks, Dag
Ah, that explains it. She's absolutely beautiful in the air! Very impressive plane, glad I could see her in the air.
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Old May 03, 2012, 12:53 AM
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United States, OK, Edmond
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fooman2008 View Post
I know that SOP for the B-52 is that the pilot flies the tail (elevators and rudder) and the co-pilot flies the wing (spoilers) to keep it level on take-off and landings. Did they do something like that with the 36?
Foo
I flew B-52G and H models from '87 to 94, my dad was a crew member on D models back in the late 50s and I have friends who flew D models in the 60s, and that was not SOP nor was it even considered for those models. I can't speak to other variants, I don't know anyone who flew A-C models or F models.

Control loading and force requirements on the B-52 was no worse than other aircraft from the 50s-60s. I've flown 707s and the E-3 and other than having about twice the roll rate due to a much shorter wing and ailerons instead of spoilers, the force required to manipulate the controls was similar. We had an autopilot mode for air refueling that would automatically trim pitch for you, but most of us preferred to hand fly it and trim it ourselves.

In the Air Force transfer of aircraft control between pilots is a big deal - only one person is controlling the plane at a time. Most pilots will get righteously p.o.'d at you if you're on the controls when they're supposed to be flying unless they specifically directed you to follow on the controls - this is occasionally done while instructing someone. If you're the pilot flying, you're flying the whole thing. If I don't like what you're doing, as the Aircraft Commander or Instructor Pilot I can always take the aircraft from you This starts day 1 when you hit the flight line.
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Old May 03, 2012, 07:44 AM
We shall serve the Lord
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United States, TX, Kingsland
Joined Sep 2005
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dag214 View Post
The Emmaselle is a fun plane to fly, and it is hard to measure ones talent as a pilot.

Last year I let a buddy of mine (who is a good 3D pilot) fly her, he stated that the Emmaselle scared the sh_t out of him. He said it was the hardest plane to fly he had ever seen.

You may have achieved the desired design criterion on the Emmaselle better than you thought!

A "Real Pilot" tried to fly a WWI Jenny at the Kingsbury Aerodrome here in Texas and almost crashed it into the trees at the end of the runway on takeoff. He choose to ignore the instruction that the plane flies on the wings and does not need any elevator input to takeoff. He kept trying to horse the plane off the ground by pulling up elevator and almost ended up in the trees at the far end of the runway.

Early design planes flew on the wings and the skills of the pilots. They had marginal power and needed a heavy dose of proper pilot input to stay airborne.

I loved seeing the Emmaselle at SEFF this year and I'm looking forward to seeing the 36 flying at SEFF 2013.

McD
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Old May 03, 2012, 07:48 AM
Hit Me! Please!
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Provo, UT
Joined Jan 2005
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveK View Post
I flew B-52G and H models from '87 to 94, my dad was a crew member on D models back in the late 50s and I have friends who flew D models in the 60s, and that was not SOP nor was it even considered for those models. I can't speak to other variants, I don't know anyone who flew A-C models or F models.

Control loading and force requirements on the B-52 was no worse than other aircraft from the 50s-60s. I've flown 707s and the E-3 and other than having about twice the roll rate due to a much shorter wing and ailerons instead of spoilers, the force required to manipulate the controls was similar. We had an autopilot mode for air refueling that would automatically trim pitch for you, but most of us preferred to hand fly it and trim it ourselves.

In the Air Force transfer of aircraft control between pilots is a big deal - only one person is controlling the plane at a time. Most pilots will get righteously p.o.'d at you if you're on the controls when they're supposed to be flying unless they specifically directed you to follow on the controls - this is occasionally done while instructing someone. If you're the pilot flying, you're flying the whole thing. If I don't like what you're doing, as the Aircraft Commander or Instructor Pilot I can always take the aircraft from you This starts day 1 when you hit the flight line.
Thanks Dave. That's the way I thought it was, but I was just watching over your shoulder and not flying. (Flight Surgeon for the 42nd Bomb Wing 80-83).
Jeff
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Old May 03, 2012, 08:00 AM
It only takes one good idea
dag214's Avatar
Fishers, Indiana
Joined Oct 2004
5,820 Posts
Hey all,

Last night I decided to start my list of what is left. The list grew and grew until around 11pm I decided to go to bed.

One of my biggest challenges is now the radio and electronics. One cool thing about Mac's B-29 (and I think I am correct here) is that he has a RX for each wing and all the components that live in that wing. So he has no field hook-ups attaching the wings. This for me would add a few challenges, but make my pre-flight much easier.

It might look something like this:

Left Wing RX:
Battery #1
Battery #2
RX
Aileron Servo #1
Aileron Servo #2
Flap #1 Servo #1
Flap #1 Servo #2
Flap #2 Servo #1
Flap #2 Servo #2
ESC #1
ESC #2

Fuse RX #1:
Battery #1
Battery #2
Fuse RX#1
Elevator Left Servo #1
Elevator Left Servo #2
Flap #3 Servo #1
Flap #3 Servo #2
Landing Gear Systems
ESC #3
Rudder Servo #1

Fuse RX #2:
Battery #1
Battery #2
Fuse RX#2
Elevator Right Servo #1
Elevator Right Servo #2
Flap #4 Servo #1
Flap #4 Servo #2
ESC #4
Rudder Servo #2

Right Wing RX:
Battery #1
Battery #2
RX
Aileron Servo #1
Aileron Servo #2
Flap #5 Servo #1
Flap #5 Servo #2
Flap #6 Servo #1
Flap #6 Servo #2
ESC #5
ESC #6

Just thinking out loud.

DAG
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Old May 03, 2012, 08:46 AM
186mph Funjet Ultra
E-speed buff's Avatar
nieuw vennep, the netherlands
Joined Feb 2010
489 Posts
Hi Damon

Where are the esc's for the jet pods?
Just a question from a guy over seas
Keep up the good work, awesome

Grtz René
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Old May 03, 2012, 10:41 AM
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ErcoupeEd's Avatar
Joined May 2004
1,484 Posts
Damon, I enjoyed your story about your friend who was scared of flying your Emmaselle.
Much like friends of mine who were afraid to fly in my Ercoupe because it has no rudder pedals.

But if they could only take the time to read the "bible" on the Ercoupe, a book titled "A Touch of Class" which explains all of the engineering and aerodynamic
research that went into the design of the Ercoupe.

It is there where it becomes just how much a of a genius it's designer was!
It is not an aerobatic aircraft. It is capable of barrel rolls in the hands of a skilled pilot, and even a an inside loop in capable hands. I have never tried it, nor care too!
It ,like the Emmaselle is a "fun airplane" to fly.
Low and slow, with a very economical fuel burn rate of 4 1/2 to 5 gallons per hour.
Or about 25 miles per gallon!

And an Ercoupe's rudders only move "outboard", not inboard and only one rudder moves at a time
The huge "barn door" ailerons do the rest.
Holding a crab into a crosswind landing all the way down to the runway is what scares some of my friends the first time.
But once you get used to it, it's so docile to land!

The same on takeoff, no right rudder needed. The engine has right thrust and downthrust built in.

And the fact you sewed the fabric onto the Emmaselle is just so cool and authentic!
May you have many flights of fun with it!

Ed
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Old May 03, 2012, 11:44 AM
Retardedly intelligent
foam and tape's Avatar
beavercreek,ohio
Joined Jan 2007
3,842 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by ErcoupeEd View Post
Damon, I enjoyed your story about your friend who was scared of flying your Emmaselle.
Much like friends of mine who were afraid to fly in my Ercoupe because it has no rudder pedals.

But if they could only take the time to read the "bible" on the Ercoupe, a book titled "A Touch of Class" which explains all of the engineering and aerodynamic
research that went into the design of the Ercoupe.

It is there where it becomes just how much a of a genius it's designer was!
It is not an aerobatic aircraft. It is capable of barrel rolls in the hands of a skilled pilot, and even a an inside loop in capable hands. I have never tried it, nor care too!
It ,like the Emmaselle is a "fun airplane" to fly.
Low and slow, with a very economical fuel burn rate of 4 1/2 to 5 gallons per hour.
Or about 25 miles per gallon!

And an Ercoupe's rudders only move "outboard", not inboard and only one rudder moves at a time
The huge "barn door" ailerons do the rest.
Holding a crab into a crosswind landing all the way down to the runway is what scares some of my friends the first time.
But once you get used to it, it's so docile to land!

The same on takeoff, no right rudder needed. The engine has right thrust and downthrust built in.

And the fact you sewed the fabric onto the Emmaselle is just so cool and authentic!
May you have many flights of fun with it!

Ed
No rudder pedals! How is the rudder controlled? I never knew that.
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