SMALL - espritmodel.com SMALL - Telemetry SMALL - Radio
Reply
Thread Tools
Old May 04, 2012, 09:28 PM
Registered User
United States, IA, Sidney
Joined May 2012
177 Posts
Since this is my first post here, I have a Radian that I am getting set up. I have read all 784 pages and really find most comments interesting. The decalage thing is nothing new to me. If you have a Slo-V you can read on ways to improve the flight of it, mainly by adjusting the 2 tail screws to adjust the flight characteristics, which is nothing more than what some of you have done to the tail of your Radians.
tyme4me is offline Find More Posts by tyme4me
Reply With Quote
Sign up now
to remove ads between posts
Old May 04, 2012, 09:50 PM
Gravity? No, the Earth sucks
scottdearinger's Avatar
United States, IA, Des Moines
Joined Apr 2011
1,214 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greywing View Post
As usual, HK does not provide critical dimensions but it looks like that spinner will take an 8mm prop - which means you can put the stock blade in there (with a washer or two if necessary). I think the pin size is the same.

I think skyhawk uses this spinner so chime in here skyhawk.

Edit: Here's another alternate spinner; fits well and looks good. It does have an 8mm blade hub width and a 3mm hub pin so to use the stock blade you need to drill it out to 3mm and use washers to fill up the 8mm blade hub width. This weighs a little less than the HK unit and accommodates many other Graupner blades.



Bottom line - stock spinner is the lightest available but has limited blade choices. There is a Graupner 10x8 that fits but it doesn't fold completely flush against the fuselage - not a big deal though.
I just ordered the HK spinner- I hope it works- along with another HKcam so I can make some more "boring " videos- gosh this is fun ain't it?
scottdearinger is offline Find More Posts by scottdearinger
Reply With Quote
Old May 04, 2012, 10:06 PM
Gravity? No, the Earth sucks
scottdearinger's Avatar
United States, IA, Des Moines
Joined Apr 2011
1,214 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by kaptondave View Post
I know Jovanex. I kick myself for responding but when someone spouts a load of aerodynamic theory, BS or otherwise, some are impressed. There are a lot of less-experienced flyers here, some that don't even know what decalage is.
Okay- maybe I don't get it but I know a bit of theory myself- the decalage mod should cause less drag which would increase speed slightly and sink rate and speed would increase from the incidence change-EXCEPT (big except)- THE CG has been moved back thus correcting the AoA back to near designers intention- so now we have a plane with about the same Angle of Attack with less drag- hmm whats the big deal? plane should be just slightly faster and more speed equals more air across the wing which means more lift- sounds great to me- but it flies well as designed out of the box- so the real question for me is- are you a flyer or a builder- do you want to fly your plane and master it as is, or do you love to tinker and play with slight improvements for your efforts- to each his own fellas-

Is my summary accurate? can we move on? And no I am not just a dumb camera guy- been flying stuff since before I could drive...
scottdearinger is offline Find More Posts by scottdearinger
Reply With Quote
Old May 04, 2012, 10:24 PM
Gravity? No, the Earth sucks
scottdearinger's Avatar
United States, IA, Des Moines
Joined Apr 2011
1,214 Posts
actually by mounting a gopro above your CG on top of the wing, I find the extra weight gives me better penetration and causes my speed to pick up and the big cube dragging on top of the plane increases AoA slightly, so now I am getting more speed causing more lift and a slightly higher AoA from the gopro sail- possibly making the camera mod the best flight mod you can make-
I also sell bridges in my spare time

but seriously- my Radian carries 2 HK wing cams on the wing roots, A Gopro above CG on the wing saddle, and a #11 key cam on the horiz stab-a 1500 to 1800mh battery and my plane still soars magnificently..Because I have learned to fly it that way and it is well balanced..

sometimes you just got to fly your plane and quit tinkering- unless that is your thing
scottdearinger is offline Find More Posts by scottdearinger
Reply With Quote
Old May 05, 2012, 12:16 AM
Flying Full Size & Fun Size :)
jgalexander's Avatar
United States, CA, Calabasas
Joined Apr 2010
1,914 Posts
Debates are fine with me. I have a beef with people being rude when they disagree. That was what the "why" was for Dave.

For everybody,
I'm not perfect, but I'd like to air my two cents.
I get that misinformation isn't cool, and that this conversation/debate/argument has gone on a long time. I honestly don't mind that so much. I can interpret both sides, and make my own choice. But I really, really, REALLY don't like don't like to see rudeness on here. It's just ugly. Plus, when folks get offended, they get defensive and stubborn, which means they really aren't gonna change!

I'm a counselor and therapist by trade, so i just gotta say this.
If someone was frustrated by what you wrote, how would you want them to respond?

Might be best to take a break, go do something else and chill out, THEN come back with a clear head and write a constructive response. Or, of you've already said your piece, and someone still ain't gettin it, let it goooooo...
-Josh
jgalexander is offline Find More Posts by jgalexander
RCG Plus Member
Old May 05, 2012, 06:48 AM
Registered User
Joined Jan 2010
3,490 Posts
I dislike rudeness as well Josh, and if you took the time to read through my post you would see that i am not a rude person. You are seriously out of place to jump into the middle of a long-running debate to condemn one party without knowing the history.

You asked "If someone was frustrated by what you wrote, how would you want them to respond?"

What I want from another party in a debate is simple honesty and truth. Repeatedly making derogatory remarks filled with false statements is rude in itself.

i would welcome the chance to discuss the pros and cons of the mod with others that have tried it or with honest theorists that have an open mind, but will not accept being told that what I see happening is meaningless because theory says so. i hope that makes sense.
kaptondave is online now Find More Posts by kaptondave
Last edited by kaptondave; May 05, 2012 at 10:33 AM.
Reply With Quote
Old May 05, 2012, 10:53 AM
Zor
Suspended Account
Ontario,Canada
Joined Feb 2007
9,742 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by kaptondave
I know Jovanex. I kick myself for responding but when someone spouts a load of aerodynamic theory, BS or otherwise, some are impressed. There are a lot of less-experienced flyers here, some that don't even know what decalage is.
kaptondave,
You have been throwing your outlook about theory and BS for a long time.

It is your choice to disregard theory if knowledge is not your preference but you cannot be justified to state that some who know the theory are posting BS.
You are not helping anyone by claiming that some participants explaining "what is gong on" and "expessing their view of the designers aim and goals" is BS because it is not.

Quote:
Originally Posted by scottdearinger View Post
Okay- maybe I don't get it but I know a bit of theory myself- the decalage mod should cause less drag which would increase speed slightly and sink rate and speed would increase from the incidence change-
Note that the incidence change is done at the stabilizer which along with the elevator position (trim) determines the angle of the decalage.

The CG trajectory will always establish itself such that the angle of attack of the wings and speed will produce a lift equal to the weight. We can say that the decalage angle is the factor that determines both the speed and the CG trajectory (steady rate of descent in the air mass).

Quote:
EXCEPT (big except)- THE CG has been moved back thus correcting the AoA back to near designers intention- so now we have a plane with about the same Angle of Attack with less drag- hmm whats the big deal?
If the angle of attack is the same then the speed does not need to increase; does not need to change.
However if the decalge angle is near zero or not sufficient to maintain lift then the CG will have a trajectory more inclined toward the ground and at a higher speed. Both increase the rate of descent in the air mass.

[quopte]
plane should be just slightly faster and more speed equals more air across the wing which means more lift- sounds great to me-
[/quote]

It sounds great if the higher lost of altitude in time (rate of descent) is acceptable to the pilot.

Quote:
but it flies well as designed out of the box- so the real question for me is- are you a flyer or a builder- do you want to fly your plane and master it as is, or do you love to tinker and play with slight improvements for your efforts- to each his own fellas-
Some fellow decided to criticize the designers and promote his product. Buy my products and learn how to modify a poorly designed model and make it fly better; which it does not.

Whoever wish to claim that I am a troll and throwing BS around ought to make an effort to acquire more knowledge in a highly technical hobby.

Quote:
Is my summary accurate? can we move on? And no I am not just a dumb camera guy- been flying stuff since before I could drive...
Your summary is accurate and you obviously know more than some who are claimed to not even know what decalage is.

Anyone who spent their money for modificaton instructions and may have modified the originally designed decalage on their model obviously now know what the decalage is and I hope they understand the results of the modification.

Perhaps they just made the modifications blindly ?

I often think about who buys a vehicle purely on the basis of cost, appearance (shape) and color.

I am the type that consider _ _ _
Rust protection
Engine anticipated life
Tires anticipated mileage
Performance (speed and accelaration) versus gas mileage.

So I take my models to the flying field in a Ford van Econoline 250 without having to disassemble the wings.
The van was built in 1979 (now33 years old and has full insurance as mandatory here) and has over 400,000 miles (not kilometers) on the dial having gone around four times and now reading just over 13,000 miles on its fifth cycle.

I am not throwing BS around this forum.

Zor
Zor is offline Find More Posts by Zor
Last edited by Zor; May 05, 2012 at 11:01 AM.
Reply With Quote  (Disabled)
Old May 05, 2012, 12:40 PM
Registered User
Joined Jan 2010
3,490 Posts
Quote:
Some fellow decided to criticize the designers and promote his product. Buy my products and learn how to modify a poorly designed model and make it fly better; which it does not.

Whoever wish to claim that I am a troll and throwing BS around ought to make an effort to acquire more knowledge in a highly technical hobby.
"the fellow" that developed the decalage mod is a highly respected sail plane pilot with far better credentials than any of us have. He charges nothing for the instructions so your allegation of financial motive is bogus. Your claim that the modified Radian does not fly better is likewise bogus. Those who have tried it say it does. Only you, who has not done it or even seen it in action, claim otherwise. I will leave it to the reader to decide, and hope that we can now close this discussion.
kaptondave is online now Find More Posts by kaptondave
Reply With Quote
Old May 05, 2012, 01:03 PM
Tossing planes into the snow
Canada, BC, Smithers
Joined Nov 2011
2,938 Posts
Maybe we can let Monty Python have the last word...

Argument Clinic (6 min 7 sec)
Jovanx is offline Find More Posts by Jovanx
Reply With Quote
Old May 05, 2012, 01:13 PM
Flying Full Size & Fun Size :)
jgalexander's Avatar
United States, CA, Calabasas
Joined Apr 2010
1,914 Posts
Ha! That was PERFECT
jgalexander is offline Find More Posts by jgalexander
RCG Plus Member
Old May 05, 2012, 10:47 PM
Gravity? No, the Earth sucks
scottdearinger's Avatar
United States, IA, Des Moines
Joined Apr 2011
1,214 Posts
hey - i made my first parachute drop with my other plane- anyone that wants to see if the video is funny or boring- see it here-
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showt...4#post21530934
scottdearinger is offline Find More Posts by scottdearinger
Reply With Quote
Old May 06, 2012, 02:09 AM
Not a newbie anymore..
skyhawk newbie's Avatar
Ireland, Cork
Joined Oct 2010
2,027 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jovanx View Post
Maybe we can let Monty Python have the last word...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kQFKtI6gn9Y
I havn't seen that one in years...Great stuff


..


http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showt...1#post21520536


.
skyhawk newbie is offline Find More Posts by skyhawk newbie
Reply With Quote
Old May 06, 2012, 02:03 PM
Registered User
United States, FL, Indialantic
Joined Mar 2012
178 Posts
I'm trying to figure out a way to land on a short runway at my house. I live on 3 acres, but there are a lot of trees and a pond making a landing challenging. I've not tried it yet. I have a spot with about 125' of clear space, but I'd have to drop down sharply after clearing the trees. I was thinking about a hook and cable "aircraft carrier" setup. If I missed I'd end up in the bushes. It would just be so nice to sit on my second floor porch overlooking the pond, soaring with the groups of buzzards that are always catching thermals right out my door. Any techniques or ideas for a short landing?
Calla969 is online now Find More Posts by Calla969
Reply With Quote
Old May 06, 2012, 02:22 PM
Closed Account
Joined Aug 2011
530 Posts
...
Radio.Active is offline Find More Posts by Radio.Active
Last edited by Radio.Active; Jun 13, 2013 at 09:35 AM.
Reply With Quote
Old May 06, 2012, 03:53 PM
Chess club geek with wings
blunight's Avatar
United States, FL, Cape Coral
Joined Aug 2008
1,054 Posts
I'd add spoilers...cheap and easy.
blunight is offline Find More Posts by blunight
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools