HobbyKing.com New Products Flash Sale
Reply
Thread Tools
Old Dec 01, 2011, 11:55 AM
Precision Aerobatics Team
demonGti's Avatar
South Africa, GP, Randburg
Joined Dec 2006
2,039 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by kyoshooo View Post
Hi may I know is there any soft copy version of AMR manual available online? Bought an used AMR last night but it doesn't comes with any manual
Unfortunately not, no downloadable manual is available... but if you're needing CG info, TX mixes, throws, dual rates etc... i'm sure we can help you out
demonGti is offline Find More Posts by demonGti
Reply With Quote
Sign up now
to remove ads between posts
Old Dec 02, 2011, 07:42 AM
Grumpy old git.. Who me?
JetPlaneFlyer's Avatar
Aberdeen
Joined Mar 2006
12,122 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by vhuang168 View Post
Steve,

It is built with the IPS drive so everything is as recommended. Except the battery which is about 20g heavier than the PA one.

CF spinner, Vox 14x7 prop. Not much else I can do to remove weight except maybe remove the spinner n get a lighter battery.

I've had to put in 13% up elev for KE with the CG at 58mm. But inverted takes a fair amount of up to maintain level flight.

Guess I'll play around with cg by moving/changing battery then do the KE mix.

Thanks for the input

Vincent
Vincent,
The battery on my AMR hangs over the rear of the tray by about 15mm. I've got it set to fly level when inverted with no requirement for elevator input. If yours dives when inverted then slide the battery back a bit more, if it climbs move the battery forward.

The further back you have the CG then the more up-elevator you will need programmed with your KE mix, but that's something you just need to accept.

Steve
JetPlaneFlyer is offline Find More Posts by JetPlaneFlyer
Reply With Quote
Old Dec 02, 2011, 07:45 AM
Grumpy old git.. Who me?
JetPlaneFlyer's Avatar
Aberdeen
Joined Mar 2006
12,122 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by demonGti View Post
Unfortunately not, no downloadable manual is available... but if you're needing CG info, TX mixes, throws, dual rates etc... i'm sure we can help you out
I copied that info from the manual in a previous post: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...postcount=5525
JetPlaneFlyer is offline Find More Posts by JetPlaneFlyer
Reply With Quote
Old Dec 02, 2011, 09:25 AM
FLYINGJUNKY
eschult's Avatar
USA, FL, Jacksonville
Joined Mar 2008
833 Posts
took my PA extra 260 out this morning and when I did my flight check i noticed that the esc sounded like a race car shifting gears. Hit throttle and the motor would have to build up speed to reach full motion. When i tried WOT the motor would go slow and then fast but never stayed at full throttle. Tested my Extra mx and then the ultimate and both do not do this. I checked the connections and battery and both are good. Any idea what this could be. I checked the quantum manual and nothing helpful.
Thanks, Eric
eschult is offline Find More Posts by eschult
Reply With Quote
Old Dec 02, 2011, 09:52 AM
DFC~ We Do Flyin' Right
bsbauman's Avatar
USA, GA, Atlanta
Joined Nov 2008
14,741 Posts
It sounds like your ESC settings may have changed. I would reprogram the esc to default settings. It sounds like you possibly have a soft start feature turned on. But I am no expert on ESCs, try it and see if that helps.
bsbauman is offline Find More Posts by bsbauman
RCG Plus Member
Latest blog entry: Boom Smoke!
Reply With Quote
Old Dec 02, 2011, 11:01 AM
Registered User
aerofundan's Avatar
Panama
Joined Jul 2005
3,608 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by eschult View Post
took my PA extra 260 out this morning and when I did my flight check i noticed that the esc sounded like a race car shifting gears. Hit throttle and the motor would have to build up speed to reach full motion. When i tried WOT the motor would go slow and then fast but never stayed at full throttle. Tested my Extra mx and then the ultimate and both do not do this. I checked the connections and battery and both are good. Any idea what this could be. I checked the quantum manual and nothing helpful.
Thanks, Eric
That has happened to me with different brand ESCs in other planes, and after it catches full throttle, it starts running fine for the remaining of the flight, very strange thing, maybe you need to do throttle calibration?
aerofundan is offline Find More Posts by aerofundan
Site Sponsor
Reply With Quote
Old Dec 02, 2011, 12:28 PM
FLYINGJUNKY
eschult's Avatar
USA, FL, Jacksonville
Joined Mar 2008
833 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by aerofundan View Post
That has happened to me with different brand ESCs in other planes, and after it catches full throttle, it starts running fine for the remaining of the flight, very strange thing, maybe you need to do throttle calibration?
Thanks, Never happened to me with any of my quantum speed controls?????
Eric
eschult is offline Find More Posts by eschult
Reply With Quote
Old Dec 05, 2011, 06:27 PM
They Call him Dead!
YellowJacketsRC's Avatar
United States, SC, Pawleys Island
Joined Jul 2003
7,058 Posts
I recently had to do some repair work on my wings and ailerons. Tonight I was resetting my throws. I was holding the ailerons in max throw positions and measuring. After a while I happened to touch the quantum esc and man was it HOT! I was not running the motor at all. But I was holding the ailerons in max positions. Should this cause the esc to get warm?

Also, if anyone has a manual handy, can you tell me what the max throws should be for initial aileron settings? I was thinking that it should be 45 degrees up and down and then set the differential from there, but I can not quite achieve 45 degrees. Any help?

Thanks
YellowJacketsRC is offline Find More Posts by YellowJacketsRC
Reply With Quote
Old Dec 05, 2011, 07:09 PM
Registered User
United States, CA, Sunnyvale
Joined Mar 2011
537 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by JetPlaneFlyer View Post
Vincent,
The battery on my AMR hangs over the rear of the tray by about 15mm. I've got it set to fly level when inverted with no requirement for elevator input. If yours dives when inverted then slide the battery back a bit more, if it climbs move the battery forward.

The further back you have the CG then the more up-elevator you will need programmed with your KE mix, but that's something you just need to accept.

Steve
Steve,

I've since moved the battery back forward till the back end is even with the back edge of the tray. CG is now 56ish. The Ultimate is now much more stable, KE mixing with elevator close to 20%, ail around 10% and its pretty locked in.

But...

Inverted flight is still wierd, it pitches up by itself. I have to hold slight down elevator for level flight. Which is the reverse of every other plane I've flown. Wonder if there is an incidence issue with mine. Hands off, it will pitch up till its back to upright and then level off.. almost auto-pilot like.

Other than that, it flys great. Blenders are nice, can do it fast or slow, still a little wing rock on harriers but managable. Same with elevators. Snaps are a blast esp with full throws.

Any body have any thoughts on my inverted problem?

TIA
Vincent
vhuang168 is online now Find More Posts by vhuang168
Reply With Quote
Old Dec 05, 2011, 07:33 PM
They Call him Dead!
YellowJacketsRC's Avatar
United States, SC, Pawleys Island
Joined Jul 2003
7,058 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by vhuang168 View Post
Steve,

I've since moved the battery back forward till the back end is even with the back edge of the tray. CG is now 56ish. The Ultimate is now much more stable, KE mixing with elevator close to 20%, ail around 10% and its pretty locked in.

But...

Inverted flight is still wierd, it pitches up by itself. I have to hold slight down elevator for level flight. Which is the reverse of every other plane I've flown. Wonder if there is an incidence issue with mine. Hands off, it will pitch up till its back to upright and then level off.. almost auto-pilot like.

Other than that, it flys great. Blenders are nice, can do it fast or slow, still a little wing rock on harriers but managable. Same with elevators. Snaps are a blast esp with full throws.

Any body have any thoughts on my inverted problem?

TIA
Vincent
Your CG is still too far back. You are describing a tail heavy plane right there. You need to continue to move your battery forward, trim for up right level flight, and then turn upside down. When you get the cg right, the plane will fly level hands of both upright and inverted.
YellowJacketsRC is offline Find More Posts by YellowJacketsRC
Reply With Quote
Old Dec 05, 2011, 07:56 PM
Registered User
United States, CA, Sunnyvale
Joined Mar 2011
537 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by dead View Post
Your CG is still too far back. You are describing a tail heavy plane right there. You need to continue to move your battery forward, trim for up right level flight, and then turn upside down. When you get the cg right, the plane will fly level hands of both upright and inverted.
Yes I understand that. The manual lists a CG of 59.5 as the ideal position for 3d. My CG is forward of that and is still too heavy.
vhuang168 is online now Find More Posts by vhuang168
Reply With Quote
Old Dec 05, 2011, 08:11 PM
They Call him Dead!
YellowJacketsRC's Avatar
United States, SC, Pawleys Island
Joined Jul 2003
7,058 Posts
I understand what the manual says. It MAY be that you have an incidence problem or possibly a thrust angle problem. But I am betting money that your plane is ok and you are flying tail heavy. I never worry about manual settings for CG. I always set the cg generally forward of the recommendation (I do this using my fingers and no CG machine) and then test flying and I move the lipo forward and back until I get neutral CG based on actual flight tests. This has always yielded a great flying machine.

I recommend you do two things:
first, fly the plane as is next time out. Trim for level flight at 3/4 throttle. Fly straight at 3/4 throttle and then kill the throttle and let the plane drift from there. If the plane continues basically straight and then slowly begins to fall towards the ground in a gentle manner, then your thrust angle for your motor is correct regardless of your CG. If it climbs after chopping the throttle, then your thrust angle is too far down. If the plane quickly dives after chopping the throttle then your thrust angle is too far pointing up. If the thrust angle is off then you need to shim the motor with washers to correct it. My prediction is that your thrust angle is spot on.

Second: once you determine that your thrust angle is correct, continue moving your lipo forward and re-trim until you get neutral CG as determined by the plane's ability to maintain level flight hands off both upright and inverted.

Finally, accomplish the above and see what you think. My bet is that you will really love it. If you are not happy, come back and report your findings and we can sort it out from there.
YellowJacketsRC is offline Find More Posts by YellowJacketsRC
Reply With Quote
Old Dec 05, 2011, 09:38 PM
Registered User
Joined Apr 2007
1,174 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by vhuang168 View Post
Yes I understand that. The manual lists a CG of 59.5 as the ideal position for 3d. My CG is forward of that and is still too heavy.
Did you measure at the wing tip or the wing root?
MalaysianFlyer is offline Find More Posts by MalaysianFlyer
Reply With Quote
Old Dec 06, 2011, 01:38 AM
Watch it...Watch it ...Duck!
full flaps's Avatar
San Dimas, CA
Joined Nov 2009
190 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by dead View Post
Also, if anyone has a manual handy, can you tell me what the max throws should be for initial aileron settings? I was thinking that it should be 45 degrees up and down and then set the differential from there, but I can not quite achieve 45 degrees. Any help?

Thanks
"Ailerons High rates: 40 degrees Up and 35 degrees Down (5 degree differential) Expo: 70%.
Low rates: 15 degrees Up and Down Expo: 35%."
full flaps is offline Find More Posts by full flaps
Reply With Quote
Old Dec 06, 2011, 01:59 AM
Grumpy old git.. Who me?
JetPlaneFlyer's Avatar
Aberdeen
Joined Mar 2006
12,122 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by vhuang168 View Post
Any body have any thoughts on my inverted problem?

TIA
Vincent
Vincent,

I also found the CG position in the manual to be a fair bit too far back, mine is at about 55mm, near as i can tell (see comment below*). I'd not worry about what the manual says but on how it flies, the manual in my experience is well wide of the mark in a few areas. Try moving the battery forward a bit more, you will find the sweet spot and it sounds like you are close.

*It's quite hard to get an accurate CG position when balancing the AMR because you are supporting by the top wing which is much higher than the actual vertical CG location. Even if you support the model well away from the actual longitudinal CG location it still balances fine, just ever so slightly nose up or nose down, which without a spirit level is hard to spot. I laugh when the manual talkes about differences of 1.5mm in CG location, it's just impossible to judge it anything like that accurately.

Also make sure that you don't have it trimmed to dive slightly when in upright flight. At 1/2 to 3/4 throttle she should fly level when upright or when inverted. At lower and higher throttle you may have some slight climbing and diving, that's normal.

I doubt that it's a thrustline issue, the motor box is a laser cut interlocking structure so there is really no scope for it to have the wrong angle set, and in my experience the downthrust angle (actually no downthrust) is fine out of the box, though i did add more right thrust.
JetPlaneFlyer is offline Find More Posts by JetPlaneFlyer
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools

Similar Threads
Category Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
GP Ultimate Biplane conversion SoarNeck Sport Planes 14 Dec 28, 2008 10:11 PM
Simple Series Ultimate Biplane exowatt Sport Planes 4 Jul 09, 2002 10:35 AM
Ultimate Biplane Templates for Foam Construction Here hoppy Sport Planes 8 Mar 17, 2002 09:34 PM
ULTIMATE BIPLANE - Another Meat Tray (Depron) Project. hoppy Foamies (Kits) 65 Jan 10, 2002 01:51 PM
Ultimate Biplane Colourschemes Armin Mangelmann Scale Kit/Scratch Built 9 Dec 08, 2001 09:03 PM