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Old Jul 10, 2009, 01:14 AM
RIP MC
fnnwizard's Avatar
United States, CA, Midway City
Joined Dec 2003
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Oooh, I forgot to mention, I had a chance to go down to my local park (1 block away) where I did some hand lauching to dial in my crow. Park is way to small for even a histart. It was quite windy yesterday (12-17mph) so I played with the reflex setting just using hand tossing. I found penetration to be decent with reflex at a whopping 4mm without any ballast. but at ground level it was turbulent so take this setting with a grain of salt.

The amount of reflex did seem too much to me until I came home and, using the "ruler's edge along the bottom of the wing found 4.5mm to be "flat against the straight edge"... so now this will become my zoom reflex. It was at 3mm before. I will now use 4.5-5mm and see what it does.

I wish Nan can post a theoretical analysis of the airfoil like Samba does with the Pike Perfect.
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Old Jul 10, 2009, 10:01 AM
Win=span\massXpractice+lu ck
webbsolution's Avatar
Joined Jul 2007
2,968 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by fnnwizard
Oooh, I forgot to mention, I had a chance to go down to my local park (1 block away) where I did some hand lauching to dial in my crow. Park is way to small for even a histart. It was quite windy yesterday (12-17mph) so I played with the reflex setting just using hand tossing. I found penetration to be decent with reflex at a whopping 4mm without any ballast. but at ground level it was turbulent so take this setting with a grain of salt.

The amount of reflex did seem too much to me until I came home and, using the "ruler's edge along the bottom of the wing found 4.5mm to be "flat against the straight edge"... so now this will become my zoom reflex. It was at 3mm before. I will now use 4.5-5mm and see what it does.

I wish Nan can post a theoretical analysis of the airfoil like Samba does with the Pike Perfect.

Hey thank you for posting yoru reflex settings this is an area of high interest to me.
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Old Jul 10, 2009, 10:13 AM
Hot Dawg Glider Pilot
schrederman's Avatar
United States, TX, Weatherford
Joined Nov 2002
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I have long thought that most people don't use enough reflex, and ballast when they don't really need to do so. My X launches like no other sailplane I have ever owned. I do not do vertical pings. I go from my launch setting of about 8 degrees down flap and aileron to about 6 degrees up when I step on the winch pedal for the ping. My dive is shallow, but the speed builds very quickly and when I ping off, my climb is about 45 degrees. It then becomes the Energiser Bunny... it just keeps going... and going... At Amarillo, I was getting almost as much altitude from the ping as from the initial phase of the launch. Zoom Zoom!

Jack
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Old Jul 10, 2009, 10:42 AM
Detail Freak
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Harbor City, CA
Joined Oct 2003
21,571 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by schrederman
I have long thought that most people don't use enough reflex, and ballast when they don't really need to do so. My X launches like no other sailplane I have ever owned. I do not do vertical pings. I go from my launch setting of about 8 degrees down flap and aileron to about 6 degrees up when I step on the winch pedal for the ping. My dive is shallow, but the speed builds very quickly and when I ping off, my climb is about 45 degrees. It then becomes the Energiser Bunny... it just keeps going... and going... At Amarillo, I was getting almost as much altitude from the ping as from the initial phase of the launch. Zoom Zoom!

Jack

About what distance at the TE does 6 degrees translate to at the root of the flaps, Jack???

Maybe I have not been using enough reflex...

Thanks, Target
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Last edited by target; Jul 10, 2009 at 12:50 PM.
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Old Jul 10, 2009, 11:38 AM
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Boca Raton, FL
Joined Apr 2009
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Control Throws

Hi guys,

I know that the info must have been posted somewhere already, but I've been having a hard time locating it.

Any suggestions about the Xplorer 3.5 control throws and CG location?

Thanks!
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Old Jul 10, 2009, 11:44 AM
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United States, CA, Midway City
Joined Dec 2003
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Ok, I think I have enough logged data to add some info to launch settings. I have tried just about every launch settings on the X. This is my settings now. I do the opposite of what most people do I guess, I launch with max camber, now about 15-20 degrees depending on how much wind.

I try to go up the line as slowly as possible tapping as much as possible but still maintain enough airspeed to get a controlled winch. At the moment of switching from launch to zoom reflex I dive right at the turn-around maybe for .7 seconds. I have read somewhere it only takes about that long to get to terminal velocity so any dive longer than that an you are wasting height.

Then I pull to as near perfect vertical as possible.

I consistently get the best height launching this way vs every other way... but it's harder to launch consistently this way too as the quick tapping of the foot, diving right at turnaround, and pulling a perfect vertical is what makes it harder.

Now this is for launching on FLS winch with no time limit on the line. Of course with F3J launch you like want faster tow and sooner zoom in most cases so settings will be different.

Also to get the max lift on launch(or very close to it) fly your X in launch mode and adjust elevator so it flies at minimum sink. My elevator adjusts also depending on the amount of launch camber I put in.

Here's a degree wheel to help with setups. You can draw in some extra lines and very accurate with it. More so than with a mm ruler.
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Old Jul 10, 2009, 12:21 PM
RIP MC
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United States, CA, Midway City
Joined Dec 2003
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Need to add some more info. Again, on FLS TD winch. I set my hook with the back edge at 107mm. it could get squirly if I don't do the following when launching:

I build decent tension on the winch, but not enough to get it close to stalling as I have seen many competitors do. I give it a good straight arm heave, more like a hook shot in basketball. I don't tap until the plane flys past that point of stalling. I am guessing less than 50ft off the ground. I may have to give a blip of down elevator at about this point.

After that initial "danger zone" I tap tap tap. If you really want to get aggressive you can add some up elevator after the danger zone also.
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Old Jul 10, 2009, 12:28 PM
Hot Dawg Glider Pilot
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United States, TX, Weatherford
Joined Nov 2002
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Use a protractor, and mark the 0 line and the degree line for the proposed surface deflection. Fron the convergence of the two lines, measure the chord of the surface, and the distance between the lines, and that's how to measure it on the model. I do this in AutoCad for greater accuracy.

Just giving a measurement might get it close enough, but I'm at work and the toy is at home. Besides using this method, you can do any surface on any model, any time... hope that helps...

Jack

Yes, I still have all my college drafting tools...
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Old Jul 10, 2009, 12:38 PM
Hot Dawg Glider Pilot
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United States, TX, Weatherford
Joined Nov 2002
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My CG is at 108mm behind the LE. My rudder swings 30 degrees at full throw, each way. My stab is 18 degrees up and 12 degrees down. My ailerons are 22 degrees up and 12 degrees down. My flaps at full reflex (negative flap to full-scalers) is -6 degrees (up). Launch preset changes with altitude from +8 degrees down to +18 degrees (down), with more deflection at higher altitudes. Aileron deflection matches flap deflection in launch mode.

Jack
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Old Jul 10, 2009, 12:53 PM
RIP MC
fnnwizard's Avatar
United States, CA, Midway City
Joined Dec 2003
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Quote:
Originally Posted by target
About what distance at the TE does 6 degrees traslate to at the root of the flaps, Jack???

Maybe I have not been using enough reflex...

Thanks, Target
T, each degree is about 1.20mm in vertical measurement
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Old Jul 10, 2009, 01:01 PM
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Encinitas, CA
Joined Jun 2007
176 Posts
I got my xplorers (std wingspan and 3.8) two weeks ago from Soaring uSA. They came RTF with CG at 106 for the std wingspan and probably 107 for the bigger brother. I have progressively moved the CG back to 109-110mm so far and the plane continues to be stable and easy to fly. I will probably move the CG another bit and see what happens this weekend.
I don't remember the throw settings but my rule of thumb is that one should start with whatever is recommended by the manufacturer and move around from there. I have increased my wing and elevator throw dramatically since getting the plane and I continue to find this thing flying better and better.
I am anxious to see how far back I can go before the plane becomes unflyable/unstable. Has anyone tried this?
Mario
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Old Jul 10, 2009, 01:05 PM
Detail Freak
target's Avatar
Harbor City, CA
Joined Oct 2003
21,571 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by fnnwizard
T, each degree is about 1.20mm in vertical measurement

Yay!

That is a lot of reflex, then... 6 degrees comes out to 7+ mm at the flap root, that seems extreem to me. I have MUCH less, but am always willing to experiment.
Maybe we can get together this weekend and compare settings. I'll start a new model memory in my Tx.

Thanks Jack, too.

T
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Old Jul 10, 2009, 01:05 PM
Throw it like you hate it
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United States, CA, Castro Valley
Joined Apr 2007
3,072 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Multeric
Hi guys,

I know that the info must have been posted somewhere already, but I've been having a hard time locating it.

Any suggestions about the Xplorer 3.5 control throws and CG location?

Thanks!
check out post #1502 (pg 101) and post # 1218 (pg 82). Mike Le and Tuan both gave descriptions of their throws and setup. hope this helps.
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Old Jul 10, 2009, 01:10 PM
RIP MC
fnnwizard's Avatar
United States, CA, Midway City
Joined Dec 2003
3,215 Posts
Welcome to the X family Mario... I guess this is your replacement for that bad boy of yours huh? Man, if only I had the garage space .

Yeah, it would be great if Nan posted flying setups somehwere. I just never found them yet.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RCPC
check out post #1502 (pg 101) and post # 1218 (pg 82). Mike Le and Tuan both gave descriptions of their throws and setup. hope this helps.
I've tweeked my settings slightly again RCPC, and it's flying a little better each time. I'll post the setups this weekend when I get it out to measure again. And for those of us who set our Rcgroups up to look at max number of posts (100)per page, that would equat to page 16 and 13 respectively.
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Old Jul 10, 2009, 01:16 PM
Registered User
Encinitas, CA
Joined Jun 2007
176 Posts
I actually have the set up sheet from Nan. I will scan it and post it here tonight or tomorrow.

Yes, I kind of gave up on scale models for the time being. I sold all of them including bad boy which is shipping this week to it new home in the middle east. I will miss bad boy. I have a feeling the new owner has a big garage
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