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Old May 17, 2009, 07:02 AM
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Australia, QLD, King Scrub
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeTheCrash
the box and instuctions say 600-42 and I assume the motor is the same but it's bolted into the housing now. And Twang, nothing's a silly question where I'm concerned. did you see what I did to my arm a few posts ago?!?!?

I just made up 2x 3s in parallel, then two of these pairs in series, to make 8600mAh 20c 6s and got just a few extra watts - 850. It seems the batteries aren't at fault. So is this one of the "dodgy" 600-42's that are no longer manufactured? there's like a small deadspot at the top of the throttle stick range where the motor doesn't accelerate any further.

one more thing to try, another Tx/Rx combo. if that doesn't fix it then it has to be the motor/esc. or the Deans connectors and cabling - but there's more copper in the deans than there is in the wires running in to the motor or the speed controller so i really don't think that's it.
If you have a esc throttle issue, then I would look there first. From what you say you have plenty of batt capacity and a suspect motor would be last option. Have a read of your esc docs and look for the throttle calibration sequence and while you are there check the whole esc setup. What sort is it??
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Old May 17, 2009, 09:01 AM
Just clumsy. Oh, forgetful too
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it's a complete package from Mark as it seems that no-one in the UK knows much about performance EDF (that I can find, anyway). Seems daft to get a system from the other side of the planet but I was hoping that the tried-and-tested aspect would outweigh the disadvantages. I'm really hoping that I don't have to airmail it all back to Oz to be tested!!

Anyway I had set up the throttle response as per the instructions, but I'll do it again. I'd love it if it's just a simple programming issue.

the lack of extra oomph at the top of the stick range could also be down to batteries, but I don't see why running 2s(3s2p) doesn't fix it but the extra 50w does indicate perhaps that something's up. I need to find someone with a monster 6s I can try but I'm not in a club...
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Old May 17, 2009, 03:21 PM
Just clumsy. Oh, forgetful too
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hey guys do you need to measure power with a load on the system, like an exhaust duct?

is the expected 1200w based on in-flight data or should I be able to get it on the test rig?

thanks


Mike
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Old May 17, 2009, 03:45 PM
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Chilliwack, B.C. Canada
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The test rig should show it Mike. It doesn't need to be under load.
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Old May 17, 2009, 06:45 PM
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Australia
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Mike what exactly were the amps and volts you were seeing? Your email says 800w and 43A which is 3.1v per cell under load. If you are at 22 volts and 850W then your amp draw is only 38??

The current motor batch HET sent out to everyone are not actually faulty, they are in fact the correct Kv! They are modeled on the MEGA 22-45-2 and are supposed to be 1400Kv.

The original batch all dealers received were 1600-2000Kv when measured unloaded on 3s and all ran around 1200 watts and 32K rpm give or take a few %. It seems the magnets were baked incorrectly on the first batches causing a rise in Kv.

New motors have been produced with 5mm shorter stators and have been very carefully monitored during the build to ensure the factory doesnt stuff up the magnet power again, these motors measure 1600Kv I am told and I will have samples next week. They should be a perfect 6s motor.

I can account for all the 1400Kv motors I received except one, so you may have it Mike, if it is then just sit tight and I will get HET to send you a replacement 600-40-2 soon as I have tested them.

On 8 cells the 1400Kv motor runs very well, in Europe they are using the MEGA version on 10s in the Midifan. Of course you need an ESC capable of higher cell count but there are a few available these days at quite reasonable prices.

Your thrust stand will never measure correctly, it will be off by at least 50% the way you have it. Lack of inlet lip covers 20% plus straight away and the short height and wooden panels on each side will screw up the airflow. You need RPM, its the only way I can reliably tell you what the fan is doing.
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Old May 18, 2009, 01:37 AM
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When 10S on a Mega then only the F-version with inbuild cooling fan.
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Last edited by Kambalunga; May 18, 2009 at 12:51 PM.
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Old May 18, 2009, 02:47 AM
Just clumsy. Oh, forgetful too
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thanks guys for all the input
today, instead of working, doing my VAT return or sorting out our overgrown garden, I am going to
1. re-program the esc to double check the stick range is set correctly
2. try again with 125% throttle "throw" on the Tx
3. test the system with a different Rx/Tx
4. measure voltage drop accross the cables I have made up
5. cut some chunks out of the test stand to get more air into the fan

if my test stand is 50% inaccurate then I could be geting not the measured 1.2kg but 2.4 or perhaps just under 2kg as i don't have a lip ring? we'll see...out with the hole saw!
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Old May 18, 2009, 06:22 AM
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Mike the RPM should be around 29K if you have one of the 1400Kv motors, this is around 1.7kg thrust. Just email me as I have arranged for a new series motor to be sent out directly to you soon as they are ready, should be within 2 weeks.
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Old May 18, 2009, 07:16 AM
Cut the yellow wire
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United States, NJ, Trenton
Joined Jan 2004
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Mark-- I know that I was breaking your stones a little bit but there's no faulting your customer service and the fact that you do fly what you sell.

My Mirage is 85% finished but ready for maiden. It really has been since last week but the weather hasn't cooperated. Got in a quick flight with the FW F-35 and EDO F-15 just before dark yesterday and that's the only flying I've done for nearly 2 weeks!

Mike
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Old May 18, 2009, 12:32 PM
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Delafield, WI, USA
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Is there currently a US supplier of the FF Mirage 2000 or should I go to HC?
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Old May 18, 2009, 12:48 PM
Just clumsy. Oh, forgetful too
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Extreme_RC
Mike the RPM should be around 29K if you have one of the 1400Kv motors, this is around 1.7kg thrust. Just email me as I have arranged for a new series motor to be sent out directly to you soon as they are ready, should be within 2 weeks.
Thanks Mark that's good of you to sort this out so easily. email sent.

i have eliminated the Tx/Rx from the possible problem list, and the holes in the test stand give me just another 50w or so, the batts don't even get warm so I don't think it's them, I still need to put a voltmeter accross all my solder joints but I need two hands for this, so I'm waiting till I've got some earplugs. Gor Blimey (as we say in London) this thing's LOUD!
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Old May 18, 2009, 12:51 PM
Just clumsy. Oh, forgetful too
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dbatey
Is there currently a US supplier of the FF Mirage 2000 or should I go to HC?
try here in Austria - super cheap, might make up for the airmail. proper intruction manual too as it's Graupner branded
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Old May 18, 2009, 07:19 PM
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Chilliwack, B.C. Canada
Joined Sep 2004
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Third Times the Charm...Successful Maiden

Took mine down to the club for the third time trying to get it in the air, and today was the day.
Used my bungee launcher, which did the job, but I don't think I'd want to see any heavier plane on it.
She climbed out from the launch with good authority, but right off the bat I knew I had too much throw on it. It was quite responsive to input, and I knew I'd need to dial it down a bit. Had to put a lot of trim into elevator to get the nose down. I flew it for about 2 1/2 minutes or so, getting it trimmed. Now I decided to sweep it around and do a high speed pass to see what it could do. Unfortunately as I started to get the thing wound up, I suddenly saw a small amount of debris exiting the plane. I had no idea what had come apart, but I decided to shut her down, and do an immediate landing. One go around, and then a non-event landing.
On inspection, it turned out to be one of wing panels that cover the servo's etc. that had blown apart. I should have known better, but I flew it without covering over the holes where the wheels would have retracted into had I left on the retracts. I guess air got in there, and tore the depron apart. Won't be too hard off a fix.
So, for the most part, a success. She certainly looked the part while it was airborne!!!
Jag
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Old May 18, 2009, 08:19 PM
Joined Jul 2007
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Hey Jag, good onya. Congrats on first maiden.
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Old May 18, 2009, 08:50 PM
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Gongrats Jag!!
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