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Old May 30, 2008, 03:02 PM
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2.4 Ghz (ordering to Europe)

It's been discussed before I'm sure, but I can't seem to find a thread specifically on this.

Are 2.4 Ghz TX's ordered from the U.S. legal in Europe? Is there a transmission strength difference or anything?

Thanks
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Old May 30, 2008, 03:05 PM
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No! There are a number of differences the main one being EIRP.

regards Peter
ps If the Tx does not have a CE mark and an accident resulted in the UK you could be liable and your model insurance invalid.
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Old May 30, 2008, 03:09 PM
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1. NO !!!

2. YES if its the JR or Spektrum system. I cannot comment on FAASST
2a. The US standards are FCC15.247 and this equated to EN300-440. All well and good as this is allowed as long as it is less than 10mW. To be able to use 100mW, it needs to meet EN300-328 v1.7.1, BUT.... this is only PART OF the suite of standards it must comply to.

The basic tests are:

EN 300-328 v.1.7.1
EN 301-489-1
EN 301-489-17

LVD so that could be EN60950 or 50371 et al

So even a "powered down" US sourced system is UNLIKELY to be EU compliant.

You don't state what country you are in as that has other implications re 2.4 GHz.
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Old May 30, 2008, 03:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter Seddon
No! There are a number of differences the main one being EIRP.

regards Peter
ps If the Tx does not have a CE mark and an accident resulted in the UK you could be liable and your model insurance invalid.
Thanks that's the best answer I've found... all others (in other forums) have been like "maybe not", "transmission strength might be different", "I've no problems", yada yada

You hit the nail on the head with the insurance point. Didn't come to think of it, but of course. Too much on my mind, I should have thought of that.

Well that's the way it is with anything that transmitts radio waves even if there is no technical difference. It has to be approved to be used, period.

What's "EIRP" by the way?

Thanks
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Old May 30, 2008, 03:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mac_man
2. YES if its the JR or Spektrum system. I cannot comment on FAASST
...
You don't state what country you are in as that has other implications re 2.4 GHz.
Really??
I'm in Finland. Everything should be by EU rules, especially for something as common as 2.4 Ghz.

So I could legally order a Spektrum then?

Btw I haven't been to the field yet (well twice a while ago), so haven't asked around and I need to complete an order for other stuff soon.

Thanks
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Old May 30, 2008, 03:36 PM
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I just found this on the Spektrum website faq:
Quote:
Can I use my Spektrum equipment in races outside the USA? - 12/28/2007 1:57:27 PM

The easiest answer to this is yes and no. Whether you can use Spektrum is determined by each country’s version of the FCC. Spektrum has gained widespread approval world-wide, but there are still some countries where Spektrum has not been approved. The best advice is to check with the organizers of the event you’ll be attending to verify whether Spektrum has been approved.
In the least this seems to imply that a CE label is not required... as long as the tech is officially approved. I've seen both FASST and Spektrum on sale here before.

And the obvious paradox here is that wireless laptops using 2.4 Gig (and near identical protocol) circle the globe everyday.

I'm surprised that every RC forum does not have a sticky on this issue with officially verified info on this for various countries. Instead we have just rumours floating around about this.
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Old May 30, 2008, 03:47 PM
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You can "legally" use a Spektrum Tx IF bought from an authorised dealer within the EU. This way it SHOULD have been subjected to all the relevant tests required.

As a quick guideline, have a look at the Robbe site and download the Declarations of Conformity for the Futaba FAAST systems. There you will see exactly to what standards they have been tested to. Remember that FCC 15.247 is NOT the same as 300-328 etc etc.

For example... http://data.robbe-online.net/robbe_p...20_1-F8050.pdf
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Old May 30, 2008, 03:51 PM
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The reason for asking what country is that currently, 2.4 GHz for RC (at 100mW) is not legal in certain countries ie Belgium, Austria and I think Spain, but I could be very wrong . France has a split band and that has 2 power levels.....! You must verify with your national body whether it is legal or not.
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Old May 30, 2008, 04:01 PM
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Oh and another thing.... Spektrum messed up big style with CE labelling systems in the USA

http://www.horizonhobby.com/Articles...ArticleID=1716

Plus there is a glaring error in that reference..... amazing what you find.
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Old May 30, 2008, 04:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mac_man
You can "legally" use a Spektrum Tx IF bought from an authorised dealer within the EU. This way it SHOULD have been subjected to all the relevant tests required.
Yeah, it makes radio waves, therefore it has to be imported by an authorized source. Just the way it is.

For obvious reasons wireless computers are standardized globally... can't expect the same thing for RC radios even if they are 2.4 gig.

It's not that big a deal. I'll buy the radio here. The exact model I wanted isn't available and my last "special order" took over a month, so I'm not doing that again. I'll get a different model locally.

You guys pointed out some things relating to this I had not considered.

I'll stop wining. By the way, I buy lots of stuff locally. Usually order from US if there is something specific I can't find (then I tend to throw in other things I needed along with it).

Cheers
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Old May 30, 2008, 04:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mac_man
Oh and another thing.... Spektrum messed up big style with CE labelling systems in the USA

http://www.horizonhobby.com/Articles...ArticleID=1716

Plus there is a glaring error in that reference..... amazing what you find.
Interesting. Good find.
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Old May 30, 2008, 04:44 PM
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For obvious reasons wireless computers are standardized globally... can't expect the same thing for RC radios even if they are 2.4 gig.
Actually they aren't ! Next time you set up a wireless system, look carefully at the setup instructions... remember when it asks you to select your country ...... that sets the relevant power level and (in the case of France) the correct frequency band !
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Last edited by theaton56; May 30, 2008 at 04:45 PM. Reason: correction
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Old May 30, 2008, 05:56 PM
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I didn't know it was doing anything to the standard when you choose the country. Well relatively speaking only slight changes (with the exception of France)... but changes that make a difference.

You ever heard anything about complaints of signal strength being low with the euro standard to the extent that it causes problems?

I recall now that a guy from France on another forum was making a big deal about how many problems he has with his 2.4 Ghz... hmmm. And everyone else in the forum was saying he was just talking nonsense because no one else had experienced anything of the sort with the same radio. hmmm.. He was talking about reception problems.
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Old May 30, 2008, 06:46 PM
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To date I haven't heard or seen any complaints on systems running the EU levels. There where earlier problems but these where predominantly due to power problems. But as more people use it, they become more aware of the "issues" and are effectively doing proper installs.

In a nutshell, if you have a weak power system it would cause problems as the receivers rebooted. Considering that the receivers are basically CPU's, there is a finite reboot time to scan and acquire the transmitter signal. In the "old days" with crystal based fixed frequency systems, they were more resilient and problems would be seen as a quick glitch.

2.4 GHz is a much more efficient RF system. The wavelength is a matter of 12 cms and is easier to match the antenna to both the receiver & transmitter, a quarter wave antenna is now 3 cms long. On 35 MHz, ideally you would need an antenna length of
2.1 metres. Rather large & cumbersome, so they use a 1 metre antenna and compensate electronically. This is a lossy system and not efficient, the antenna has a -ve gain !

On 2.4 Ghz, the basic antenna on the transmitter has a gain of about 2.2 dB.
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Old May 30, 2008, 06:58 PM
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Cool thanks.

Yeah people do installation errors; antenna position and angles... including the angle of the TX antenna. And there's that 4.8v bat issue... easily resolved.

Cheers
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