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Old May 28, 2008, 11:20 AM
Philippians 4:13
Seward, NE
Joined Nov 2006
5,739 Posts
Build Log
How to Make Ailerons (Brushless SuperCub)

I decided that my 2nd super cub needed a park 480 and ailerons instead of simply running the stock motor/gearbox with Lipo and Spektrum.
This is what is powering it now...
1800-2200 mAh Lipo
E-flite 40amp esc
E-Flite Park 480
APC-E 10x5 prop
Now using GWS 10x6DD prop. (better vertical, better flight at slow speeds)
(4) S-75 Servos
AR6200 Receiver
Weight is 578 grams without battery (20.4 ounces)
I used Chuck's guide for installing the motor: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/member.php?u=106813 You will have to look through his archives to find it... I think he posted it back in 2006 or 2007.


With the above setup, this plane flies nice and slow like the original Super Cub but it will handle a stiff wind as well. I am also able to carry a pretty heavy camera with the extra power that the motor provides. It will go vertical (forever) but not quite like a 3D plane. I am really happy with the results!

This blog entry is a work in progress. Eventually, I will include some video.
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Old May 28, 2008, 11:30 AM
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I love work that is precise, and clean. What a GREAT job!!!!!!!!!

Excellent work...

Chuck
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Old May 28, 2008, 09:25 PM
Philippians 4:13
Seward, NE
Joined Nov 2006
5,739 Posts
Thanks Chuck for the plans in your blog for mounting this motor. The only thing that I had to change was the motor mount... the one that you have listed was a little too small for the 480 :-) I ended up using the mount that came with the new motor instead. Did you ever think about using the aluminum spacers that came with the motor instead of the nylon ones? I almost cut them down but thought the nylon ones would help absorb impact a little more than the aluminum ones! Hopefully I won't ever have to worry about that anyway!!!
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Old May 28, 2008, 09:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ty_horn
Did you ever think about using the aluminum spacers that came with the motor instead of the nylon ones? I almost cut them down but thought the nylon ones would help absorb impact a little more than the aluminum ones! Hopefully I won't ever have to worry about that anyway!!!
Since the nylon ones were the correct length to start, and wider than the aluminum ones, I went with the nylon for strength.

Chuck
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Old May 29, 2008, 04:12 AM
Real Time Recon
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smith mt. lake VA.
Joined Jan 2007
8,258 Posts
ty,in my opinion u have used the BEST elect. power system known to man in the S.C. mod.Good luck w/ her in the years to come ! ...RTR
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Old May 29, 2008, 08:45 AM
Philippians 4:13
Seward, NE
Joined Nov 2006
5,739 Posts
that sure is good to hear. thanks!
:-)
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Old Jun 16, 2008, 01:36 AM
Prop me up
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New Mexico, USA
Joined Oct 2007
2,358 Posts
Ty, nice looking ailerons! Very neatly done.
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Old Jun 23, 2008, 05:33 PM
AMA 1042906
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United States, KS, Derby
Joined Mar 2008
1,115 Posts
ty,

I am in the beginning phase of installing ailerons on my SC. Your word picture is going to be very helpful.

What did you do to remove most or all of the dihedral in the wing? I picked up a new wing and carbon fiber rod today to begin the process.

Allan
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Old Aug 14, 2008, 03:33 PM
Philippians 4:13
Seward, NE
Joined Nov 2006
5,739 Posts
swimmer,
I just now realized that you posted your question. I don't know why the new post never showed up on my end. Anyway, I didn't remove any dihedral at all. I haven't felt like I need to. I am able to fly this plane all day inverted and I can fly figure 8's all over the place while in a knife edge. This is a great plane.
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Old Sep 03, 2010, 03:11 PM
Mark
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Cleveland
Joined Jul 2010
6 Posts
I know this post has been cold for two years now, but I just recently got an HZSC and am in the process of implementing the same kind of mods to mine. You did really beautiful work, Ty. As I've been studying your excellent photos, though, something has been bothering me, and I'm hoping that, with all of the experience I'm sure you've racked up on it by now, you can set my concerns aside.

Some aileron mods I've seen have beveled the ailerons in the center so that they pivot equally in both up and down directions (i.e., balanced), whereas yours are beveled from the top. Although your method is definitely more attractive, leaving only a gap on the underside of the wing, I can't help but wonder that the aerodynamic effects are not balanced when banking either left or right.

In a left bank for instance, the left aileron is deflected entirely above the wing surface, bringing the full 1.25" control surface into the air flow over the wing. At the same time, the right aileron will be dropping below the wing, by the same angle, but with less than the full depth of the aileron exposed to the air flow. With the left wing pushing down more strongly than the right wing is pushing up, I would imagine you'd get some kind of force imbalance. What has been your experience? From an appearance standpoint I'd like to go your route but since there have been no comments about how well it performs I'm just a little hesitant.

Thanks!
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Old Sep 03, 2010, 10:49 PM
Philippians 4:13
Seward, NE
Joined Nov 2006
5,739 Posts
hummm, good question... I have a feeling that since this is a slower and more gentle flying plane, you wouldn't notice the difference. You are absolutely right in your wondering though. Now you have got me wondering :-) When I made those ailerons, I based it on how PZ cut their ailerons on the t-28 which flies beautifully! I am kind of thinking that it wouldn't make much of a difference eventhough logic would tell you otherwise. Either way, mine is still flying beautifully and I have not crashed once since I built this one. It still looks brand new. I guess I love the way that it flies so much that I don't fly it very often
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Old Sep 07, 2010, 12:12 PM
Mark
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Cleveland
Joined Jul 2010
6 Posts
Ty, your tutorial and pics were a real inspiration and I can't thank you enough for taking the time to explain it so clearly. Even with the uncertainty about the balance issue it looked like too elegant a solution to not work.

I finished my wing mods this Saturday and took it up for a test flight that same evening. The Gods must have been just as curious as I was to see how it would fly because although it had been 15mph+ winds all day, just as I finished and looked outside at the trees not a leaf was stirring so to the park I raced!

I cut my ailerons the same way you did and used Duck brand packing tape for the hinges. I mounted my servos on their sides instead of vertically so that their arms rotate around an axis parallel to that of the control surfaces, to minimize binding.

I also installed 6" flaps using the same procedure, so my ailerons are only 11" long, by 1.75" deep.

I ran the flaps off the 5th channel on my DX5e (AR500 gear channel) and the default 60 degree servo rotation got scaled down to about 40 degrees of actual flap rotation through judicious location of the servo arms and control horns.

I mounted the aileron horns as far back from the trailing edge as I could to maximize their throw but I was concerned that it looked like they wouldn't be very effectual. Fully downward deflected they just didn't protrude very far from the underside of the wing. They just looked kind of aerodynamically insignificant, albeit very *pretty*. The flaps didn't look very big either but I was less concerned about too little flap effect. It turned out my concerns were misplaced. :-)

My first ROG takeoff was a bit awkward as I was not accustomed to taxiing from the left stick, but I had the flaps engaged and the cub literally jumped into the air after about 20 feet. At 100' I cut the flaps and pulled back the throttle to about 50% and got ready for the hard part.

I was really nervous about going into my first bank. I thought for sure the ailerons would be ineffectual and that the plane would take too much room to bank, causing me to have to use my dumb-thumb rudder to fix things. To my surprise and delight when I gave just a medium sized nudge to my right stick along with a touch of up elevator she came right around smoothly and with much authority. Man was I instantly psyched! You could have seen the grin on my face from across the field. Without touching the rudder I was zipping all around the field, with much more responsiveness than I had ever had with the rudder, and it seemed very stable throughout.

I have to say that, as fine a flyer as the Super Cub was before this modification, she now just seemed *right*. I had never had a single problem with rudder turns in the past and they had become second nature after 48 flights, but the appearance of the plane doing a bank turn with ailerons now made me realize what she had been wanting to do all along. I tried some coordinated turns but I have no idea what I'm doing and it didn't look like it made much difference. I tried to do a roll and totally flubbed it. I then tried to go inverted but no matter how much I pushed up on the stick I could not make her level out let alone climb out of the slow dive she was in and I came within four feet of the ground under full power before I could get her to roll right side up. I'm not sure what I'm doing wrong - maybe all that dihedral and lack of airfoil on the under side of the wing just make her less suited to inverted flight?

When I decided to bring her in, I lined her up and kicked in the flaps and she really slowed down and seemed to just tip toe down the field toward the landing zone. She did lose altitude a lot faster though so I had to manage the throttle a little more than I'm used to. When landing I got confused and defaulted to using my right thumb to keep her lined up, and she waddled around quite a bit before she touched down, but the roll out is really short now which is nice for small parking lot landings.

I really have to work at refining my new left thumb rudder skills, but it was a truly exhilarating and totally successful first aileron flight.

Thanks again for your great plans and tutorial. It gave me a lot of confidence in making the first mods I've ever made to a still fairly new and greatly enjoyed airplane.

Mark
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Old Sep 07, 2010, 01:08 PM
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Congratulations!!!!!
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Old Sep 07, 2010, 02:10 PM
Philippians 4:13
Seward, NE
Joined Nov 2006
5,739 Posts
Yeehaaaaaaaaa!
I know exactly what the smile on your face looked like because when I was reading about your adventure, I found myself smiling just as big as I did when I flew mine for the first time with ailerons :-)

you should be able to fly inverted pretty easily... your CG may be a little off. I know what you mean about the ailerons looking like they won't have much authority but it is amazing how so little goes so far. Your roll rate will be pretty slow and rolls will look better as you get used to throwing a little rudder in with them since the roll rate is slower. Faster rolling planes seem to look better because the roll so fast that the plane doesn't have a chance to drop like a slower moving plane does.

As for flaps, I have noticed that it takes a little more throttle with the flaps on but the plane still moves slower than if they were not on. I don't have them on my SC but my t-28 slows down very very nicely with them. But if I don't give a little throttle when flaps are applied, the plane drops a little at first.

I am so happy that you have found success with your ailerons. Trust me that your left thumb will catch up to your right. It has been a few years since I flew with ailerons for my first time but now I find myself having a harder time flying without them because I try to use my left thumb to "steer" and nothing happens :-)
It all becomes natural with time.
Have fun and Thank You.
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Old Sep 25, 2010, 05:15 PM
CLUB GITMO
Sunspot's Avatar
Little Rock National Airport
Joined Nov 2003
704 Posts
Factory SC wing with servos.

Someone mentioned a factory SC wing with ailerons and servos installed.
Where can one buy these. I have upgraded to brushless and looking for another mod.
Thanks
Spot
PS.
First post in several years.....
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