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Old May 21, 2008, 03:31 PM
Lori, hey, you're home early
CarreraGTSCS's Avatar
United States, NJ, Trenton
Joined Jan 2004
9,052 Posts
Rant
No more $200 foamies!

Here's my rant: I can't be the only one here that's getting tired of the trend towards higher and higher priced foamies. What's going on here? How did a pound of styrofoam get so expensive? I have no choice but to pay almost $4.00 a gallon for gas but I do have a choice when it comes to the hobby. No more ridiculously priced foamies for me. If it's not GWS-priced then it's not for me.

Here's a couple of examples: I really want the Art Tech Su-27 that HL sells. $250 with tx/rx/servos and by all accounts, marginal fans, motors and lipo. No way. The new Sapac Gripen. $230 with 70mm fan and motor, Sureflight-type foam finish. No thank you. FlyFly Mig-29. $260 with 92mm fans and no motors. It's big with nice detail but How Much? I don't think so.


I have a really nice Multiplex EVO 9 and other gear so I don't want (low tech) TX/RX/servos. I also don't want the marginal motors, fans and lipos. Now that I've experienced WeMo and HET I'm done with the low quality control parts.

Ok, so I'm a big fan in general of the GWS airframes. I just bought a J-10 and it is an impressive model. It's big, made of nice foam and has nice molded in details. For $60 for an NPS kit who can complain?

If we keep supporting the companies in China that insist on loading the airframes with el cheapo electronics they'll keep sending them. I don't care about their profit margins. I bust my @$$ 12 to 14 hours a day at work so they're not getting any more of my US$$.

I like that HL is carrying the airframe parts for the StarMax Gripen and the Rafale. Probably others too. A week or two ago I preordered the Rafale airframe parts. Thanks to HL for thinking of us. Sapac does sell the Eurofighter airframe only too. That's a nice one.

This is probably just my reaction to escalating gasoline prices but I'm done throwing $$ away on stuff that I won't use just to preserve someone else's profits.

Mike
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Last edited by CarreraGTSCS; May 21, 2008 at 03:46 PM. Reason: punctuation
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Old May 21, 2008, 03:39 PM
Registered User
Joined Dec 2005
1,312 Posts
I agree w you,I look at the prices of foam now and back away. I can buy a nice 40 sized glow plane for $150,and its covered and made w balsa. Plus retracts,scale looks and more power!!! Another plus is the durabilty factor(if you dont crash too hard)
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Old May 21, 2008, 04:36 PM
I cant land there!
neonbjb's Avatar
Anaheim, CA
Joined Jan 2008
300 Posts
Ya, I'll sign on this. I will never buy any of SAPAC's jets, for instance, because I think it is just ludicrous to pay that much for foam, no matter how well designed or how quality it is. I think you were also succinct in the fact that a big reason for the prices nowadays is the crappy packaged electronics that many enthusiasts just crate from day one. If I spend over 100 bucks on a foam jet, I actually kind of expect it to be pre-glassed at the very least (like that will ever happen ); because most of the time that is what I end up doing anyhow (spending ~$40-50 in the process).
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Old May 21, 2008, 04:42 PM
UK Commercial RPAS Pilot
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United Kingdom, England, Carlisle
Joined Mar 2007
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Alfa anybody?
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Old May 21, 2008, 05:06 PM
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ATIS's Avatar
New Bern, North Carolina, United States
Joined Oct 2004
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I'm done with foam as well unless the price comes down... I have the SAPAC F-22 and its a great plane and flys great (Bought the ARF)...have a A-10, Kyosho f-16 and A-6, the Art Tech SU-27 (upgraded) and I agree that for the price I shouldnt need to upgrade. I currently am on my second EFlite AT-6.... yes she is a prop but she is awesome and the detail is incredible...she handles the wind and tracks great but in total I have $700 in her to make her fly so its a trade off either way but if I crash her (like the first one...radios have timers for a reason) its $170 for a complete fuse/wings/stabs... so its worth it to me.
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Old May 21, 2008, 05:33 PM
Micro Boat Forum Founder
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United States, GA, Buford
Joined Nov 2007
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Some of us are begginners and would really like a plane that actually doesnt have a visible prop. But I bet that for some of us the plane doesnt make it back home after the first, second, or third flight.
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Old May 21, 2008, 05:39 PM
Targeted and... FIRING !
D B Cooper's Avatar
United States, MI, Eastpointe
Joined Aug 2007
670 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by phoenix racing
Alfa anybody?

Lately I've gone into the sickbay and dug out my crashed Alfas. Resurrected the Mig; but made the mistake of attempting another hand launch with it. Dunno if it'll get re-built again... maybe. probably not. But I have patched up the old A4 (twice now) and the Sabre I dumped over the wintertime. But I doubt I'll be buying any more thin foam-skinned airframes at the kind of prices they're running. I'll be going with either reasonably-priced solid foam, glass, or wood airframes for a while. I love the detailed looks and smooth flight characteristics of the Alfas, but the sheet foam just doesn't repair very well. With any luck I've gotten over having pushrods come off in flight and hitting trees, soccer goals, and the occasional basketball court anyway lol. Hope so cause I'm not anteing up to stay in the $200 foamie club again anytime soon.
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Old May 21, 2008, 06:24 PM
6 months to finish a rtf
pulsery2k1's Avatar
upstate ny
Joined Jun 2003
1,842 Posts
Over Priced Foam

Well it nice to see other's that are also fed up with these company's telling us what to buy, if we tell the company's making these over priced plane's
we won't buy them till they also sell them as arf for those of us who
take out thair idear of eletronics and just sell us the airframe, and
alfa , would you buy a car to which there are no spare parts??
I love gws they got hint now they sell all there models with the no
power system option , and if you notice that's the one sold out.
and they sell spare parts.
at the start of this season , first day my 3-4 year old wattage
turbo vector finally came to it's end, looking at replacing it and all
these 200+ air frames I decited to build a new one (bought 4 at
$29 when they were on sale) and thought about fixing all the thing's
I didn't like, 1 poorly made tail , having to add 2 oz of weight to nose,
not slowing easily for landing , don't get me wrong so far this
has to be the best edf I've owned ,great flying plane so maybe
I can improve . I started with a 3/32 balsa sheet ,cut vector's
nose section in half opened battery area so it can take larger
battery's , increased lenght, moved stab down, incresed the wing
span , added flaparons, haven't decided on power yet , trying to
rewind my also departed little jet screamer , the brushed version did
70- 80 mph wot , so with new tech and brushless hopfully it will
go alot faster
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Old May 21, 2008, 06:27 PM
Member 120mph Club
ATIS's Avatar
New Bern, North Carolina, United States
Joined Oct 2004
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boredom.is.me
Some of us are begginners and would really like a plane that actually doesnt have a visible prop. But I bet that for some of us the plane doesnt make it back home after the first, second, or third flight.
Understood...but foam EDF's are getting out of hand and to get any real "jet" perfromance out of them, they all seem to need an upgrade...

I too dislike props on jets but the EDF prices have climbed fast and 4s set ups to get the power are expensive which is why I am moving back to props but going with balsa over foam...
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Old May 21, 2008, 06:36 PM
Eggs @ Tea
Dover DE USA
Joined Feb 2007
506 Posts
im feeling the same way Atis..... do not forget tho not mention but my 100 dollar L-39 from Great Planes is probably and arguebly the bang for the buck plane.... crashed mine a total of 3 times trying to get the C/G with all the neat gadgets totalling $200 im using but she flew AWESOME when the C/g was right.... even with the Cheapo GWS dreamstarter radio i had laying around was sufficient..... I learned that ZAP and KICKER , they are my best friends for the z-foam this planes uses....
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Old May 21, 2008, 06:54 PM
Member 120mph Club
ATIS's Avatar
New Bern, North Carolina, United States
Joined Oct 2004
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SC2... true, a buddy has that one and it flys good...of course he's a speed freak so its doomed to get modded... the Eflite F-15 might be one of the "best" EDF's for stock performance....but I have only seen the promotional videos

The ones I own:

GWS A-10... have to go BL and use high KV lite motors and keep her lite
GWS F-15... replace the stock motors... too high of a KV (which is why mine sits)
Kyosho F-16...flys great... but expensive
kyosho A-6...flys great...but expensive
Art Tech SU-27... needs better motors, ESC, and lipo... but flys great once modded
Sapac F-22... replace ESC's, add CC BEC, go 4s... flys awesome

But again... all cost up front and then you have to drop more money to get them to fly...the HP F-16 is suppose to be good out of the box but never seen it fly but it has a following...
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Old May 21, 2008, 07:16 PM
Targeted and... FIRING !
D B Cooper's Avatar
United States, MI, Eastpointe
Joined Aug 2007
670 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by ATIS
...the HP F-16 is suppose to be good out of the box but never seen it fly but it has a following...
I've seen two fly stock and one modded. This particular plane really does deserve the following it's earned. I haven't picked one up myself (yet) but the peer pressure is strong lol. The two guys I fly with have them and really love them.
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Old May 21, 2008, 07:29 PM
Si Vis Pacem Para Bellum!
Doubletap's Avatar
PRC (People's Republic of Commiefornia)
Joined Jul 2005
9,602 Posts
The Fix: Vote with your buying habits!

There appears to be a trend developing, and it's driven by demand. We've seen an explosion of new foamie EDF models just recently in the last year but mostly in the last 6 months. The manufacturers/vendors will always try to get as much as they can and if the market (we the consumers) keeps shelling out the money they ask, they will continue to raise their prices. It's all about supply and demand in a free market. This is why I refuse to purchase any of the overpriced RTF or ARF models as these have the highest profit margin for the manufacturers/vendors and the lowest value for the consumers because they are loaded with what amounts to poor quality/performing electronics and power systems. The bare foam kits are already ridiculously overpriced and the loaded ones are even more so. How do I know this? Based on my understanding of economics, business, manufacturing, trade, comparison with other Chinese made hobby products, etc. etc. Most people intuitively have a feeling for what things are worth and in particular Chinese made stuff where the average per capita income of the individual there is a tiny fraction of what ours is here in the US. Vote with your wallets and the prices will moderate.

Thanks for bringing up this subject!

Doubletap
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Old May 21, 2008, 07:45 PM
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stacker's Avatar
Salt Lake City Utah
Joined Mar 2004
3,297 Posts
They are way overpriced.

I've not bought into the ready to fly stuff yet. All the bad gear that people have to rip out just to get a plane that will fly. Got to give GWS some credit on this one, esp. since they sell no-power setups and slope gliders. I think the last 262 kit was 29.99 with no gear but it's a great starting point. Just to much bad quality stuff out there to throw $$$ for a one second flight. I've also been pretty pissed on some of GWS gear, esp. their speed controllers and there motors. Must not forget about the off-center fan adaptors and the thin plastic that melts like ice cream in the sun, but at least it's not 200+ ice cream.

Guess I'll have another glass of wine --- Stacker
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Old May 21, 2008, 08:00 PM
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lavochkin's Avatar
Mokena,Illinois -United States
Joined Oct 2006
5,826 Posts
I agree 100%!! I put more work into the foamies now than anything. It takes time to fill,fix,paint and glass the airframes so they live for more than one season. Its nuts to pay this much for foam. Even though I have it doesnt mean that it doesnt get me po'd.
Especially when you want a specific model that is not produced except for one company. For 250.00$$ You should be getting hitec servo's,Castle creations or equivelant name brand esc's and bec's, a good fan het/wemo etc... and a real motor!!!
You know these companies dont pay what we pay for all the electronics. They buy in bulk and get HUGE discounts. Its a bunch of b/s to spend this much just to have to pull everything out cause its not up to par. Malfunctioning crappy servos, motors that blow, etc.... At the very least they should be providing motors that will give the model at least 1.1 thrust to weight ratio's. I have a huge pile of sub par esc's,motors,and servos that I wont even sell cause I'd be ripping you off! All the remnants of the crap electronics. I got hosed on the sapac eurofighter big time!! I pre-ordered the airframe only version before it came out and (it was an option)!! When it came time to receive it I was forced to buy the receiver ready version. So instead of $115.00 I had to spend $200.00 for crap that I didnt even want. Just more garbage for the landfills to pollute earth with! Granted I didnt have to buy anything. But I wanted this model for sooo long I wound up giving in. I'm not saying anything bad about sapac models as they are great models made out of good foam. But damn man, real nice way of taking advantage of customers. There excuse was "we didnt know" they were shipping only receiver ready versions....B/S!!! How could you not know and call yourself a company?
Is there no communication....I think there is. But this is how the "MAN" gets ya! I'm tired of taking it in the end bent over the barstool from these companies. We the consumers need to speak up. After all they are only flying beer coolers! A bunch of insulation with wings is all.
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