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Old Dec 11, 2012, 11:10 PM
Aaron
Realms's Avatar
Australia
Joined Aug 2012
1,654 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Justwingit View Post
Spektrum lost links have been responsible for lots of smashed up models....that's a fact. For all those AR600 users with the satellite recvr's: why do you think they went to satellite recvr's in the first place? Because they knew they were junk. That's a fact. Not conjecture.

Lots of folks have been using Spektrum for years, with great results. That's awesome! But to sit there and say a guy with Carlos' reputation doesn't know how to set up a model is just plain nuts. He's been a staple in these Groups for years, and knows how to fly to boot.

Y'all can say what you want. If Carlos says it was the recv'r, than I believe it was the recv'r. There's just way too many instances on these threads of folks loosing their models to the Spektrum plague. Very seldom, if ever, do you hear the same about Futaba or even cheap little ol' Tactic, for that matter.

Everybody on these threads wants to be an expert....got it. Unfortunately, the numbers are on my side. More modellers loose their planes to Spektrum more than any other brand. Carlos is just the latest victim.

Sorry for the rant --- I'm not trying to peeve off anybody. Really, I'm not. Although, if I were Carlos I'd be pretty peeved off myself because someone implied I couldn't fly, or it was the ESC, or anything, just anything but the precious Spektrum radio system.

To each his own; if you fly on Spektrum and love it, than great. Keep flying on it. I personally have been flying since the Galloping Ghost days. My father taught me to fly on a single channel pulse-proportional radio system back in the early 70's. I've been around this hobby for a couple of days. I'm not terribly impressed with Spektrum.

Just my .02...

Cheers everyone, and happy flying....on whatever radio system you happen to use
Just remember how many people that are new to the hobby use Spektrum over the more pro brands... coincidence?
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Old Dec 12, 2012, 04:07 AM
Right Rudder
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USA, FL, Orlando
Joined Nov 2010
9,196 Posts
Lets Clear the Air.

Guys,

Sorry, I did not mean to start any controversy over my Model going down.

All I am saying "is" the BIND PLUG got jammed and caused damage to the AR600 circuit board underneath the pins. Whenever you need to use pliers then, the possibility of your Receiver to get damage is pretty high. I am just alerting all of you out there to be careful with inserting BIND plugs. If it is not going in smoothing then, do not insert.

My oldest T-28 NAVY is flying with the Castle Creations BERG 4-Channel DSP 72Mhz FM Modulation Receiver and controlled by the JR XP-7202 with fantastic results and if the AIRFORCE will be repaired back to flight worthy condition then, this is exactly how the model will be flown in the future.

GOODBY Spektrum for me....all I am saying, understand.

Okay a few pictures!

First, there were about 3 other models beside mine that crashed (The Gods were angry !) One of which I did not take a picture as the owner left in a hurry due to the shock!













Here are some wide angled Pictures of my T-28D Airforce Post Crash:


















Battery was the Hammer and survived well.



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Old Dec 12, 2012, 04:16 AM
Right Rudder
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USA, FL, Orlando
Joined Nov 2010
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T-28D Crash Continued.....

Some closeup pictures of the E-Flite 30-AMP ESC Crash Damage and AR600.

This model hit mother Earth with such a force that the E-Flite 30-AMP ESC got completely distorted and MECHANICALLY Blew UP as I found the Aluminum Plate that is glued on the FETs a few feet away!





After Bending it back a little......











Using a powerful light and magnifying glass, Mark and I found the BIND pins on the AR600 Bent and Circuit board with a noticeable layer that was not right and perhaps caused a bad situation in the air after 25 seconds.

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Old Dec 12, 2012, 04:19 AM
Right Rudder
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USA, FL, Orlando
Joined Nov 2010
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T-28D Crash Continued..;..

My friend, Mark was so disgusted about my crash and felt so sorry that he gave me a new GWS P-51D Mustang to heal the soul.

Oh, this one has GWS Retracts!

Thank you Mark!

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Old Dec 12, 2012, 07:05 AM
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Manassas, Virginia
Joined May 2008
420 Posts
Here are a few more facts:
1. There is a big difference between the AR600 and the AR6200 (now AR6210).
2. The probability of a single point failure design failing. is 1 in 100 if it has 99% reliability.
The probability of a redundant design failing, if it is made of two 99% reliability parts is 1 in 10,000.

Opinion: I will choose the 1 in 10,000 odds every time.
Fact: I always buy a receiver with a satellite because I never want a failure in that part. Fact: I have never had a failure in 1,000 flights.
Opinion: If anyone always blames something or someone else for every failure they will never improve themselves.
Fact: I have had 2 crashes in those 1,000 flights. They were my fault for flying downwind too slow and too low to the ground to recover. I learned to fly a little faster in high winds on the downwind leg of an approach and to make wide turns in high winds.

One last fact: There is a $20 difference in cost between a AR6210 and AR600. Many crashes cost more than $20.
Opinion: I never try to save money buy buying a cheap receiver of any brand. Fact: that has paid off for me.
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Old Dec 12, 2012, 07:07 AM
Right Rudder
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USA, FL, Orlando
Joined Nov 2010
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GCplane View Post
Here are a few more facts:
1. There is a big difference between the AR600 and the AR6200 (now AR6210).
2. The probability of a single point failure design failing. is 1 in 100 if it has 99% reliability.
The probability of a redundant design failing, if it is made of two 99% reliability parts is 1 in 10,000.

Opinion: I will choose the 1 in 10,000 odds every time.
Fact: I always buy a receiver with a satellite because I never want a failure in that part. Fact: I have never had a failure in 1,000 flights.
Opinion: I a person always blames something or someone else for every failure they will never improve themselves.
Fact: I have had 2 crashes in those 1,000 flights. They were my fault for flying downwind too slow and two low to the ground to recover. I learned to fly a little faster in high winds on the downwind leg of an approach and to make wide turns in high winds.
Where is this coming from? Why?
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Old Dec 12, 2012, 08:21 AM
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United States, FL, Port St Lucie
Joined Jan 2011
153 Posts
Pitt, wow sorry about the crash. Looks almost identical to how my T-28 crashed last, even down to the way the fuse split apart. Mine also damaged the motor, and esc pretty much the same. After a little hot water, some GG, and some time mine is almost ready to fly again. Just got to repaint it. Hopefully you will have no troubles repairing yours!
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Old Dec 12, 2012, 08:24 AM
Right Rudder
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USA, FL, Orlando
Joined Nov 2010
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Quote:
Originally Posted by campbellj View Post
Pitt, wow sorry about the crash. Looks almost identical to how my T-28 crashed last, even down to the way the fuse split apart. Mine also damaged the motor, and esc pretty much the same. After a little hot water, some GG, and some time mine is almost ready to fly again. Just got to repaint it. Hopefully you will have no troubles repairing yours!
Thanks Cambellj,

I have started the repairs once again late last night and I am very tired today

All I have to buy is a new Cowling as I already have a newer motor / esc in my hobby drawer.

Still can not believe how that ESC Mechanically Exploded on impact!!
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Old Dec 12, 2012, 09:23 AM
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United States, FL, Port St Lucie
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I had a similar crash the flight before the big crash and I'm thinking the first crash damaged the esc on mine and I overlooked it during that repair. After going through all those repairs, gluing the nose back, it wasn't completely off the first time. I used lightweight spackle, went the whole 9 yards to make it look like it never happened.

I was discusted after the next flight only lasted about 20 seconds and resulted identical to yours. I'm thinking a previously damaged esc caused it but I will never know for sure. The first crash was definitely dumb thumbs. It took me several days to just "get over it" and start the repairs again, but now that its almost done I'm excited to get her airborne again.

I just glued and taped my cowl back together on the inside and ordered all new electronics from headsup RC so I could convert it to a 4s setup. I put dowels in the nose to strengthen it, got an aluminum motor mount, put Carbon fiber rod across the wing for reinforcement. I think I'm actually going to glue the wing on this time with bathroom adhesive. Also got the parts to cut in flaps, but haven't got that far yet. I think I'm just going to get the wing on, paint it and give it a few flights before I cut the flaps.
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Old Dec 12, 2012, 09:53 AM
We got some flyin' to do!
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United States, CA, Fort Irwin
Joined Apr 2012
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Carlos,

Looks like you can save her !

Like alot of the guys on the thread have been saying, maybe some bamboo skewers and/or toothpicks in combo with some good ol' fashioned Gorilla Glue will do the trick! There will probably be some scars, but hey, maybe you can weather it a little bit and that might disguise some of the damage...

Anyway, overall not bad. I'm still sorry you were among the ones who stuffed theirs...never fun. But that P-51 does take a little of Murphy's sting away !

Happy flying all,
John
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Old Dec 12, 2012, 01:55 PM
Look ma, no hands!
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United States, WI, Sheboygan
Joined Aug 2011
1,252 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Realms View Post
Just remember how many people that are new to the hobby use Spektrum over the more pro brands... coincidence?
Actually I'm one of the noobs flying Spectrum, but honestly that's because by definition I'm just starting out and don't know any better!

If I'm ever caught criticizing another pilot wll someone please point me gently but firmly back to these pages to see how that turns out.

Many thanks to all those people on the forum who have saved me time and money not to mention embarrassment by sharing their learning experiences, good bad and ugly!

I will always have a lot to learn.
-grasshopper-
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Old Dec 12, 2012, 02:00 PM
I just want to go fly!
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United States, MD, Towson
Joined Aug 2012
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nice consolation mustang! sweet! good luck with the rebuild.
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Old Dec 12, 2012, 02:12 PM
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United States, NJ, Newark
Joined Nov 2005
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GCplane View Post
Here are a few more facts:
1. There is a big difference between the AR600 and the AR6200 (now AR6210).
2. The probability of a single point failure design failing. is 1 in 100 if it has 99% reliability.
The probability of a redundant design failing, if it is made of two 99% reliability parts is 1 in 10,000.

Opinion: I will choose the 1 in 10,000 odds every time.
Fact: I always buy a receiver with a satellite because I never want a failure in that part. Fact: I have never had a failure in 1,000 flights.
Opinion: If a person always blames something or someone else for every failure they will never improve themselves.
Fact: I have had 2 crashes in those 1,000 flights. They were my fault for flying downwind too slow and two low to the ground to recover. I learned to fly a little faster in high winds on the downwind leg of an approach and to make wide turns in high winds.

One last fact: There is a $20 difference in cost between a AR6210 and AR600. Many crashes cost more than $20.
Opinion: I never try to save money buy buying a cheap receiver of any brand. Fact: that has paid off for me.

you are just like me... i always buy spektrum... why? because i work for them? NO? because they are good as any other brands.. like i say before, ive seen people flying 300 dollars models with a 6 dollars orange receiver... and they work really good i have to say.. does it mean im going to switch.? NO... Why? cause my mom one day told me ( you cant fix whats broken) everytime i have a brand new 4 channel model, i get the AR400 for 30 bucks... and thats it... Futaba good, so i think we are in a moment right now where everything is really good.. solely based on my experience with my friends at the field) so thats it man.... again... im not an expert.. only 3 years with this hobby to be honest
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Old Dec 12, 2012, 02:17 PM
We got some flyin' to do!
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United States, CA, Fort Irwin
Joined Apr 2012
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We all have alot to learn....

Sage words, Pilgrim.

There comes a time in the hobby when pilots rarely stuff their models because of dumb thumbs...at a certain point, a pilot will become competent enough that crashes are usually only caused by mechanical failure vice operator error. That threshold is different for everyone, but Carlos has been flying for years....I doubt it was his thumbs. I'm one of those fools who actually logs all their flights on their models by date, time, batteries used, etc. I have well over 25 flight hours on my Trojan alone. Here in SoCal we're blessed with wonderful weather year-round, so when I'm not out in the desert playing Army, I'm usually flying to relieve the stress caused by playing Army...!

That said, we can all still learn each and every time we fly due to slightly different circumstances, winds, etc. I learn something everytime I go flying. Or usually do, anyway. I also try to work on new maneuvers. I like to fly my models scale, and the T-28 is great for that. Working in nice, scale, accurate Cuban Eights now, and will probably start to work on stall turns/tail-slides or whatever that little 180 turn at the top of a stall is called. (Actually, it's right before a stall...)

Anyhoo, the Parkzone T-28 is a wonderful model for whatever kind of flying and/or learning we want to do and I hope our friend Carlos gets his T-28D back up in the air soon --- especially since that model is discontinued and is probably somewhat of a collector's item now !

Cheers,
John
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Old Dec 12, 2012, 03:51 PM
Right Rudder
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USA, FL, Orlando
Joined Nov 2010
9,196 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Justwingit View Post
We all have alot to learn....

Sage words, Pilgrim.

There comes a time in the hobby when pilots rarely stuff their models because of dumb thumbs...at a certain point, a pilot will become competent enough that crashes are usually only caused by mechanical failure vice operator error. That threshold is different for everyone, but Carlos has been flying for years....I doubt it was his thumbs. I'm one of those fools who actually logs all their flights on their models by date, time, batteries used, etc. I have well over 25 flight hours on my Trojan alone. Here in SoCal we're blessed with wonderful weather year-round, so when I'm not out in the desert playing Army, I'm usually flying to relieve the stress caused by playing Army...!

That said, we can all still learn each and every time we fly due to slightly different circumstances, winds, etc. I learn something everytime I go flying. Or usually do, anyway. I also try to work on new maneuvers. I like to fly my models scale, and the T-28 is great for that. Working in nice, scale, accurate Cuban Eights now, and will probably start to work on stall turns/tail-slides or whatever that little 180 turn at the top of a stall is called. (Actually, it's right before a stall...)

Anyhoo, the Parkzone T-28 is a wonderful model for whatever kind of flying and/or learning we want to do and I hope our friend Carlos gets his T-28D back up in the air soon --- especially since that model is discontinued and is probably somewhat of a collector's item now !

Cheers,
John
John,

Thanks for those words of insight.

I wish it was my Thumbs otherwise, I would have not gone through the trouble of detailing what I did. Instead of my thumbs, it was my Gorilla hands that did my model in as I suspect on a high degree that I damaged the Receiver (AR600) trying to take out the jammed BIND Plug.

I have detailed my recent experience so, everyone that continues with Spektrum or other brand of Spectrum technology would be careful with the handling of these receivers and most especially during BIND procedure and inserting and taking out the BIND plug.

I have flown the Park Zone T-28's for over 6 years now and I come to many Electric Fly-In events to perform Knife Edge all around the field without taking the model out from "a" Knife Edge maneuver.

You can see from this Video what I mean. I am pretty sure those that have been frequenting this thread may have seen this video before.


Park Zone T-28 mini hidden camera 11-28-09.wmv (8 min 30 sec)
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