SMALL - espritmodel.com SMALL - Telemetry SMALL - Radio
Reply
Thread Tools
Old Mar 03, 2010, 06:02 PM
Registered User
Portland, OR
Joined Nov 2009
526 Posts
Wing Attachment Mods

All:

Maidened my Apprentice last weekend, and it was a blast. Nearly lost the plane doing a loop when it appears that one of the rubberbands popped off (the very top one disappeared), and another at the bottom of the rubberband pile had popped loose of the posts one puts the bands on. When I pulled out the loop, the plane did something akin to a tip stall/cartwheel in the air (at close to WOT), and I powered down immediately to get it under control and bring it back in to see what had occurred.

Was thinking of putting a few strong magnets (small ones) on the wing and fuse area where the wing attaches to add adhesion - but am now giving second thoughts to that.

I think I need to get something that will slip on to the 4 rubberband posts (to be installed after putting on the rubberbands) that will prevent the rubberbands from slipping off.

Any thoughts?

What a great plane btw!

Don
donsinger1 is offline Find More Posts by donsinger1
Reply With Quote
Sign up now
to remove ads between posts
Old Mar 03, 2010, 07:43 PM
Yes, I know it's upside down.
Sydney, Australia
Joined Dec 2008
3,309 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by donsinger1 View Post
All:

When I pulled out the loop, the plane did something akin to a tip stall/cartwheel in the air (at close to WOT), and I powered down immediately to get it under control and bring it back in to see what had occurred.
Don, this same thing happened to me when my rubber bands started to get old and stretchy. The leading edge of the wing lifts a little due to stretchy/missing rubber bands, and all sorts of wierd things happen. In my case, it did a 2ft diameter loop. Insane!!!

To help keep the rubber bands on, make sure you put the diagonal ones on last. (Just in case you were'nt already). Also, if you are careful and very neat about it, you can get them to not bunch up so much. But yes, the posts are far from ideal.

Regards,
Harrow.
Harrow is offline Find More Posts by Harrow
Reply With Quote
Old Mar 03, 2010, 11:39 PM
Registered User
Boise, ID
Joined Dec 2008
1,102 Posts
And be sure to use all eight rubber bands.
tlr-boise is offline Find More Posts by tlr-boise
Reply With Quote
Old Mar 03, 2010, 11:43 PM
Registered User
Boise, ID
Joined Dec 2008
1,102 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by robtest View Post

Has anyone put bigger wheels on the back? I did that to match my front 3" wheel, but it seems a bit much for the stock wire. I was thinking about finding another solution for the back, perhaps epoxing on a small piece of balsa/ply to mount it on.
Mine is 3" diam on the nose wheel, 2 3/4 diam on the two rears. Theory was it would lean it back a little for taking off of grass. That, and I bent outward and backward the rear landing gear wire. Not sure it helped much, though.
tlr-boise is offline Find More Posts by tlr-boise
Reply With Quote
Old Mar 04, 2010, 12:44 AM
Registered User
Portland, OR
Joined Nov 2009
526 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by tlr-boise View Post
And be sure to use all eight rubber bands.
Absolutely...that was apparent from what happened...and what Harrow noted, a 2 ft diameter loop, is very akin to what happened to me...kinda frightening at first as you cannot believe the plane actually did something like that!

I have a few ideas...some as simple as using a my wifes/daughters ponytail hairties....first put the rubber bands on, then take the tie and double loop over the post and rubber bands to keep in place...hmmmmmmmm

Any other ideas?

D
donsinger1 is offline Find More Posts by donsinger1
Reply With Quote
Old Mar 04, 2010, 02:38 PM
Registered User
USA, GA, Norcross
Joined Jul 2009
333 Posts
I had one of the white plastic ends come off one of the posts. While I hated to use metal, I used a washer and a screw, which I epoxied into the little black tube, which is under those white caps.

Had it that way for months now, and haven't broke a rubber band yet on the metal washer edge, so it doesn't concern me now.

AND YES, ALWAYS USE 8 RUBBER BANDS !!!! LOL




TLR-BOISE: I have thought about using those lighter wheels. Currently I am using the big black rubber Du-bro low bounce rubber ones

robtest is offline Find More Posts by robtest
Reply With Quote
Old Mar 05, 2010, 01:01 AM
Registered User
Boise, ID
Joined Dec 2008
1,102 Posts
Robtest, I still use the wheels that are in my picture, but I also tried thick 3" foamy ones from my LHS, (Dubro-somethings, I think) but none of them really worked until I upgraded by motor/ESC/battery. The plane takes off and leaps off the grass now, but with the old stock motor, and then the Power 15 motor and stock battery, did not seem to have enough juice to get started. It would nose over almost every time. The grass at the soccer fields where I fly is thick and tough.

The good thing is that this plane can probably fly with real big, and heavy wheels, with no problem. So, whatever works.

Are those Du-Bro low-bounce wheels working for you? I just bought a set of those for the Corsair I'm building, but that's a 7 lb balsa airplane. Similar wingspan and size, however.
tlr-boise is offline Find More Posts by tlr-boise
Reply With Quote
Old Mar 05, 2010, 01:56 AM
Registered User
USA, GA, Norcross
Joined Jul 2009
333 Posts
Yes, in thick grass, thinner wheels would be better.

I am probably gonna upgrade the motor/esc soon. The pseudo 15e motor, whether thru wear, or crash damage doesn't put out enough.

Of course, my several crashes, and repairs have left thier marks and added weight.

BTW, covering the fuselage with packing tape might look cool and seem like a good idea, but it's not...

And I have learned the hardway, house paint should probably never be put on an RC plane. I thought it would be cool to paint one side red and the other side black. Unfortunately, all I had around the house was some Red latex paint and some Black oil based paint. Not sure what the oil based would do to the foam, so I put a layer or so of Kilz Primer on it. Being a noob, I checked the front to back balance of the plane but not the side to side balance of the wing. When I took off, it went hard to the black wing side... Crashed and that is how I broke the nose wheel plastic assembly! LOL Good Lord what was I thinking? Took 9 coats of Red Latex and a 10 penny nail to balance that side with the primer/black oil based 5 "thin" coats.

But the plane still flys but not as quickly as I would like. It will be a great plane to risk when I get back out there after taking a couple months off with the cold/windy weather of winter. I have crashed it so many times, I wouldn't mind it being totaled!

Biggest problem I have is about the time it gets to ROG speed, it tends to kick left. My theory is that if I was accelerating faster, it would pass through that phase more quickly and be easier to handle.
robtest is offline Find More Posts by robtest
Reply With Quote
Old Mar 05, 2010, 08:45 AM
Registered User
Portland, OR
Joined Nov 2009
526 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by robtest View Post
I have crashed it so many times, I wouldn't mind it being totaled!
I felt the same way about my Supercub. I ended giving it to my brother to learn to fly - he has nose dived into ground; put into tree; and, last weekend he was flying great until he turned for a landing approach and put the SC right into some Stadium lights...the plane whacked the light standard, stopped, and nosed 70' into the ground. Took it home, he repaired it and flew it the next day.

We love planes that fly well that you can't kill..a special place in our hearts.

Don
donsinger1 is offline Find More Posts by donsinger1
Reply With Quote
Old Mar 05, 2010, 11:59 PM
Registered User
USA, GA, Norcross
Joined Jul 2009
333 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by donsinger1 View Post

We love planes that fly well that you can't kill..a special place in our hearts.

Don



If it would just die, I could move on, but as long as I can fix it, I do, and then I feel the need to fly it some more! LOL

I am now mostly flying my t-28, have flown my e-flite t-34 a couple times, but my banged up Apprentice still calls to me for air time...
robtest is offline Find More Posts by robtest
Reply With Quote
Old Mar 06, 2010, 01:32 PM
Registered User
Boise, ID
Joined Dec 2008
1,102 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by robtest View Post
Biggest problem I have is about the time it gets to ROG speed, it tends to kick left. My theory is that if I was accelerating faster, it would pass through that phase more quickly and be easier to handle.
That happened to me a couple times. Both times, plane went up and then straight left, caught the left wing tip, cartwheeled once, crashed. Your issue might be due to something else, but what I figured out was that I was accustomed to getting the plane rolling in thick grass with full up elevator--to make the nosewheel lighter and get the plane going against the grass. The plane got going, leapt into the air, but didn't have enough speed, or lift, or something, and severely tip stalled to the left. Crash. What worked for me was to consciously ease off the elevator as the plane got rolling, keep the plane on the grass longer as it built up speed and gently ease back on the elevator, making a nice scale take-off.
tlr-boise is offline Find More Posts by tlr-boise
Reply With Quote
Old Mar 06, 2010, 03:06 PM
Registered User
USA, GA, Norcross
Joined Jul 2009
333 Posts
My situtation is a bit different. I am taking off on asphalt (actually at an old closed down airport runway!). I start off, make sure I am running straight, full throttle, then as it hits a certain speed, it will cut left at about the time I am going to pull back on the elevator, or as I am pulling back on the elevator.

At first, I thought I was dumb thumbing it and pulling back and left on the stick, but that is not the case...
robtest is offline Find More Posts by robtest
Reply With Quote
Old Mar 07, 2010, 08:43 AM
Registered User
Parkk's Avatar
Near Austin, TX
Joined Dec 2008
432 Posts
I think you guys are experiencing torque and prop factor, that is normal. The more airspeed you have before liftoff will dampen this. I've had an Apprentice for about a year and a half, great bird. When I takeoff I use half throttle and when I see the plane get light on the wheels I increase power to give me a comfortable liftoff and initial climb. I have done a few full power short/ruff field takeoffs and one must take care because the aircraft can become airborne below the stalling speed of the wing (crash). Full power takeoffs are not necessary for most models and BTW some full scale airplanes.
Parkk is offline Find More Posts by Parkk
Reply With Quote
Old Mar 07, 2010, 10:46 AM
BEAR-AvHistory's Avatar
RDRC NC USA
Joined Mar 2009
569 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by robtest View Post
My situtation is a bit different. I am taking off on asphalt (actually at an old closed down airport runway!). I start off, make sure I am running straight, full throttle, then as it hits a certain speed, it will cut left at about the time I am going to pull back on the elevator, or as I am pulling back on the elevator.

At first, I thought I was dumb thumbing it and pulling back and left on the stick, but that is not the case...
Are you feeding in a bit more right rudder as the plane gets light on its nose wheel?

You might be losing ground steering before you have enough rudder authority to overcome torque & P-factor. This plane does not really need WOT to get off the ground.
BEAR-AvHistory is offline Find More Posts by BEAR-AvHistory
Reply With Quote
Old Mar 07, 2010, 11:03 AM
Registered User
USA, GA, Norcross
Joined Jul 2009
333 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by BEAR-AvHistory View Post
Are you feeding in a bit more right rudder as the plane gets light on its nose wheel?

You might be losing ground steering before you have enough rudder authority to overcome torque & P-factor. This plane does not really need WOT to get off the ground.

So feeding it right rudder is a normal thing??? When I do that it is just fine, but I was thinking that it should not necessarily need it if it was adjusted properly...


BTW Bear, I went to the Perry GA RC Plane Swap meet yesterday. Great Show, 3 big buildings worth of planes... But I didn't find anything I couldn't live without, so I came home and ordered the chinese Seniorita from NitroPlanes and then motor/esc/servos from HobbyKing

That should make a nice upgrade to Apprentice!
robtest is offline Find More Posts by robtest
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools

Similar Threads
Category Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Discussion Pitts Model 12 15e ARF by E-flite I got one!! helifann Parkflyers 7 Nov 19, 2008 10:23 PM
New Product Wrong area Get Real Beginner Training Area (Aircraft-Electric) 0 May 16, 2008 05:27 AM
Sold SOLD Blade CP RTF Electric Micro Heli by E-flite Lakepilot Aircraft - Electric - Helis (FS/W) 3 Nov 26, 2007 05:40 PM
For Sale E-Sky King V1 hopped up, RTF w/ Spektrum Radio zero9046 Aircraft - Electric - Helis (FS/W) 0 May 16, 2007 12:34 AM
Odyssey EP by E-Flite for a beginner flyer? Bellavance Beginner Training Area (Aircraft-Electric) 0 Oct 09, 2001 07:23 PM