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Old Jun 08, 2011, 02:04 PM
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Not sure when they started that, but folks around here say it isn't absolutely necessary and I tend to believe that. I did use it on mine, but I always use gp 6 min epoxy, so the wait wasn't much to concern me.
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Old Jun 08, 2011, 03:22 PM
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Is their a site/Thread in regards to DIY electronics in rigging lights/electronics etc to existing systems. Used to do circuit boards 20 years ago.

Thanks!
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Old Jun 08, 2011, 05:20 PM
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Originally Posted by paperman_ View Post
When did they start needing epoxy in the wings? I was fairly disappointed when I have read the manual that is on-line more than a few times it never mentioned needing epoxy. All advertisements say everything is in the box. Cost me a great flying day driving around and waiting for it to cure. Oh well. It does fly nice.
Yeah, I don't know when they started calling for epoxy in the wings, either.
I have one piece of Scotch Clear Packing Tape holding the front plastic rubber band shield to the wing and the wing halves together, and a second piece of Packing Tape holding the rear plastic rubber band shield and wing halves together (both pieces of tape are half on, half off of their respective rubber band shields). I've had that set of wings for nearly two years now, same tape, and no problems.

Epoxy'ing the wing halves together sounds like Eflite/Horizon is just pulling the old "Cover Their A**" policy. The tape (or epoxy) basically just keeps the wing halves from pulling straight apart along the line of the wing tube. The wing tube is what keeps the wing halves from folding up or swinging apart.
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Old Jun 08, 2011, 05:31 PM
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Epoxy'ing the wing the wings is recent, the manual I had when i bought it last year didnt say that, I was informed at the store. Apparently their have bee some separation.
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Old Jun 08, 2011, 09:28 PM
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Epoxy'ing the wing the wings is recent, the manual I had when i bought it last year didnt say that, I was informed at the store. Apparently their have bee some separation.
Not exactly recent. Here is the first reference I noted over two years ago:

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...&postcount=334
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Old Jun 09, 2011, 06:12 AM
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Would be nice if they updated their instrucion book on-line. (after 2 years) You get people like me who read the thing a few times to be sure they have it right while its making its way to me in the brown truck. Gives you the red as when you find out you need to drive around to get things that you have had days to get if only you had known.
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Old Jun 09, 2011, 12:49 PM
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If you don't have any epoxy handy at all times, you are either really new to rc or one really super pilot that never builds anything and in a different class than me for sure. I'd make an emergency trip to the store if I got down to my last 1/4 bottle of epoxy. And if you are really new to the hobby, I apologize, no putdown meant. And if you are new, you will thank HH later for making you go get some epoxy right off the bat. And you most likely need several different kinds of glue and not just for the wing. You have to properly glue the things that did not get properly glued at the factory - don't just assume it is all done right - check everything.
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Old Jun 09, 2011, 01:34 PM
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That's good advice for everyone, Bobly. Everyone should carefully inspect every millimeter of any ARF, PNP, BNF, or RTF that they get as soon as they pull it out of the box. Shipping damage, defective electronics, build errors, loose nuts and bolts, etc. all have the potential to bring your brand new plane out of the sky if you didn't find the error before trying to fly it.

If you build it yourself from a box of lumber (which you inspect each piece as your gluing it!) then at least you know who built it and how well it was done. You also then know every electronic part you put in, and have tested it as you installed it. With every pre-built kit, you're better off assuming that the guy that built it did it wrong until you've confirmed it otherwise, then to assume he did it right and find out the hard way.

So far I don't have any full build-up kits, and every ARF, BNF, and RTF I've purchased has needed at least some minor adjustments (if not full-blown surgery) to get it ready to fly.
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Old Jun 09, 2011, 02:32 PM
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I really am that new to the hobby. The only reason I made mention is that everybody talks about this being a RTF just charge batteries. I did go through the thing pretty good to look for loose ends and found a few but that I can understand. I would have thanked HH if their information was up to date. When they have a book/manual for viewing on their web site you would think it is the latest version with the information you really need, not as pointed out 2 years out of date.
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Old Jun 09, 2011, 04:34 PM
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I really am that new to the hobby. The only reason I made mention is that everybody talks about this being a RTF just charge batteries. I did go through the thing pretty good to look for loose ends and found a few but that I can understand. I would have thanked HH if their information was up to date. When they have a book/manual for viewing on their web site you would think it is the latest version with the information you really need, not as pointed out 2 years out of date.
I will totally agree with you that they stretch the "ready to fly" thing about past its limits. I had the epoxy, but I believe it took several hours to get to the "ready to fly" stage with my apprentice. I'm old and a bit slow, but by the time you put it together, hook up all controls, do the manual trimming, check all joints and screws, it for sure ain't "ready to fly" as you get it from the store.
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Old Jun 09, 2011, 06:03 PM
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LOl, it took me a couple days to get it "RTF". Didnt have a battery to clip the charger on so i had to strip some wires from a transformer.
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Old Jun 09, 2011, 06:57 PM
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So i adjusted the rod on my apprentice that was off. Now i am going to trim everything again which reminds me of something.

I remember the controls being quite sensitive during my first flight. I actually do not know how the throws are at the moment. Since it was an RTF i thought it would be preset correct already. But since i use my futaba radio that probably makes everything different.

How can i set the apprentice up for a beginner like me physically on the rods and digitally in my futaba radio? Like i mentioned before, it seems that the aileron servo arms were pressing into the foam on both sides which also indicated to me that throws are probably off.

The manual only speaks about a high and low configuration with measurements. Am i suppose to do this configurations physically or digitally in radio?


Thanks!

Marrone

Hi guys!

Here i am again! Was quite busy with work but finally managed to measure my throws. Remember i said my controls were quite sensitive the first flight? Well, after measuring throws i can imagine why! This is what i measured:

Elevator: according to manual should be 20mm up and down in high rate. My elevator: 30 mm up and 20mm down.

Rudder: according to manual should be 25mm left and right in high rate. My rudder: 45mm left and 40mm right.

Ailerons: according to manual should be 16mm up and down in high rate. My left aileron: 30mm up and 25mm down. right aileron: 30mm down and 25mm up.

Knowing now why it was so sensitive i am even more amazed that i managed to land it with ailerons reversed. Thank god that went well.

If recommended high rates in manual are the max throws that should be set i am way off. It also seems that the side that the control rod is pushing is 5mm more than the side that the control rod is pulling on every control. Is this normal and do i have to set this up so that both sides have equal throws?

As a newbie i picked up a rtf and thought i could just plug everything in and fly. I do not know if people picking up the apprentice with the spektrum radio also have to adjust the throws in their radio but is it correct that i have to set up the recommended throws in the apprentice manual on my futaba t8fg?

Is "end point" the place where i should do this in my futaba. It is on standard now which is "travel" on 100% and "limit" on 135% for all controls.

Are throws always recommended in manuals of airplanes and do you always need to set these up?

Are high rates in manual for people who want high sensitivity controls and the low rates for people who want less sensitivity controls? Or do you have to set up both as dual rates?

Wow lots of questions! that is what happens when you are a newbie like me Getting answers to these questions would help me a lot and i am really learning with all these experiences and info from you guys. So i would really appreciate your time in answering my questions. Thanks for that!

Oh by the way, funny story.................

As a newbie i was doing some tests and getting to know my futaba better. My apprentice was on the kitchen table and my manual under it. In my radio menu i got to the function "servo monitor". Futaba manual explains: "you can put servos on neutral in order to do calibration" I thought: "hey that is handy indeed since i want my servos in neutral position in order to calibrate my rods" So i went and put it on neutral and pressed ok................ My motor started spinning like crazy giving me almost a heart attack!! I managed to grab the plane on time but my futaba manual was lying under the prop and got sucked in. I could only stop it by putting "neutral" on "off" since this function bypasses your controls. And i had to do this with one hand since my other hand was holding the airplane and i could not see a lot because of little pieces of paper going everywhere...... Let's say it is more difficult for me now to look things up in my futaba manual since some pages are in a million pieces. This is the way i discovered that a prop can be used as a paper shredder. Go figure, i did not crash my plane on my first flight with super sensitive throws and reversed ailerons outside, but i did destroy my manual at home o well the day after i laughed very loud about it.
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Old Jun 09, 2011, 08:07 PM
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Has anyone had an issue of leaving an Apprentice in a hot car all day. I just started a new job close to a fly field. I was going to take my batteries inside, but no room for a plane. Thanks.

KJ
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Old Jun 09, 2011, 09:20 PM
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Yeah, I'm still really impressed that you were able to handle it with ailerons reversed. That shows talent.

(1) Not sure if anyone has said that "high rates should be max throws"; when I said I set up my "high rates" to be AT "max throws", I mean before the servo binds. I would be very confident in saying that my High Rates are well beyond the "recommended high rates" in the Apprentice manual. You can set up both sides to be equal throws (more important on rudder than anything else to be equal, IF you use your rudder a lot, I don't use mine except on the ground)

(2) The recommended throws for High and Low Rates are just that: recommendations. They are there for people who (like you) are just starting in the hobby. If you have an experienced pilot set up your rates for you, you might be better off.

(3) You don't set up your rates in "End Point" You should use "Dual Rates" Dual Rates mimics a lot of the End Point functionality in terms of limiting where the servo travel ends. In all 9 of my planes, I haven't touched End Point at all.

(4) All 9 airplanes I have came with Recommended Throws for High and Low Rates. Personally, I've ignored all of them. I just set mine up so the High Rate is max throws without any binding of control surfaces or servo strain. Then I take half of that for my Low Rates. But I do like my airplanes to be really responsive. However, halving the High Rates for my Low Rate setting has always given me a tame setting for each aircraft (at least _I_ think so)

(5) Are high rates in manual for people who want high sensitivity controls and the low rates for people who want less sensitivity controls? Yes, and no. That is the result you get with a linear Exponential setting with most airplanes. Setting up both as Dual Rates gets you the best of both. If you have a really twitchy aerobatic plane on High Rates, it may be easier to land it on Low Rates, but you still want the quicker reactions for your aerobatics.
99.999% of the time, I fly my Apprentice on High Rates, take-off and land on High Rates, etc. But I still have my Low Rates programmed in just so I have them (also so it is ready as a Buddy-Box trainer if I ever meet someone who wants to learn to fly)

As for your Newbie questions, that what this forum is for!

And as for your funny story about your "neutral servos for calibration", I laughed so hard I couldn't breathe! Especially during the part about "...and i could not see a lot because of little pieces of paper going everywhere"
Same thing happened to me, except I was working with my Eflite ESC instructions (one piece of paper) and had it sitting in front of my prop/airplane and had finished checking the LiPo battery settings on the ESC and decided to test the motor. I was holding the airplane and was ready for the prop spin, but wasn't ready for the paper to be sucked through the prop. Just like with you, I found out that a prop makes a good paper shredder! Needless to say, I was finding bits of paper here and there for the next few days!
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Old Jun 10, 2011, 09:20 PM
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Originally Posted by K.Jones View Post
Has anyone had an issue of leaving an Apprentice in a hot car all day. I just started a new job close to a fly field. I was going to take my batteries inside, but no room for a plane. Thanks.

KJ
Ever since my SuperCub tail surface got warped, I don't leave my planes in the car.
I think Apprentice's tail has similar material.
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