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Old Sep 04, 2008, 07:21 AM
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Slovakia
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I have never heard about gradient charge termination.
As for what I see on the link, there is zero peak detection, searching for the moment of the top voltage.
I am familiar with Inflection point detection, which is the point before the top voltage, at which the voltage slope stop getting steeper and steeper, and the slope of the voltage curve of the voltage graph start slowing down, and approach the top.. Please excuse my English, i have run out of my vocabulary now.
Just a very quick google search found this pictures explaining the Inflection point.:
http://mgm-compro.com/pic.php?pic=pics/aqc-4f-fig-1.jpg
http://www.advancetec.com/resources/...flectionPo.gif
Perhaps usefull link to whole article about that charger, very simple look but very well working (only NiCD-NiMH):
http://mgm-compro.com/index.php?tid=chargers-aqc-4f
Anyway, it is clear that charged pack is 100 percent full before the voltage gets to the maximum.

There is also even more advanced technology, of measuring voltage change right after break in charge current. Two consequent measurements of voltage within certain time can unveil whether current is right or whether it is too high for the charged cells, in any moment of the charge, thus can set current autmaticalz and determine when pack is full.. But I guess that NiCD power packs are too outdated now, to bother with something as complex.

At 3mV deltapeak, charged pack should not get too warm. Perhaps there were differences between cells, masking the deltapeak, a voltage decrease of few cells, by rising voltage of another cells not already full, within the pack? Cell equalizing at trickle rate, is all that can help.. Or use of temperature sensor included..
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Old Sep 04, 2008, 08:50 AM
LKC
must have been a glitch !
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Australia, QLD, Brisbane
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Quote:
Originally Posted by junsi
2. Unique Lithium battery expanding discharge program. When you connect the external capacity resistance, you can use it as the maximum discharge power capacity—170W (@25V/7A).
junsi,
Can you expand on this. Will you be selling the external capacity resitance? Or is it just something the user will provide ? Obviously it's just an external load. I assume the 106+ has additional connections for this, more banana plugs or similar ? Sounds interesting.

Luke
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Old Sep 04, 2008, 09:20 AM
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Melbourne, Australia
Joined May 2006
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It is explained in detail on p17 of the 106B+ manual which is linked to above. There are no extra connectors. It requires the use of an external series resistive load in the positive main power lead. This clever mode even has a pre-heat feature so that you can use light bulbs as the external load.
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Old Sep 04, 2008, 09:55 AM
LKC
must have been a glitch !
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Ah.. the load in series, that is simple..
Sorry, I missed that link to the manual.

Luke
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Old Sep 04, 2008, 11:20 AM
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Indonesia, Jakarta Capital Region, Djakarta
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i am using a single cell Protected 18650 sized Lithium Ion. When the protection kicks in i have to send a small amount of current before the charger can start charging by using a NIMH charging mode set to 100ma otherwise the battery will read zero(because of the protection) and charging will not start. Junsi, Can you add another Lithium charging mode for batteries made with protection circuit?

thanks.
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Old Sep 04, 2008, 05:00 PM
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Melbourne, Australia
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Have you tried increasing the "Lithium battery Check Time" setting ? Perhaps that will help ?
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Old Sep 04, 2008, 05:38 PM
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Wow, coro, this is wonderful!
The inflex termination should be even better then the gradient termination.
All the programmer has to do is to let the CPU calculate the derivation of the voltage graph, and terminate the charge, when it decreases.
This should not be too difficult
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Old Sep 04, 2008, 06:08 PM
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Last week my 106b arrived , I happen to be dealing with some PB cells 7A 24v ,so put the charger straight to them to count the amps put back in them from there days use, alas this did'nt last for quater of an hour before I noticed a faint beep with blinking screen ,jogged fan (that I had definatly put on auto ), followed by a heated 50 degrees. The error message was ;

V3.06b AAA
rrrr

Is my charger dead / gone to sleep... I have not opened it to find why ! ( It does have warrenty you know !).

It was running on 13.5v 3-5A DC and left sat on top of its box out of the way of anything for a good reveiwing.
Please help .
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Old Sep 04, 2008, 08:41 PM
iCharger
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Hello everyone,

Here I will announce a good news, that is, the 3.07 version of 106B upgrading software will be released within two days.

Best regards,
Junsi
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Old Sep 04, 2008, 10:25 PM
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Excellent - great news Junsi! Any chance of a sneak preview of the release notes/revisions?

- David
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Old Sep 05, 2008, 12:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by coro
At 3mV deltapeak, charged pack should not get too warm. Perhaps there were differences between cells, masking the deltapeak, a voltage decrease of few cells, by rising voltage of another cells not already full, within the pack? Cell equalizing at trickle rate, is all that can help.. Or use of temperature sensor included..
Hello coro,

Thank you for your great idea. We appreciate it very much.

We will solve it by decreasing the voltage from 3mV to 1mV. Although the accuracy of measurement is 3mV, it will be N*3mV if there are several series. While the pack is more than 3s, it can be tested, which can also lower the charge temperature to some users.

Regards,
Junsi
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Old Sep 05, 2008, 02:22 AM
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Austria
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Hello Junsi,

will 1010B also get a new software within two days?

Best Regards,
Markus

Quote:
Originally Posted by junsi
Hello everyone,

Here I will announce a good news, that is, the 3.07 version of 106B upgrading software will be released within two days.

Best regards,
Junsi
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Old Sep 05, 2008, 02:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tuxian
Hello Junsi,

will 1010B also get a new software within two days?

Best Regards,
Markus
Hello Markus,

We will release 3.07 version software of 106B and 1010B at the same time.

Thank you for your mention.

Best regards,
Junsi
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Old Sep 05, 2008, 11:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kgfly
Have you tried increasing the "Lithium battery Check Time" setting ? Perhaps that will help ?
No it wouldnt help since when the battery protection kicks in the negative part of the battery is pratically isolated by the circuit to protect the battery from further discharge(battery voltage will read zero with DMM) and can only be reset with charging. 106b is thinking there is no battery connected(because of the isolation by the circuit) that is why it wont start charging.

thanks.
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Old Sep 05, 2008, 11:37 AM
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So. Cal.
Joined Oct 2004
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rizky_p
No it wouldnt help since when the battery protection kicks in the negative part of the battery is pratically isolated by the circuit to protect the battery from further discharge(battery voltage will read zero with DMM) and can only be reset with charging. 106b is thinking there is no battery connected(because of the isolation by the circuit) that is why it wont start charging.

thanks.
As far as I know, all lithium chargers that are capable of charging series packs (more than one cell) will perform a voltage check prior initiating charge current. This is obviously an important safety precaution and eliminating or altering this feature may open a charger manufacturer to undesired liability. Protected lithium cells that have 'opened' as a result of hitting discharge voltage cutoff really should be charged on a voltage limited single cell charger that does not perform voltage check prior to initiating charge. The only way to circumvent the 'opened' protection circuit and charge on a multi cell charger is to first 'close' the protection circuit with the means you've been employing or with a single cell charger.

Also, accurate 18650 chargers can be found really cheap (<$10) so you may consider picking one up of you don't already have one.

Mark
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