Dude that's insane!

I have learned to 'harden' the frames to handle 40A. The tail comes off @ 40A with the stock build.

Busted blades, you've inspired me. I've got to get my 3500kV heli motor on soon.

Originally Posted by Harrow

Busted blades, you've inspired me. I've got to get my 3500kV heli motor on soon.

again- this is a very good design, but by the plans its not meant for 40A's. You will have to do some strengthening.

I suggest-
doubling the vertical splines (top and bottom)
reinforce the tail and elevons
extend the wing spar to the tips (use a single piece of CF or spruce wood)
use very stiff pushrods (look at my pics of CF pushrods)
use store bought horns from the LHS
use a stick mount for the motor and reinforce the motor mount.

When doing all these upgrades be careful of your weight. You can easily make a pig trying this. this is my 6th try. My first blew the tail off. second and third (tail hardened with bamboo bar-b-que squers) came out over 24oz. needless to say, they did wierd things in the air. I got this one down to 19.2 oz with a 3S-2200 battery and it flies well.

good luck, I want to see what you come up with.

Matt

Hey guys, I tried to search this thread, and perhaps I missed it, but what's the verdict on rudders on these planes? It is a fair assumption that adding ailerons is better than messing with rudders?

AA

Originally Posted by AirmanAirhead

Hey guys, I tried to search this thread, and perhaps I missed it, but what's the verdict on rudders on these planes? It is a fair assumption that adding ailerons is better than messing with rudders?

AA

Ailerons are the "must-have" mod for these planes. Very few people use rudders, although I must say that when I try to hover into a head wind, I always find myself reaching for the rudder stick!! I'm going to add one soon purely for that purpose.

Harrow,

Thanks for the quick reply. I read one response that said the rudder action affected this plane negatively, I'm not sure why that would be. Regarding adding the ailerons, I don't want to mess up a good thing. This plane flies so nice! It has become my favorite for the last little while. Did you simply yoke them to the elevons or did you add servos? Is there an optimum length and width for the ailerons?

Originally Posted by AirmanAirhead

Harrow,

Thanks for the quick reply. I read one response that said the rudder action affected this plane negatively, I'm not sure why that would be. Regarding adding the ailerons, I don't want to mess up a good thing. This plane flies so nice! It has become my favorite for the last little while. Did you simply yoke them to the elevons or did you add servos? Is there an optimum length and width for the ailerons?

You do not "need" ailerons on this bird. If you give your elevons max throws, you will have plenty of roll authority. The "simple thrust vectoring" works as advertised. That said, you're not going to mess up a good thing by adding them - it's a personal preference thing.

My take:

Ailerons - Not necessary, but a great mod to add. Look back at the pics earlier in the thread to see how I hooked mine up.

Rudders - Not necessary, and a waste of time based on what I've read in the forums. Not very effective, if at all, and just adds unnecessary weight to the plane.

And like Park Flyer said above, these planes fly great with just tailerons too.

Pat

Originally Posted by Park_Flyer

You do not "need" ailerons on this bird. If you give your elevons max throws, you will have plenty of roll authority. The "simple thrust vectoring" works as advertised. That said, you're not going to mess up a good thing by adding them - it's a personal preference thing.

Originally Posted by crxmanpat

My take:

Ailerons - Not necessary, but a great mod to add. Look back at the pics earlier in the thread to see how I hooked mine up.

Rudders - Not necessary, and a waste of time based on what I've read in the forums. Not very effective, if at all, and just adds unnecessary weight to the plane.

And like Park Flyer said above, these planes fly great with just tailerons too.

Pat

Originally Posted by Harrow

Ailerons are the "must-have" mod for these planes. Very few people use rudders, although I must say that when I try to hover into a head wind, I always find myself reaching for the rudder stick!! I'm going to add one soon purely for that purpose.

Originally Posted by AirmanAirhead

Hey guys, I tried to search this thread, and perhaps I missed it, but what's the verdict on rudders on these planes? It is a fair assumption that adding ailerons is better than messing with rudders?

AA

I agree about the rudders, NOT NEEDED! the ailerons are a personal choice, I don't think you need them IMHO. It is a Great flyer with just the elevons!

IMHO -- rudders only add to the fun. I added rudders to mine and will add them to all future builds! Not only did they aid in fighting wind, they also added a lot of control to high alpha flight. I was also able to achieve some cool maneuvers with the rudders -- not sure what its called but I was able to do this flat spin, corkscrew type thing. I'm all for the rudders! Yes, they add weight but there's nothing like doing figure 8's in high alpha before touching down and taking off again (added L/G too!)

note: My F22 only has rudders and tailerons

Never mind

Originally Posted by BustedBlades

Version #6 (for me)

I only fly these outdoors for fast flight, so I make them tough which adds a little weight but they all float really well and handle low speeds great. Out of all the jets I have built, I keep coming back to these plans because they fly the best. I just finished building and maidened, decorations are next. Overall, this one came out really solid and straight. Will post video soon. I would really like a Doppler on this setup. Suspect about 70mph?

Specs:
28" ws 38" length
AUW: 19.2 oz.
WOT Power: 42A, 12.2V = ~510 Watts
elevons only

Setup:
Turnigy 2836 3200kv on a EMP 4.75x4.75
40-50 HK SS ESC with Turnigy BEC
Flightmax 3S-2200-25C
Spektrum Ar6100

Hey Matt, did you have to reverse the shaft on this motor. If so, how difficult is it to do. Also, what is the run time with this setup? I read here if you used an APC 6x5.5 instead you can pull about 550W at 53A WOT. 80-85mph. 35oz thrust. AUW 19oz.

Thanks,
Steven

your set up is correct but

this esc ist's realy better
http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbyking/s..._Brushless_ESC

Originally Posted by profilefan

Hey Matt, did you have to reverse the shaft on this motor. If so, how difficult is it to do. Also, what is the run time with this setup? I read here if you used an APC 6x5.5 instead you can pull about 550W at 53A WOT. 80-85mph. 35oz thrust. AUW 19oz.

Thanks,
Steven

Yes I reversed the shaft. It was pretty easy.

My run time is about 10 mins avg on half throttle with some high speed passes. motor and ESC are lukewarm. battery is somewhat warm
I wouldn't run any more amps on that fast motor- You would probably get more instant thrust with the smaller prop to spool.

The higher the rpm per kv the lower the torque per kv.
since HP=(Torque*RPM)/5252


besides, You don't need 50W more watts on a 500W 19oz F-22, it will rip it apart in 2 flights. I rarely hit WOT.

Matteo