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Old Feb 19, 2009, 10:40 PM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar
United States, MA, Walpole
Joined Dec 2003
17,622 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by heritageflyer
...
I don't want a bunch of Amp sucking Speed. I like Thrust for Vertical climbs and the most Scale-Like performance. I like my foamy's to look like heavy lumbering slow rolling, slow looping Real Warbirds and I want to be flying in up to 10 mph winds. I like cruising around the pattern at 50 to 60% throttle. Yet, I like to make strafing runs/Hot Low Passes at WOT when I get in the mood. Will probably test fly with the 1300, but want to go to an 1800 or 2200 Battery. I am using the BP 30A ESC, so want to keep the motor around 28A peaks using a 10-11" prop size. 10x4.7, 10x7, 11x4.7, 11x7.

So please send me your flown motor recommendations for this bird.

I'm taking names and model numbers and checking them twice!

Here's a Turnigy I found that looks to be close to a Park 480.
What do you think??

2217 16

Thanks in advance!
That motor looks to be right for what I think is your described flying style if you are going for the heavier packs. I am flying with this slightly smaller but similar kV motor from Hobby City in mine with no LG and a 1300 mAh 3S lipo and GWS 10x6DD 2-bladed prop. The first half of this video P-40 will give you an idea of the performance at my lighter weight. I don't have unlimited vertical, but close to scale-like, I think. The one vertical climb in the video was chopped short to do the hammerhead stall turn... it will do at least double that climb or slightly better before starting to run out of speed. Your plane will be several oz. heavier with the larger packs, so will not fly as slow and will need the larger motor for similar performance. I prefer the lighter weight, and still get about 12 min. flights with this kind of flying with fresh lipos.

I have several of that style (but not size) of Turnigy motors, and find them to be excellent value and very good performers. I noted you wanted to go to about 28A peak with up to 11 in props, but the motor you linked is only good for 18A peak, so it doesn't fit your power spec and the 11 in. props may be a bit much for it to chew, but should fly the plane scale-like with 10 in. props.
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Old Feb 20, 2009, 12:57 AM
Scale Foam Flyer
Cubcrazy's Avatar
United States, AR, Cabot
Joined Oct 2007
2,896 Posts
Set up

I started running a neodym 450 class with an 11x8e APC. WAAAY to much prop for that motor. It smoked the motor after about 15 flights. Put in an Eflite park 450 and 10x7 SF APC. Pulls about 18 amps wide open with big heavy Goldburg snap together 3" spinner. I have only flown this setup 3 times and it is pretty good. I have a Park 480 that I am going to put in and go to a MAS 10x8e prop. Just waiting on the 30 amp speed control I ordered so I can move the current P-40 setup into my HZ Cub. I hope it will give it the same pep I had with the 11x8. The 11x8 tried to pull hard out of my hand at WOT and had lots of vert.
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Old Feb 20, 2009, 06:09 AM
Time To Fly The Best!
heritageflyer's Avatar
Hills of Eastern Ohio
Joined Nov 2008
13,868 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Frank

I noted you wanted to go to about 28A peak with up to 11 in props, but the motor you linked is only good for 18A peak, so it doesn't fit your power spec and the 11 in. props may be a bit much for it to chew, but should fly the plane scale-like with 10 in. props.

I'm not saying I want 28 amps, just that is the top peak amps since my ESC is a 30A. Giving myself a little headroom there.

I'll check out your motor, couldn't find it referenced in your earlier posts. From what I read before, I kinda thought we were flying same style.

I would like a Park 450 or Park 480, but trying to save some $$$. Finding it is hard to match their weight, power and efficient current draw.
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Old Feb 20, 2009, 06:15 AM
Time To Fly The Best!
heritageflyer's Avatar
Hills of Eastern Ohio
Joined Nov 2008
13,868 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cubcrazy
I started running a neodym 450 class with an 11x8e APC. WAAAY to much prop for that motor. It smoked the motor after about 15 flights. Put in an Eflite park 450 and 10x7 SF APC. Pulls about 18 amps wide open with big heavy Goldburg snap together 3" spinner. I have only flown this setup 3 times and it is pretty good. I have a Park 480 that I am going to put in and go to a MAS 10x8e prop. Just waiting on the 30 amp speed control I ordered so I can move the current P-40 setup into my HZ Cub. I hope it will give it the same pep I had with the 11x8. The 11x8 tried to pull hard out of my hand at WOT and had lots of vert.

I think the 480 would be the Best Match for Power in Windy conditions. I would probably be crusing around at half throttle most of the time otherwise. I see they have a 910 and a 1020Kv so which one did you get? Bigger prop with the 910 possible, in the 11" range. Would have to go back and look at specs. Printing all these motor specs out on paper for side by side comparison.
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Old Feb 20, 2009, 06:17 AM
Time To Fly The Best!
heritageflyer's Avatar
Hills of Eastern Ohio
Joined Nov 2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by denial15
It looks like that motor is closer to a Park 450. I'm running a 480 equivalent in mine. I've yet to maiden, but from the looks of things, it should do pretty well. I got my motor from The Don. I posted a link a few posts up.

Yes, I saw your post on the Don's 480, looks interesting, curious how it does. He doesn't put much on there for specs, like Watts, Props, Current draw. Do you have more info off an included spec sheet?
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Old Feb 20, 2009, 09:22 AM
swede
denial15's Avatar
United States, UT, Vineyard
Joined Aug 2005
3,847 Posts
I am running the e-flight 3 blade prop for the Corsair. I am getting 260 W at 24 Amps with that prop. If you'd like, I can throw another prop on there and run the numbers. What prop would you like the info on?
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Old Feb 20, 2009, 11:43 AM
Time To Fly The Best!
heritageflyer's Avatar
Hills of Eastern Ohio
Joined Nov 2008
13,868 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by denial15
I am running the e-flight 3 blade prop for the Corsair. I am getting 260 W at 24 Amps with that prop. If you'd like, I can throw another prop on there and run the numbers. What prop would you like the info on?
Doesn't it come with a Stock GWS 10x6x3?

Also 10x4.7 vs 11x4.7 vs 11x7 ?? How about those if you have them?

Was their a data sheet with the motor showing more info?
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Old Feb 20, 2009, 12:35 PM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar
United States, MA, Walpole
Joined Dec 2003
17,622 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by heritageflyer
Doesn't it come with a Stock GWS 10x6x3?

Also 10x4.7 vs 11x4.7 vs 11x7 ?? How about those if you have them?

Was their a data sheet with the motor showing more info?
Those 4.7 pitch props are slow fly props, and this is not a slow fly plane. You'll want more airspeed, plus those SF props are NOT intended for higher rpm, ESPECIALLY the GWS ones. I would not use a SF prop even on my lighter powered version for those reasons.

I bought the NPS version... it doesn't come with ANY props... just foam spinners to accompdate both 2 and 3 balde props. But those spinners are another story unto themselves... very hard to use them with non GWS motors that have more conventional shorter motor shafts.
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Old Feb 20, 2009, 01:46 PM
Unrepentant Carnivore
jamesdr's Avatar
Brandon, Fl
Joined Mar 2005
2,500 Posts
I think the sweet spot for this size plane (P-40, FW190, AT-6) is a 480 class motor. I had the GWS3008 in my FW before it's demise and it flew very well - not outrageous - much more than scale.

Jim
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Old Feb 20, 2009, 02:26 PM
Time To Fly The Best!
heritageflyer's Avatar
Hills of Eastern Ohio
Joined Nov 2008
13,868 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Frank
Those 4.7 pitch props are slow fly props, and this is not a slow fly plane. You'll want more airspeed, plus those SF props are NOT intended for higher rpm, ESPECIALLY the GWS ones. I would not use a SF prop even on my lighter powered version for those reasons.

I bought the NPS version... it doesn't come with ANY props... just foam spinners to accompdate both 2 and 3 balde props. But those spinners are another story unto themselves... very hard to use them with non GWS motors that have more conventional shorter motor shafts.
I use the 10x4.7 for the BP 2217-9 (recommended prop along with 10x7).
It makes the P-51D a slow flying 32 MPH Warbird Trainer. Docile but fun.

In this case though, I want a more powerful Warbird for the windy times.
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Last edited by heritageflyer; Feb 20, 2009 at 05:03 PM.
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Old Feb 20, 2009, 03:20 PM
The Revegetator
Chris F's Avatar
Melbourne Australia
Joined Jun 2006
2,048 Posts
Turnigy e-drive 2810/12 with the GWS 9X5X3 prop and a 3S 2200 mAh lipo

Volts - 9.64
Amps - 23.6
Watts - 228
RPM - 9380

Video here taken on a windy day
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showt...9#post10564719

With no wind I can fly sedately on half throttle. Although there is plenty of thrust it doesn't have unlimited vertical. My P-40 is covered with Silkslan and WBPU and weighs a fair bit more too. Check my blog for more details.
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Last edited by Chris F; Feb 20, 2009 at 03:28 PM.
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Old Feb 20, 2009, 03:39 PM
WAA-08 THANK FRANK!
JimNM's Avatar
Las Cruces, New Mexico, United States
Joined Jun 2002
7,204 Posts
Wow - Chris, not trying to pick on you... but your volt uner load indicate a bad battery! I bet your flight times and performance would show a shocking increase with new batteries. HC has them (Flightmax 2200 3s 15c -IIRC-) for around $20.00.
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Old Feb 20, 2009, 03:48 PM
The Revegetator
Chris F's Avatar
Melbourne Australia
Joined Jun 2006
2,048 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by JimNM
Wow - Chris, not trying to pick on you... but your volt uner load indicate a bad battery! I bet your flight times and performance would show a shocking increase with new batteries. HC has them (Flightmax 2200 3s 15c -IIRC-) for around $20.00.
Yes I noticed that myself! I hardly fly this model these days though, and when I do I just don't seem to be able to run the battery down. 10 minutes of flying and I start getting a bit bored and bring it in. I might test it again and see if I get the same reading.

I just ordered my first Flightmax lipo last night, a 4S 20C 5000mAh. I'm keen to see how they go for the price.
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Old Feb 20, 2009, 03:51 PM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar
United States, MA, Walpole
Joined Dec 2003
17,622 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by heritageflyer
I use the 10x4.7 for the BPI 2217-9 (recommended prop along with 10x7).
It makes the P-51D a slow flying 32 MPH Warbird Trainer. Docile but fun.

In this case though, I want a more powerful Warbird for the windy times.
Is that BPI 2217-9 the same motor as this Balsa Products BP A2217-9 motor (a rebranded Suppo motor, I believe)? If so, I see BP shows data for a GWS 10x4.7 prop spinning at 7130 rpm on 3S voltage. I believe that is much too high an rpm for that prop to safely operate. I based that on the fact that GWS will not give safe prop rpm, where similar but much stiffer/stronger SF props from APC give the safe rpm as 65000 / prop diameter. That's 6500 rpm for a 10 in. prop. I've had 9 in. GWS SF props go into serious flutter with a similar kV motor (but slightly shorter) outrunner on 3S voltage, and would not want to be anywhere near that motor running at WOT with a 10 in. SF prop, especially a GWS one.

The GWS-40 is a larger and considerably heavier plane than the P-51 if that's also a GWS version you mentioned, so you'll need to keep a higher rpm and speed to fly well. I'd go with a GWS 10x6DD or APC 10x5E to start out with.
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Old Feb 20, 2009, 05:35 PM
Time To Fly The Best!
heritageflyer's Avatar
Hills of Eastern Ohio
Joined Nov 2008
13,868 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Frank
Is that BPI 2217-9 the same motor as this Balsa Products BP A2217-9 motor (a rebranded Suppo motor, I believe)? If so, I see BP shows data for a GWS 10x4.7 prop spinning at 7130 rpm on 3S voltage. I believe that is much too high an rpm for that prop to safely operate. I based that on the fact that GWS will not give safe prop rpm, where similar but much stiffer/stronger SF props from APC give the safe rpm as 65000 / prop diameter. That's 6500 rpm for a 10 in. prop. I've had 9 in. GWS SF props go into serious flutter with a similar kV motor (but slightly shorter) outrunner on 3S voltage, and would not want to be anywhere near that motor running at WOT with a 10 in. SF prop, especially a GWS one.

The GWS-40 is a larger and considerably heavier plane than the P-51 if that's also a GWS version you mentioned, so you'll need to keep a higher rpm and speed to fly well. I'd go with a GWS 10x6DD or APC 10x5E to start out with.
Sorry I had a Typo above and corrected it. Yes, I have the BP 2217-9.

I went by the BP Chart for Props and started with the 10x4.7. Wasn't aware of any Safety Issues with GWS props and RPM's. I also got the APC 10x7's. Was going to that next.

The plane is the Art-Tech P-51D. 37-3/4" wingspan, 30-3/4" long, 245 sq. in. wing area, 20 oz., so the GWS P-40 Non-EPO should come in around 26oz.
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