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Old Oct 11, 2007, 03:50 PM
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United States, CA, El Cajon
Joined Jun 2004
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Atis,
You nailed it. Not needed unless you are flying a formosa or trying for some moderately advanced aerobatics. I have the Zero, ME-109, and a Spit that were built as belly landers. Never saw a need for a rudder, and they still fly great ( and a bit lighter!!)

Brad
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Old Oct 11, 2007, 03:55 PM
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ATIS's Avatar
New Bern, North Carolina, United States
Joined Oct 2004
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Brad,

Thanks, I have the EFlite P-47 and a PZ Spit (and or course the GWS P-38 and A-10)and they all lack rudders and I fly the crap out of them and enjoy them so I guess its weight savings... which means I can use a third color on the camo without going over weight... well maybe...
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Old Oct 11, 2007, 04:18 PM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar
United States, MA, Walpole
Joined Dec 2003
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ATIS
Brad,

Thanks, I have the EFlite P-47 and a PZ Spit (and or course the GWS P-38 and A-10)and they all lack rudders and I fly the crap out of them and enjoy them so I guess its weight savings... which means I can use a third color on the camo without going over weight... well maybe...
ATIS, I have rudder on mine, and wouldn't fly without it, but then I like to do soaring vertical hammerheads, snap rolls... even things like knife edge flying with this plane. I also think the P-40 does not turn as well as some of my other GWS planes without a little coordinated rudder thrown in. I don't think tail strength is an issue on this plane.

It's a personal choice thing...

BTW, I'm painting mine right now, and put a two color camo job on top. The weight without my battery pack but otherwise all flight hardware on it is 17.3 oz. I could have left the bottom white, but decided to put on a gray belly since there were already grass stains on the white foam. I use a 15C 1350 mAH size battery weighing 3.6 oz., so I figure my AUW will end up being about 21.5 oz or so. Without the rudder servo, I could save a bit of weight, but then I'd have to move my pack further aft for balance, and it was already at the back of my battery bay before painting, so plan accordingly. I don't know yet how much weight the paint affected the balance, but since most of that weight is aft of the CG, it can only help.
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Old Oct 11, 2007, 06:28 PM
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New Bern, North Carolina, United States
Joined Oct 2004
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How does the stock GWS BL Outrunner fly her? I am thinking my EFlite 450 outrunner is going to add a lot of nose weight so I may go with the stock motor... anyone sand the outside to remove the mold marks and such? I did it on my F-15 and it looked good...especially after it was painted.
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Old Oct 11, 2007, 07:11 PM
Pusher jets rule!
crxmanpat's Avatar
Mesa, AZ
Joined Jan 2006
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ATIS,

I tried it with a GWS 2215-12 and the 1060X3 prop. It flew OK, but definitely not a barn-burner. I'm much happier with the Scorpion 2215-18 that's in there now.

Pat
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Old Oct 11, 2007, 07:20 PM
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Darwin Australia
Joined May 2002
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ATIS
How does the stock GWS BL Outrunner fly her? I am thinking my EFlite 450 outrunner is going to add a lot of nose weight so I may go with the stock motor...
Use the GWS 9 x 7.5 for higher speed or the GWS 10 x 6 two or three blade for unlimited vertical.

Ken
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Old Oct 11, 2007, 10:43 PM
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New Bern, North Carolina, United States
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define "barn burner"... I am looking for 30-45 mph on level... but I do want good vertical... just to be safe... I guess 10x6 is the prop since I am belly floppin...time to keep the weight down as well... that always helps.
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Old Oct 12, 2007, 12:12 AM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar
United States, MA, Walpole
Joined Dec 2003
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ATIS
define "barn burner"... I am looking for 30-45 mph on level... but I do want good vertical... just to be safe... I guess 10x6 is the prop since I am belly floppin...time to keep the weight down as well... that always helps.
ATIS, do you already have the stock outrunner? If so, try it... you can also change later. If you don't have it, I wouldn't get it. There are other motors in the same price range with better output. For example, I have the United Hobbies "Hacker-style" KDA20-20L outrunner in mine. With a GWS 10x6 DD 2-bladed prop and my 1350 mAH 15C 3S lipo, I pull 13.5A at 11.2V with 7920 rpm as measured with my Emeter. Compare that with Kensp's numbers for the GWS outrunner with same prop. And their new equivalent Turnigy outrunner of theirs appears to be even better based on early tests.

You can refer back to my post #690 to see how my plane performed on the maiden flight (unpainted) with my power system. The GWS outrunner would give you something less for the same $ investment, but would give you that long threaded shaft the stock spinner is designed for.
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Old Oct 12, 2007, 12:29 AM
Pusher jets rule!
crxmanpat's Avatar
Mesa, AZ
Joined Jan 2006
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ATIS,

Check out the video in this post. This was the maiden flight of mine with the stcok GWS motor and the 1060X3 prop. I'd say 30-35 level flight.

Pat
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Old Oct 12, 2007, 08:33 AM
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New Bern, North Carolina, United States
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Tom,

I picked up the White P-40 with the GWS BL outrunner for $60 and 4 HS-55 servos for $45... so for $105 shipped (epyaya) I got almost everything I needed to get her in the air...I keep looking at my EFlite 450 from my ME-109 (and I am using a 40 amp ESC in the P-40 so I can change if I want)...but I want to keep the weight down... but I do like my P-47 on the 480... so I am stuck between wanting power and speed but also wanting the ability for nice easy landings with no tip stalls from all the weight up front...

Pat

How in the bloody heck did you keep orientation?? Nice flyin... if you bend the LG forward a little it helps prevent the nose overs on landings. On my P-47 I did that and went with slightly larger foam wheels... never ends up on her nose anymore. My speed should be a little higher then yours since I am belly floppin and using the 2 blade so my weight will be a little less... I am still kicking around rudder/no rudder...
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Old Oct 12, 2007, 09:59 AM
Pusher jets rule!
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Mesa, AZ
Joined Jan 2006
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ATIS,

That camera is old and the head needs a good cleaning, so the quality was not that great. I had actually kept it pretty close in on the maiden. And the only reason it flopped over on landing was becaues I actually landed on a hillside, and it was going down the slope (hard to tell in the video). If I had managed to land on the flat surface at the top of the hill, it would have been fine. So far that's the only nose over I've had.

Pat
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Old Oct 12, 2007, 10:23 AM
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New Bern, North Carolina, United States
Joined Oct 2004
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Pat, happy to hear she dont nose over...

so far the wing is together, fuse halves together, and elevator cut off (should have the directions on that part.. I cut before adding the wire... what a PITA that became), sanded everything down to get rid of the mold marks, and have added all the CF rods.... now to go to the LHS... ran out of pin hinges and 6 min epoxy... plus I need some deans, paint and a RX... always seem to run out of stuff in the middle of a build...
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Old Oct 12, 2007, 05:35 PM
Pusher jets rule!
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Mesa, AZ
Joined Jan 2006
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FWIW, I have always had good luck with the supplied GWS hinges when used with the supplied GWS glue. I always cut my slits wide enough so that the hinge slides in easily without binding. Then, I apply a light coat of glue to the hinge, let it set up for about 5 minutes, then insert into the surface. I make sure I work in the glue real well. Once it sets up, a little may bubble out of the slit, so make sure you remove an excess.

I crashed my AT-6 once when I launched with the wrong model selected. I wound up breaking off both wingtips, along with ripping out both ailerons. The GWS glue held so well that the hinges brought foam with them from the trailing edges. All I had to do was epoxy the foam back in place.

GWS glue is great stuff if used correctly.

Pat
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Old Oct 12, 2007, 07:13 PM
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New Bern, North Carolina, United States
Joined Oct 2004
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I like the micro pin hinges... no idea why... I used to use the GWS ones but once I was introduced to the pin hing I havent looked back...I am too impatient for the GWS glue... I like to keep moving and building.... started this morning and I am in paint at the moment... bottom grey is drying and then it will time to camo the top.

I did a little mod... I add a couple of little "skid plates" to the bottom of the nose to keep it off the deck and give me another 1/4 inch clearance for the 3 bladed prop... I am going to give it a try despite being a belly flopper... if it checks out... I left the prop and spinner off for paint. canopy is taped and mounted so I can carry the camo theme over the canopy to make it flow... we'll see how it turns out.
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Old Oct 13, 2007, 05:03 AM
Houng-wen Lin
GWS4CEO's Avatar
Shijr, Taiwan. DungGwan, China. City of Industry, California.
Joined Sep 2001
19,445 Posts
I am not sure how many GWS P40 really in flyers hand and had being flown?

Wish to see more flight reports!
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