Canardly Soar

Captain Canardly · Jun 17, 2007, 09:47 PM

Howdy gang!
In my learning curve of Cad, I have found I need to draw specific fuselages for given wings. Please inform me what everyone has, I need chord, span and mounting method. I will build all from there!
I have decided to go open source for this project

Johnny

GLIDERGIDER · Jun 18, 2007, 10:05 PM

Hey Captain,
I'd love to see your fuse drawings. The integration of the vertical stab is a mystery to me. I've been wanting to build a canard sailplane for sometime now.
Dave

Captain Canardly · Jun 19, 2007, 11:05 AM

Thanks for the help Dave!
I've always liked to start there!
I have decided to give push-pull a chance, as when I lost the first twelve footer to a stong dust devil, I saw some broadside flow happening, with zero rudder response.
Also after some resizing experiments with rescaling, I was thinking of thinning the basic elipse, but the lines just don't seem to work well enough for the structure needed.
Thanks again, for getting me back on track. next series will be the top view, with a proper percented canard.
Johnny

GLIDERGIDER · Jun 19, 2007, 04:16 PM

I noticed some diamonds in the fuse. Is that the fuse cross-section? Where the points are at 3-6-9-12? Great start.

Captain Canardly · Jun 19, 2007, 08:47 PM

Yes they are, Dave!
I slightly goofed in my sequencing and copying- and forgot to copy for the top view.
The side and top are symetrical, with the difference of the cutaway for rudder.
The diamonds are the base bulkheads, and referenced at 90 degrees in the view, so i could establish dimensions and Z (height) locations for wing/ canard and control actuations. here is the needed to complete sequence;
1) side view- mostly done
2) top view with wing and canard
3) forward "A-A through F-F" wing rod, canard pivot and bulkhead centerlines
4) Electronics; servo sizes, weights and moment arms to establish center of gravity--
THIS is the point of your help, when we establish what wings are interested in flying "backwards!" refer to step 2 !
More later, gotta cook a pizza and go to work!
Johnny

GLIDERGIDER · Jun 20, 2007, 01:36 PM

What thickness are you making the fuse bulkheads? What material? I assume you are putting a triangle corners at the points of the bulkhead? Would that be correct?

Captain Canardly · Jun 20, 2007, 09:14 PM

That would be 1/8" birch -hard Ply, with 1/2 " triangle stock. The triangle details would be shown on the forward views-AA etc. Had to bring wife Wife to VAMC for early appt. yesterday. back to work on it now. Johnny

Captain Canardly · Jun 21, 2007, 11:23 AM

This was quite an experiment in cut and paste, but if you ignore the stubby nose, you'll get the idea!
Now is the time for existing wings! close ups and Canard drive next!
Johnny

GLIDERGIDER · Jun 21, 2007, 11:47 PM

Very nice. That's a good looking airplane.

So the bulkheads will have triangle stock at the corners. Will you round those corners pretty good after to glue up?

GLIDERGIDER · Jun 22, 2007, 01:24 AM

Hey Captain,
Send me your plans, lets start with the bulkheads. DXF is best. I'll cut them on my CNC machine and send you the results. I normally cut wood with my machine but I've been wanting to try something more delicute in the sailplane world. I just bought some very tiny bits too.

Skonkworkstexas · Jun 23, 2007, 10:08 AM

Captain Canardly, I am thinking of doing this with an old GreatPlanes Spectra wing. It is a Seleg 3010 if I remember right with polyhedral. 78 inch span and 676 square inches. What kind of span/surface area of the canard, and fuselage length would you suggest?
Skonk

Captain Canardly · Jun 23, 2007, 10:15 AM

Skonk!
Thank You for input!
When I return from MARCEE Flight today, I will have the drawing -Public JPEG and a DFX to you! Johnny

Neil Stainton · Jun 23, 2007, 11:49 AM

The stubby nose isn't a problem, the stubby tail is. You need to change the fuse rear plan view to have a finer straight taper, or preferably a convex/concave taper to the fin.

Neil.

Skonkworkstexas · Jun 23, 2007, 12:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Captain Canardly

Skonk!
Thank You for input!
When I return from MARCEE Flight today, I will have the drawing -Public JPEG and a DFX to you! Johnny

Many thanks!
It is about 3 projects up the line, but gaining ground fast!

Captain Canardly · Jun 23, 2007, 07:57 PM

OOPSADAISY!
Skonk! I also need the chord- or I'll make 9" a standard for 2 meter!
Johnny

Jun 17, 2007, 09:47 PM	#1
Captain Canardly Registered User Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: st. paul, mn. Posts: 1,185	Canardly Soar Howdy gang! In my learning curve of Cad, I have found I need to draw specific fuselages for given wings. Please inform me what everyone has, I need chord, span and mounting method. I will build all from there! I have decided to go open source for this project Johnny

Jun 19, 2007, 11:05 AM	#3
Captain Canardly Registered User Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: st. paul, mn. Posts: 1,185	Thanks for the help Dave! I've always liked to start there! I have decided to give push-pull a chance, as when I lost the first twelve footer to a stong dust devil, I saw some broadside flow happening, with zero rudder response. Also after some resizing experiments with rescaling, I was thinking of thinning the basic elipse, but the lines just don't seem to work well enough for the structure needed. Thanks again, for getting me back on track. next series will be the top view, with a proper percented canard. Johnny Attached Thumbnails Starting with Cadintosh, and after some pasting, we are now attatched to turbo Cad 83.1 KB · Views: 292 4 pcs of fuselage, grey is triangle stock and Bulkhead basics 82.6 KB · Views: 168 A successful wing location! the rudder horn(s) would be located at midpoint on bottom sheet 96.7 KB · Views: 208 And for reference, an Eppler 193 outline at plus 3 incidence 85.9 KB · Views: 190

Jun 21, 2007, 11:23 AM	#8
Captain Canardly Registered User Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: st. paul, mn. Posts: 1,185	This was quite an experiment in cut and paste, but if you ignore the stubby nose, you'll get the idea! Now is the time for existing wings! close ups and Canard drive next! Johnny Attached Thumbnails I like a tail (canard) moment of 3 or more 64.4 KB · Views: 353

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Jun 18, 2007, 10:05 PM	#2
GLIDERGIDER cousin Dave Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Huntsville, Alabama Posts: 1,603	Hey Captain, I'd love to see your fuse drawings. The integration of the vertical stab is a mystery to me. I've been wanting to build a canard sailplane for sometime now. Dave

Jun 19, 2007, 04:16 PM	#4
GLIDERGIDER cousin Dave Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Huntsville, Alabama Posts: 1,603	I noticed some diamonds in the fuse. Is that the fuse cross-section? Where the points are at 3-6-9-12? Great start.

Jun 19, 2007, 08:47 PM	#5
Captain Canardly Registered User Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: st. paul, mn. Posts: 1,185	Yes they are, Dave! I slightly goofed in my sequencing and copying- and forgot to copy for the top view. The side and top are symetrical, with the difference of the cutaway for rudder. The diamonds are the base bulkheads, and referenced at 90 degrees in the view, so i could establish dimensions and Z (height) locations for wing/ canard and control actuations. here is the needed to complete sequence; 1) side view- mostly done 2) top view with wing and canard 3) forward "A-A through F-F" wing rod, canard pivot and bulkhead centerlines 4) Electronics; servo sizes, weights and moment arms to establish center of gravity-- THIS is the point of your help, when we establish what wings are interested in flying "backwards!" refer to step 2 ! More later, gotta cook a pizza and go to work! Johnny

Jun 20, 2007, 01:36 PM	#6
GLIDERGIDER cousin Dave Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Huntsville, Alabama Posts: 1,603	What thickness are you making the fuse bulkheads? What material? I assume you are putting a triangle corners at the points of the bulkhead? Would that be correct?

Jun 20, 2007, 09:14 PM	#7
Captain Canardly Registered User Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: st. paul, mn. Posts: 1,185	That would be 1/8" birch -hard Ply, with 1/2 " triangle stock. The triangle details would be shown on the forward views-AA etc. Had to bring wife Wife to VAMC for early appt. yesterday. back to work on it now. Johnny

Jun 21, 2007, 11:47 PM	#9
GLIDERGIDER cousin Dave Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Huntsville, Alabama Posts: 1,603	Very nice. That's a good looking airplane. So the bulkheads will have triangle stock at the corners. Will you round those corners pretty good after to glue up?

Jun 22, 2007, 01:24 AM	#10
GLIDERGIDER cousin Dave Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Huntsville, Alabama Posts: 1,603	Hey Captain, Send me your plans, lets start with the bulkheads. DXF is best. I'll cut them on my CNC machine and send you the results. I normally cut wood with my machine but I've been wanting to try something more delicute in the sailplane world. I just bought some very tiny bits too.

Jun 23, 2007, 10:08 AM	#11
Skonkworkstexas Survival is Attitude! Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Hallsville Texas Posts: 2,216	Captain Canardly, I am thinking of doing this with an old GreatPlanes Spectra wing. It is a Seleg 3010 if I remember right with polyhedral. 78 inch span and 676 square inches. What kind of span/surface area of the canard, and fuselage length would you suggest? Skonk

Jun 23, 2007, 10:15 AM	#12
Captain Canardly Registered User Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: st. paul, mn. Posts: 1,185	Skonk! Thank You for input! When I return from MARCEE Flight today, I will have the drawing -Public JPEG and a DFX to you! Johnny

Jun 23, 2007, 11:49 AM	#13
Neil Stainton - Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: Leamington Spa, England Posts: 2,882	The stubby nose isn't a problem, the stubby tail is. You need to change the fuse rear plan view to have a finer straight taper, or preferably a convex/concave taper to the fin. Neil.

Jun 23, 2007, 07:57 PM	#15
Captain Canardly Registered User Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: st. paul, mn. Posts: 1,185	OOPSADAISY! Skonk! I also need the chord- or I'll make 9" a standard for 2 meter! Johnny