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Old Apr 11, 2007, 01:03 PM
Innov8tive's Avatar
Joined Jan 2007
1,711 Posts
Mach3,

I am glad that you are happy with the motor. I think that the Scorpion motors and ESC's will show themselves to be the best value for your money in a brushless set-up. The quality is as good as anything else out there, and even better in some aspects, and the retail prices are 1/2 to 2/3 of other "Name Brand" motors. We have heard a lot of very good reports from people all over the world that are using the motors and they have commented on how powerfull they are compared to other motors, and how much quieter they run as well.


Ron,

I will speak to the owner of Scorpion, and see if he has any "Factory Tour" photos available that I can share with the rest of you. I have seen a few photos of the factory, and some of his staff as well, and it looks very nice.

When I do go over there myself, you can bet that I will take a bunch of photos for my own records.

Lucien
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Old Apr 12, 2007, 06:14 AM
Innov8tive's Avatar
Joined Jan 2007
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Almost to Toledo!

Hello everyone!

I am sitting here in the airport in Charlotte NC waiting to get onto my connecting flight up to Detroit. I will be setting up the booth for the Toledo show later this afternoon, and be working at the show all day Friday, Saturday and Sunday.

I always enjoy going to the Toledo show, since my entire family lives in Monroe, Michigan, just 25 miles north of Toledo. It gives me a chance to see a great show and my family at the same time!

I will have my brothers working in my booth with me this weekend, so when you stop by, you can meet them as well.

We will have many items at the booth this year. There will be the entire line of Scorpion 22mm motors and the entire line of 30mm motors. We will also have all the Scorpion ESC's to go with them. We will also be introducing a line of Scorpion Replacement parts including Cross Mounts, Spare Motor Shafts, Collet Style Prop Shaft Adapters, Wobbly Prop Adapters and a neat stamped aluminum Stick Mount for the 22mm Scorpion motors.

We will also have the entire line of X-Caliber Li-Po batteries at the show, and will be introducing several new sizes. We also will have a large selection of bullet connectors, battery connectors, BEC Circuits and Series and Parallel Battery Y-Harnesses.

We will also be introducing a new line of Speed Demon Brushless Motors. These are nice little units in the $14.95 to $24.95 price range for people that are on a budget, and just want a nice little brushless motor for their plane. These are available in several sizes and pole configurations ranging from a 3/4 ounce 1806 stator size, up to a 2815 stator size.

We also brought a whole bunch of GWS DD and HD series props in sizes from 7x3.5 up to 11x7, so if you need a prop to go with your new motor, you can get those as well.

For all of you that are coming to the show, have a great time, and be sure to stop by and introduce yourself. We would love the opportunity to get to meet you.

See you at the show!

Lucien
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Old Apr 12, 2007, 06:20 AM
homo ludens modellisticus
Ron van Sommeren's Avatar
near Nijmegen, Netherlands
Joined Feb 2001
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Innov8tive
... I have seen a few photos of the factory, and some of his staff as well, and it looks very nice ...
Factory or staff?
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Old Apr 12, 2007, 05:25 PM
Innov8tive's Avatar
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Both actually, now that you mention it!

Lucien
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Old Apr 13, 2007, 12:42 AM
Cogito Ergo Sum
Joined Dec 2003
485 Posts
Holy smokes, ask you the time and you built me a watch.... just kidding with you. that was a very thorough answer though. I was just wondering where they are made. I would assume that motors made in china are the norm..not the exception..even the high end Hackers,,,,,, look closely, im sure something is made in china
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Old Apr 13, 2007, 08:27 AM
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i have a 23 oz plane that needs a motor to do 3d. I'm looking for about 40 oz of thrust and draw about 20amps. That seems to lead me to the 30mm series. Which one would you recommend?

Thanks,
Steve
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Old Apr 13, 2007, 09:16 AM
Keep it up, I'm reloading
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In my home
Joined Jan 2006
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According to Lucien's website, the 2215-18 is about right, with a little power on reserve. 230 watts@22 amps.
http://www.innov8tivedesigns.com/pro...products_id=36
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Old Apr 13, 2007, 09:52 AM
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I'm worried about the 3mm shaft breaking. I prefer the 5mm shaft on the 30 series motors. I was hoping to see some specs on the 30 series motors with different props. BTW I will be using a 3-cell lipo.
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Old Apr 13, 2007, 06:53 PM
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Joined Jan 2007
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swa2153,

Our 3008 series motors would be excellent in this case. If you want to keep the current draw down, I would use the 3008-32 wind. I tried it on my test stand, and it really pulled well. I have my prop chart at the show right now, so I will get back with you tomorrow with some actual test stand numbers. Just off the top of my head, with an 11x6 prop, you should get a 20-22 amp draw with 44-45 ounces of thrust, but let me verify this in the morning.

Lucien
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Old Apr 15, 2007, 07:29 AM
Keep it up, I'm reloading
WACOFlyer's Avatar
In my home
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Lucien,

It was nice to finally meet you in person yesterday at Toledo. I am sure I will enjoy the 2215-18 and the 3008-28 motors I purchased from you.
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Old Apr 19, 2007, 12:11 PM
"You know how I Roll"
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United States, CA, Redding
Joined Jan 2007
524 Posts
Lucien,

Are you close to getting some test stand #'s for the 3008 series motors?
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Old Apr 19, 2007, 12:36 PM
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cjdscratch,

Yes, I am going to run some more tests over the next few days, and on through the weekend. Hopefully I will have some nice prop charts to post by next week.

Lucien
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Old Apr 19, 2007, 03:41 PM
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Chattanooga, Tennessee, United States
Joined May 2003
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cjdscratch
Lucien,

Thanks for the info. I also wanted to ask you if you ran any bench tests on the 2215-18 with a APC 10x7E? If not what would guess the amp draw to be? I would think that it would be close to the GWS 11x7 but maybe more efficient. I put the GWS 11x7 on last night and it did not seem to have the pull that the APC 10x5e had. I just held the plane in my hand to feel the thrust and the 10x5e won hands down. I am not sure why. I will see tonight how they compare in the air.

thanks, Chris
My feeling is that the 11x7 GWS may simply be too big (as would a 10x7 APC E), and bogging the motor down. The 10x5 is small enough that the motor can rev at a point it "likes" - and you'll get more out of the motor in terms of useful power, rather than having that power be converted into excess waste heat.

If you went to limiting case, imagine putting, say, a 24" prop on - the motor will stall or at best run very slowly - and get extremely hot in doing so, since it is now generating mostly heat and little useful power.

You can actually see this tendency (for, in this case, the Scorpion 2212/26) in some numbers I posted (and graphed) in another thread:http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=673626

If you look at the graphs for the Grayson-Welgard 2217-09, in the 9x5 GWS HD graph, the Scorpion is up there with the best of them - but if you compare that with the graph for a 10x6 GWS HD, the Scorpion struggles a bit, and is in the "lower tier".

Rule to live by: put too big a prop on your motor and it WILL struggle - use a more suitable (smaller) prop and you'll get better performance, and you may be able to put MORE power through it (and get more useful power-out) than you could with the "too big" prop.
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Last edited by Dr Kiwi; Apr 19, 2007 at 04:47 PM.
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Old Apr 19, 2007, 04:57 PM
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Near Kingston, Ontario, Canada
Joined Dec 2004
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cjdscratch
Well I just got back from flying my airfoilz Edge for the first time. My Scorpion 2215-18 motor pulls that plane with authority. I was using the 10x5e prop, I will try out the GWS 11x7 this weekend and give you all a report. I did fly one full battery pack for 10 minutes WOT and when I brought the plane down the motor was barely warm to the touch. I have never had a motor run this cool.

Chris
I just did a bench test with the Scorpion 2215-18 using the APC 10x5 and APC 10x7 with the following results;

APC 10x5 APC 10x7

Volts 10.5 10.5
Amps 17.8 21.15
Watts 186 222
Thrust (Oz) 30.0 23.6
RPM 8175 7025

There is no doubt that the 10.5 is the best of the two. Sorry I didn't have a GWS 10x7 to try out. Looks like Lucien was right on the money when he said that the 10x7 would perform poorly due to it high pitch. The motor was very comfortable with the 10.5 at 10.5 volts but prop noise was considerable with the 10x7. I would stick with the 10x5.

I was assuming that you were using a 3S pack so I used 10,5 volts for my measurements. I can give you results on anything from 7 volts to 12 volts as they are already graphed with my Power Analyzer Pro..

Dave
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Old Apr 19, 2007, 05:06 PM
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United States, MA, Walpole
Joined Dec 2003
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I routinely switch between APE 10x5E and GWS 10x6HD props... they are very close to each other in performance. I go with the APC E prop if I need a little more weight up front.
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