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Old Feb 06, 2007, 07:39 AM
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dreamped up this last night fer the footies.

we can't change the rules, we must engineer around them.
so, why not use the ballast we have (since they're so heavy), and put one of the battery pack's cells in a custom bulb.
it could be machined alu. center with heavy metal tips, that thread in. like your maglite flaslights, or simple by using the appropriate sized tube, and silicone-bond (james' brother), in pre-molded lead shapes.
see pic. of "wonder keel"

Nigel.
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Old Feb 06, 2007, 08:24 AM
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I'm imagining someone firmly fitting a lead filled cell for the scutineers' benefit and then running the radio off a further 3 1.5 V AA cells in the hull.
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Old Feb 06, 2007, 08:45 AM
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i missed the part in the rules about the batteries being in the hull, so never mind the idea.

nigel
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Old Feb 06, 2007, 10:20 AM
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United Kingdom, England, Burnley
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Quote:
martin richards mentioned
1.5 V AA cells in the hull
The Footy rules say

C. CONDITIONS FOR RACING
C.1 Control is restricted to 2 channel radio control gear.
C.2 Batteries are restricted to 4 no. AA size batteries placed within the hull.
C.3 During an event the following shall apply:
(a) ballast shall not be changed, moved or rotated relative to the hull.
(b) no more than 2 sets of rig and sail(s) shall be used.
(c) the smaller rig and sail set shall not project more than 305mm above the top of the measurement box.


There is nothing within the above rules to say that the AA cells must be of 1.5v, and no mention is made about the use of rechargeable cells...

It is therefore my humble opinon that the best way to arrange four AA cells within a Footy hull would be as two soldered pairs of high capacity NiMH cells, each individually sealed into shrink sleeving with a 3" length of wire to connect the two pairs.

That way, the two '1/2-battery-packs' can each sit as low as possible either side of the fin/keel ( or whatever ), and their weight is therefore placed as low as possible, whilst being positioned legally - within the hull...

That is the way I plan on doing it...
__________________________________________________

Regarding the first point:
C.1 Control is restricted to 2 channel radio control gear.

What EXACTLY is it that constitutes the use of 2 channels ?

I have three 40Mhz examples - though frequency is irrelevant.

1/ If I were to use a 2-channel transmitter on 40Mhz, but I used my 40Mhz Cirrus 4-channel micro receiver - with a couple of small servos selected specifically for the job in hand... Would that be OK ?
I am only transmitting two functions, and as there are only two servos fitted in the boat - the fact that the receiver in the boat is capable of receiving four channels is of no consequence... right ?

2/ If I were to use my Skysport4 transmitter with the Cirrus 4-channel micro receiver - with a couple of small servos selected specifically for the job in hand... Would that be OK ?
Despite the fact that both transmitter AND receiver are capable of operating more than two functions - there are only two servos fitted into the boat - so only two functions can be used... . Right ?

3/ If I were to use my Skysport4 transmitter with a 2-channel 40Mhz micro receiver - with a couple of small servos selected specifically for the job in hand... Would that be OK ?
The transmitter can transmit signals for four functions, but as the receiver is only capable of decoding the first two - and there are only two servos fitted into the boat - only two functions can be used... . Right ?

My assumption is that "two functions" means just that.

I fly model gliders with my FF6 6-function computer transmitter.
The transmitter can transmit 6 functions, but as there are only two servos ( operating rudder and elevator ), the model is a two-function glider...

Are we talking channels - or functions ?
If we ARE talking channels, then a Spektrum radio ( normally used for a helicopter ) CANNOT be used.

Some clarification, please ?

Keven.
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Old Feb 06, 2007, 10:56 AM
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yes, using two channels of a 4 channel reciever is fine. and yes, i am pretty sure sailing with a 4 channel radio, and only using two channels would be ok too, at least, i don't think anybody would turn you away, as long as there was an inspection to be sure you really had only two servos... and yes, i think the spirit of the rule is that there be sail and rudder control only. a little while back there was some conversation about multitasking channels and so you could add servos to do different things on the same channel, i don't know that that is within th spirit of the rule, and i haven't headr anything since, but as i said, i don't think anybody would chase you away from a regatta just because you where using a 4 channel radio that was utilizing only two channels...
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Old Feb 06, 2007, 11:37 AM
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Ha. I tried that idea already Nigel. Yup, batteries in a hull appendage are not in the hull. You could prbably do it in a full keel design but those aren't very fast. Of course nobody has tried one at footy scale. I want to try a deep hull design with a smaller bulb and bury the batteries as far down as possible.
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Old Feb 06, 2007, 05:47 PM
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There is a deep long keel Footy design in one of the latest magazines here in the UK.
December 2006 Model boats has a free plan and feature by Richard Webb for a Footy based on an Itchen Ferry called Wonder... registration SU120.

The bowsprit on the model is way too long ( at about 6" * ) to compete under the rules... but a deep hull design has been done at Footy scale...
* The rig is 'scale' gaff cutter...

See my poor picture of the photo in the magazine that best illustrates the hull shape...

Keven.
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Old Feb 06, 2007, 06:05 PM
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Quote:
420sailor said
i don't think anybody would chase you away from a regatta just because you where using a 4 channel radio that was utilizing only two channels...
Thanks for you reply...

Assuming your analagy ( the same as mine ) is correct, I can use all six of the transmitters I have with ANY of my many receivers - provided the freqencies match...

'Functions' and 'channels' are words that are often misused... mostly with descriptions of R/C toys on their boxes ( but also by some long-time modellers )... as follows:

A model that quite clearly has only 2-channel radio is often described as having 6 or 8 functions...
Fwd left/Fwd/Fwd right/Rwd left/Rwd/Rwd right !

The other two would be - of course...?
Yep - stop and go !

The spirit of the Footy rules is that a model built to them will have sail and rudder control only - and will use only two servos to achieve that.
I would say...

Keven.
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Old Feb 06, 2007, 11:20 PM
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Keven,
There is no bowsprit length restriction.
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Old Feb 07, 2007, 02:00 AM
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I just 'ad a quick shuftie... and -

Oh yeah...

It appears I am getting confused, Brett.
A state that is very easily managed - I blame the morphine !

In that case, I am going to draw up a couple of new 12" long hulls...
With no restriction on bowsprit or bumpkin length, the possibilities are almost endless...

Keven.
( where's me pencil ? )
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Old Feb 07, 2007, 05:22 AM
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On number oc channels, read the rule. What it actually says is that 'control' is restricted to'. You can have as many channels as you like - but only two of them can do any controlling.

A.
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Old Feb 07, 2007, 05:41 AM
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Very good...

Keven.
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Old Feb 07, 2007, 08:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Angus R
On number oc channels, read the rule. What it actually says is that 'control' is restricted to'. You can have as many channels as you like - but only two of them can do any controlling.

A.

The actual rule states

C. CONDITIONS FOR RACING
C.1 Control is restricted to 2 channel radio control gear.


It doesn't state that the yacht is Restricted & controlled by 2 Functions, eg Sail & Rudder..

If there was this intent it would have been stated.

Now then, If I choose to use a switch system within the second channel, or possibly both I can have many functions undertaken depending on the throw of the stick or maybe a dial.

In fact I have a unit that converts one channnel to perform 8 functions. some hard latched some not and other functions multiplexed on the Tx..

On a footy possibly not worth the bother but on another yacht very reliable.

Unfortunately as electronics diminish in size this opens up many many possibilities. Footy becomes a possibility when the Bits that stick outside the box have no limits.

Footy at 36" that'll be the go in light winds.. a la Balmain Bugs, a fond childhood memory..

So maybe the rule needs to be more robust, especially if it can't withstand people asking about the boundaries.

Obviously when you have them why not disclose them, or maybe the 4 AA's are no longer AA's.

What is a AA battery anyway?

They don't look the same any more.. Perhaps 4 AA alkaline cells Ymm by Xmm would be better.. Wasn't the Intent 4 AA's to be Duracells or the like fitting with the Two Channel over the counter packages available at the LHS..

Kept the costs down.

Then again Micro Servos now allowed, sailwinch, high torque exotic servos, exotic batteries etc etc.

Intent gets left behind when it suits..

Now we have $500 boats which nobody sails.. and if they do eventually become the winnig boats, they will kill the class if they don't already know. Eliteism is always the downfall of any well intentioned activity.

Take it back a step and put the boats on the water. Forget the Chest expansions & sabre rattling and get back to having something to promote in the first place. But then again nobody can register a boat unless they agree with those that think they own the class by divine right.

A lot of people getting turned off by the antics..

To quote my learnered friend Angus, My Tuppence...
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