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Old Apr 24, 2007, 03:57 AM
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B'ham UK
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Pterodactyl .............check out the creations on the Vintage Ultra Light Aircraft pages .............. it was also the final fun plane of one of the great test pilots of aviation history Harald Penrose chief test pilot for Westlands and a man who flew into his eighties having pioneered the tailless westland Pterodactyl's......and helicopters, jets the lot.

http://yeovil-raes.org.uk/Harald_Penrose.htm

http://www.furthermore.org.uk/static.../penrose10.htm
in my searches I found this, if the link will work facinating reading but this is the bit that caught my eye
Harald Penrose

10. New Aircraft


by Phil Delnon
By the mid-1930s, things were hotting up. The Depression was easing, and Westland was working on many different aircraft. Penrose found himself on a familiarisation course for the Cierva autogyro. Being the man he was he decided to try diving it, working step by step until he found his safe limit at 120mph. Penrose and his colleagues at Westland decided that the rotor blades must be twisting, and passed on a warning. The Cierva people dismissed this, saying that civilian pilots would not dive the machine. Maybe not, but military ones would: a few months later an RAF autogyro dived from 1000 feet and crashed into the sea.
Meanwhile Westland was persisting with the futuristic swept-wing, tailless Pterodactyl. RAE pilots had not been able to make it spin, so Penrose had a bash. Eventually he managed it, and found the recovery very simple. In 1933 a visitor came to Westland to exchange information on wind-tunnel tests of delta-wing stability and control: it was Alexander Lippisch, whose passion for tailless gliders would lead to his design of the Me-163 rocket fighter.
More immediately significant for Westland was the first enclosed canopy on the DV6, which reduced the slipstream-buffeting for the pilot. Renamed the Wallace, the plane was ordered for the Auxiliary Air Force.
With this security, experiments with the Pterodactyl continued. Always enthusiastic, Penrose found himself directed to an old dark house in deepest Dorset, where a white-bearded old man in a skull-cap was reading the Koran. He showed Penrose what remained of the tailless model gliders he had made and flown before the Wright Brothers flew. The largest of them had an 8ft wingspan and a close resemblance to the Pterodactyl which Penrose could not help but comment on.
Perhaps that's because one of your designers came to see me, was the laconic reply.

Next for testing was a high-winged monoplane with a 60ft wingspan and a wide, fixed undercarriage. Named the P7, Penrose had been involved with its design in some detail, and did not anticipate too many problems when he took it up. Nor were there many; the main one being distortion of the wing when rolling at high speed. The chief designer was unwilling to believe this until taken up for a demonstration...
Penrose was becoming valuable now: not only did he have a parachute, but his insurance was raised to 5,000. He was about to appreciate why. Aeronautical engineers had already realised that mounting the engine in the middle of an aeroplane would make for a much more central centre of gravity and a much better aerobatic performance - important for a fighter. This was to lead to such aircraft as the American Bell P-38 Airacobra, which actually went into service.
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Old Apr 24, 2007, 07:43 AM
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Whats that to do with Canards well ................................Miles and Dh were also playing at the time penrose was about his tailess stuff
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Old Apr 24, 2007, 04:47 PM
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pmp john, Thanks for showing that ultra light which looks like a Zagi to me. It's amazing what can be made to fly with that draggy cabin and no airfoil design. The test pilot had to be very brave. The elevator control just had to be a canard because it would be tough to try elevons even with a hard wing.Could that be a one of a kind? I recently read that a canard type requires 30% less power. Airboat, I enjoyed your contribution. My SEFF trip had to be shortened this year but I hope to be there on Saturday to just meet a few of you and look for canards on the line. My hope is that this thread may have influenced several of you to show off your creations. I will have my new silver Goose and maybe a few sets of Ga. Goose plans. Charles
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Old Apr 24, 2007, 06:00 PM
Dr John
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Lake Placid, Florida
Joined Dec 2001
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Charles,

As airboat said it is a Pterodactyl. It was the only one flying but there was an unbuilt kit for sale at the parts exchange. See you at SEFF. My LEZ is already loaded and we are leaving in the AM. My motorhome will have an orange and white windsock mounted to the rear ladder.

John
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Old Apr 24, 2007, 06:42 PM
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New Bern, NC
Joined Mar 2001
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We are leaving for SEFF on Thursday morning. Should be there by 2 pm. I will be the guy with white socks, one on each foot. The Petrodactyl was a comercially available Ultralite if memory serves me. My Kasperwing was just that, a flying wing with a reflerxed airfoil and winglets. Instead of a canard, mine was weight shift in pitch. Very much like a powered hang glider, and was designed by Wilholt Kasper, a Boeing aeronautical engineer. I sure miss that machine. See ya at SEFF.
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Old Apr 25, 2007, 01:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Smith
We are leaving for SEFF on Thursday morning. Should be there by 2 pm. I will be the guy with white socks, one on each foot. The Petrodactyl was a comercially available Ultralite if memory serves me. My Kasperwing was just that, a flying wing with a reflerxed airfoil and winglets. Instead of a canard, mine was weight shift in pitch. Very much like a powered hang glider, and was designed by Wilholt Kasper, a Boeing aeronautical engineer. I sure miss that machine. See ya at SEFF.
you're right about the "petro" Tom, back in my hangliding days I knew a fellow that had and .....unfortunately met his demise in one....Charles SEFF is looking doubtful for me unless I make a "passable effort" at being "sick" on friday and call in..according to a couple people I know that are already down there, its unlikely you'll be able to set-up your ez-up on the flightline like last year unless you get there tomorrow,as i understand it space is filling up quickly ;our group (atlanta area flyers )were talking about setting up 3 rows of 3 (ez ups)so as to keep everybody together but thats looking doubtful now.
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Old Apr 27, 2007, 04:38 AM
That motor isn't hot...
rosco's Avatar
Brisbane, Australia
Joined Aug 2005
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Would some of you crazy canard cats please give some design advice at my thread here?
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=677858

Thanks in advance

Cheers
rosco
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Old Apr 27, 2007, 10:10 AM
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Shelton Field's Carolina Goose

Shelton Fields of Reidsville, NC sent photos of his version of the Ga. Goose. Shelton got the plans last fall after the Tullahoma,Tn. Electric event. I plan to fly with Shelton on May 5-6 at the RAMS electric fly in just north of Winston Salem near King,NC.. Charles
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Old Apr 30, 2007, 10:54 AM
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I'm back from SEFF. Saw a few canards flying up there.
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Old Apr 30, 2007, 12:09 PM
Dr John
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I'm back from SEFF. We had a few canards flying up there.

Inspector Gadget flew several of his canards. I flew my LEZ, testing a new Vampower pack, never could get over half throttle and still keep it in the parky area. Canard Addict joined us Saturday and shared some shade. Good to see you again Charles.

All and all another great SEFF.

John
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Old Apr 30, 2007, 06:55 PM
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It was good to see more canards this year. Sorry that I was not very sociable because of a really bad Friday. Inspector Gadget has a few pictures that I took with his camera. I found nine canards brought by Keith McCormick, John Starks,Randall Geiger, Mike Mclain, Gerry Armstrong, Unknown with a Sonic Liner and Myself. Last year I had two canards and someone had a Quickie.Tom Smith and Mustang Ace Keith left their canards safely at home. A pretty good showing. Charles
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Old Apr 30, 2007, 07:14 PM
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Hey Charles, I'm going to bring the navy canard twin to Morriston May26-27 if it flies. I'll post whatever info needed to determine ther cg for sucess. Please let me know what numbers are needed and hope to see yall there. Kyle
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Old Apr 30, 2007, 07:52 PM
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My Long EZ is as of yet unflown, so going by AMA safety rules, I couldn't fly it at SEFF anyway. I am shooting for this Wednesday for the maiden voyage. That, and I have an old German Taube that is about ready to go too. Tom.
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Old Apr 30, 2007, 08:04 PM
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http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=631955
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Old May 01, 2007, 12:21 PM
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Mustang, Kyle, Just go to page nine post 133 and use the COG calculator. Add it to your favorites or Bookmarks. Enter the measurements and 10% static margin for your COG. It has never failed me. Good luck with the maiden. Charles
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