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Old Dec 18, 2006, 01:31 PM
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Taunton, Somerset (UK)
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Setting up a full house Glider with a JR 9X II

I'm now the proud owner of a JR 9X II with more functions that I can get my head around at the moment. I've set up a 4 servo wing sail plane on my JR X-378 so I understand the basics but the full implications of flight modes are new to me. This TX has 5 Launch,Cruise,Thermal,Speed and Landing. I know you can't give me actual settings but can anyone outline the different requirements for these different modes. I know there will be differences between slope and flat field settings and they my require completely different model memories. An example I've heard that reverse differential can be good when using crow for landing as cooupled with full rudder throw you get better direction control. Another example...I like coupled flaps and ailerons for increased roll rate in aerobatics but is it better to just use ailerons on their own for thermalling??? What differences, if any,for D/R and expo in these different modes.
If all this has been discussed already can you point me to the correct threads as my search didn't come up with anything.
Thanks in advance
Colin
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Old Dec 18, 2006, 02:30 PM
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Colin - The key to useful flight modes is to get a 'normal' one well sorted first and then use the flight modes to switch out various undesirable bits (snap flap or camber under full crow etc...) by copying the original 'first' one as a base for the others.
You'll still be compromising with a 9x 2 but it is better than the original bug ridden 9x afterall!

You should be looking at things like different differential settings. Thermal for instance will see the trailing edge drooped , instantly throwing your 'normal' diff right out of the window. Likewise a different differential set will be required once again for 'speed' if you reflex the trailing edge up (not good on some sections so be careful). Speed might also see reduced elevator and aileron throw without flicking multiple rate switches or increased snap flap to account for the raised trailing edge.

Learn the philosophy of the radio first - then get a really good set-up on your model before you start copying. Otherwise you'll end up changing the same things in each flight mode and sure as eggs is eggs you will miss something key.......

Andy
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Old Dec 18, 2006, 02:33 PM
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I think lots of this is based on personal preference and what you can/want to take advantage of on your ship.

That said, I have a 9303 which is similar to a 9x-II, and fly mostly slope (sport not competition). My programming is really simple ... for 4-servo wing ships, I started out with 3 modes on the left switch. Launch had full TE (more roll authority during low-speed hand launch) while Cruise had reflex/camber. Crow was on Land. I ended up combining full TE and camber into Cruise and don't use Launch anymore. In Land, I couple rudder to aileron to reduce my workload.

I haven't programmed in reverse diff for Land but I should try it, might yield more roll authority in Crow. If I flew any flat land tasks, I'd probably use more modes. HTH,

Lance
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Old Dec 18, 2006, 02:45 PM
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colin wavell's Avatar
Taunton, Somerset (UK)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slopetrashuk

Learn the philosophy of the radio first - then get a really good set-up on your model before you start copying. Otherwise you'll end up changing the same things in each flight mode and sure as eggs is eggs you will miss something key.......

Andy
Good advice ...Thanks
Re differential..in principle do you need less if the TE is reflexed and more if the TE is lowered?
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Old Dec 18, 2006, 03:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hydrogin
I haven't programmed in reverse diff for Land but I should try it, might yield more roll authority in Crow. If I flew any flat land tasks, I'd probably use more modes.
Lance
I LOVE reverse diff when slope landing a mouldie. It makes easier to counteract for weird rotors on the edge of the slope when you are just a few feets high...
Also, when i use the landing crow, i inhibit the aileron->flap mix.

It's true, 5 flight modes aren't necessary for slope soaring, because you can manage a whole flight with just cruise and land modes, but for flat field the flight modes become useful!

Take a look at this article:
http://www.horizonhobby.com/Articles...ID=1459&Page=1
it may help you understand better how this tx works.
regards,
Chets
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Old Dec 18, 2006, 06:44 PM
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colin wavell's Avatar
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chetosmachine
Take a look at this article:
http://www.horizonhobby.com/Articles...ID=1459&Page=1
it may help you understand better how this tx works.
regards,
Chets
Thanks so much for that link...that tells me exactlywhat I wanted to know.
In summary:
Below is a list of possible additions to basic programming after the cruise mode is set up just as Slopetrash suggested

In Cruise Mode:
1. Set up you plane in this mode and use it as your baseline.

In Launch Mode:
1. Launch Flaps.
2. Less elevator throw.
3. More rudder to Aileron mix.

In Speed Mode:
1. Reflex the trailing edge.
2. Much less Rudder to Aileron Mix.
3. Either less elevator throw or more positive exponential.
4. Less Aileron throw or more positive exponential.
5. Possible less aileron differential.

In Thermal Mode:
1. More Aileron to Rudder Mix.
2. Less Aileron throw.
3. Less Elevator throw.

In Landing Mode:
1. More Aileron to Rudder Mix.
2. Less Elevator Throw.
3. Reverse Aileron Differential.

Thanks again
Colin
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Old Dec 18, 2006, 07:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by colin wavell
Good advice ...Thanks
Re differential..in principle do you need less if the TE is reflexed and more if the TE is lowered?
Hi Colin. What you're trying to do with diff is equalise the drag from the movement of the ailerons to eliminate adverse (or proverse) yaw. Some however is good depending on what you want to do and on other models you might end up with totally split aileron movements to equalise drag but at the expense of roll rate. Typically on a 4 servo slope soarer wing the scction is semi symmetrical. Iy you need a given amount of up aileron for a given amount of down aileron on the other side to equalise the drag then if you raise them both slightly (i.e. reflex the wing) then your upgoing aileron will cause greater drag than your downgoing. You would therefore need to reduce the amount of differential to increase the amount of down going aileron and achieve the equilibrium once again.

Clear as mud eh!
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Old Dec 18, 2006, 10:11 PM
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Great thread some good info here.
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Old Dec 20, 2006, 04:14 PM
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I seem to have got it sussed. The Horizon Hobby link was very helpful
http://www.horizonhobby.com/Article...eID=1459&Page=1
There is still one thing I can't get to work yet and that is the multipoint ELEV - FAP mix that you use with crow. The standard mix in the Butterfly menu works fine but this multipoint one is all to pot. It seems to work in reverse so that as I pull the stick down the graph scans from the end back to the beginning..right to left instead of left to right. Difficult to explain but somebody may know what I'm talking about and be able to tell me where I'm going wrong. There is always a great temptation to think the software has a bug but all the 'bugs' I've had so far have been me not understanding the 'philosophy' (as Andy put it) of the TX.
Here's Hoping
Other than this I think it's a great piece of kit
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Old Dec 20, 2006, 04:24 PM
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Glad you;re getting on with it OK colin but the 'Philosophy' has much more to do with the manufacturer than the specific radio. With Futaba for instance you can only have one of either differential or flapperon mixe at any one time. If you choose flapperon you have to achieve diff by adjusting 4 ATV settings. JR will allow you to set percentage for both mixing functions. When you play with the radio more it will all start to drop into place. Beware using a function just because your radio has it. You won't believe how many models I've seen crashed in automatic landing mode!!!

Andy
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Old Dec 20, 2006, 04:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by colin wavell
The standard mix in the Butterfly menu works fine but this multipoint one is all to pot. It seems to work in reverse so that as I pull the stick down the graph scans from the end back to the beginning..right to left instead of left to right. Difficult to explain but somebody may know what I'm talking about and be able to tell me where I'm going wrong.
Programmable Mix 1 (SPOI->ELEV) works the same way on my 9303 - the vertical bar moves from right to left as I lower my spoiler/flap stick. I don't know why that is or whether that's the way it should be, but I've become accustomed to it


Lance
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Old Dec 20, 2006, 04:47 PM
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Magic..writing the post above helped. I just reversed the figures in the example so that +15 is at point 6 and +44 is at point 1 and it worked correctly.
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Old Dec 20, 2006, 04:58 PM
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Originally Posted by colin wavell
Magic..writing the post above helped. I just reversed the figures in the example so that +15 is at point 6 and +44 is at point 1 and it worked correctly.
Haha, you've got to be kidding! I'll give that a try tonite. Way to think out of the box!

Lance
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Old Dec 20, 2006, 05:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slopetrashuk
Beware using a function just because your radio has it. You won't believe how many models I've seen crashed in automatic landing mode!!!
Abso-bloody-lutely
I'm not necessarily going to use all these functions. I've just been experimenting in order to understand how they work on my old Spirit Elite. Now when the bank balance is a bit better I need to get a better plane with better servos to do all this justice. You would think the slop and poor centering of my Spirit just laughable but it has been a good trainer to get to grips with the complexities (to me) of a computer radio and full house flying.
So an Espresso, Luna, Whisper, Alex XL 2M, 1.9 Blade or similar will be my next purchase. I need more brownie points first though
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Old Dec 20, 2006, 05:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hydrogin
Haha, you've got to be kidding! I'll give that a try tonite. Way to think out of the box!

Lance
The curser still moves from right to left but the elevator goes down as it should. Perhaps my servos are oriented differently than the example given in the manual
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