Originally Posted by Ruud_NL

In Belgium the F3P competition is very quiet; last I heard is that there is no competition anymore.

In Czech there is/was the indoorfest; I have sent a message to David Kyovski for details... keep you updated if any new info....
...

I know that are no competitions scheduled in Belgium and the Czech Republic, that's why I am asking. I am interested to know the reasons behind it.

Jürgen

Originally Posted by Jurgen Heilig

Tentatively scheduled for the weekend 06.- 07. November 2010 at 68794 Oberhausen-Rheinhausen (between Karlsruhe and Heidelberg) - same place where the first championship took place in 2001.

Link to the organizing club: http://www.msv-oberhausen.de/

Jürgen

Hi Jürgen,

Which B-program is applicable? Same as used at last DMFV indoor competition?

Regards
Ruud

Originally Posted by Ruud_NL

Hi Jürgen,

Which B-program is applicable? Same as used at last DMFV indoor competition?

Regards
Ruud

Well, the DMFV F3P-Sport schedule is rather an "A minus" than a B-schedule. I will probably do a little survey to find out, whether potential competitors would like to see any changes for the 2010 schedule.

Jürgen

Originally Posted by Jurgen Heilig

Well, the DMFV F3P-Sport schedule is rather an "A minus" than a B-schedule. I will probably do a little survey to find out, whether potential competitors would like to see any changes for the 2010 schedule.

Jürgen

A little bit less difficult will incourage more competitors to participate I think... as you say it's "A minus" and the difference in level to fly A program is not that big.
If you don't mind I would like to suggest to also do a C-program (kind) to encourage new pilots with basic to intermediate level in flyingskills. The step to participate in German championships for newcomers is now a very big one.
I think it will be good for promoting F3P and bringing new pilots.

regards
ruud

Originally Posted by Ruud_NL

...
If you don't mind I would like to suggest to also do a C-program (kind) to encourage new pilots with basic to intermediate level in flyingskills. The step to participate in German championships for newcomers is now a very big one.
I think it will be good for promoting F3P and bringing new pilots.

regards
ruud

Hi Ruud,

of course it would be fairly easy to increase the numbers of competitors, but after all it is an annual Championship where you want quality rather than quantity. The schedules are intentionally difficult in order to avoid having to run qualification contests.

As the models are getting lighter and slower, even 50 competitors appear too much for a 2 day competition. You may already have to decrease the number of pilots for round three.

While promoting F3P is for sure a good thing, F3P-C and -D are foreseen for smaller events (i.e. like club or county competitions).

Jürgen

Originally Posted by Jurgen Heilig

While promoting F3P is for sure a good thing, F3P-C and -D are foreseen for smaller events (i.e. like club or county competitions).

Jürgen

Jurgen,

Is there any chance that the F3P-C and D could be revised slightly to give everyone something new to fly at the entry level?

aerolite

Originally Posted by aerolite

Jurgen,

Is there any chance that the F3P-C and D could be revised slightly to give everyone something new to fly at the entry level?

aerolite

Anything below F3P-A is no official FAI class and every nation can basically do what they want here. The current German F3P-C and -D schedules have initially been the DMFV Indoor-Expert and Indoor-Sport Classes from 2001 to 2003. When the new classes F3AI-A und F3AI-B were introduced in 2004, they became F3AI-C and F3AI-D (now F3P-C and F3P-D).

As I modified the FAI F3P-AP schedule for the DMFV German Indoor Championship last year, I called it F3P-Expert and the new F3P-B schedule F3P-Sport to avoid confusion. If I ever needed to create a schedule below F3P-Sport, I would most likely call it F3P-Hobby.

Jürgen

Jurgen, thanks for the clarification on the different sequences. I like your idea of an expert and sport schedule.

We have lots of folks wanting to try pattern for the first time, and we let them fly the older traditional C pattern.

What are your thoughts on changing it up a little to make it more interesting for those just getting started, like maybe adding 1 or two more maneuvers?

Also a question on the F3P-expert. I see several different versions used. Example, some with spins, some without.

What is the most common version being used, so we can start using it here in the states for our local events? Is the only difference one has the spin and another doesn't?

It seems some do the torque roll differently also, what are your thoughts?

aerolite

Originally Posted by aerolite

...
We have lots of folks wanting to try pattern for the first time, and we let them fly the older traditional C pattern.

What are your thoughts on changing it up a little to make it more interesting for those just getting started, like maybe adding 1 or two more maneuvers?

Also a question on the F3P-expert. I see several different versions used. Example, some with spins, some without.

What is the most common version being used, so we can start using it here in the states for our local events? Is the only difference one has the spin and another doesn't?

It seems some do the torque roll differently also, what are your thoughts?

aerolite

The C-Pattern is still pretty good for "intermediate level".

When the FAI in 2008 came up with the new F3P-A schedules (Preliminary and Finals) for 2009/2010, top-pilots from various European countries sat together at a restaurant in Casteau/Belgium and modified it, to make it suitable for the standard gyms (with lower ceilings and/or obstacles at the ceiling). It was also test flown the next day at the competition in Mons/Belgium (hence "Mons-Schedule").

For the DMFV F3P-Expert schedule, I used the Mons-Schedule with some modifications. The Mons-Schedule has no spin, as F3P models don't really stall and spin well and I also consider torque-rolls against the torque effect of the prop a bit "abnormal", hence the other modification.

Instead of using a "Finals-schedule", I introduced an "Unknown-schedule" at the 2009 Championship for the first time.

Jürgen

Just a little "Heads up":

The German Indoor Aerobatics Championship 2010 organized by the DMFV will take place from 06.- 07. November 2010 in 68794 Oberhausen, same hall where the first German Indoor Aerobatics Championship took place in 2001. For those who are planning a visit, Heidelberg and the Technik Museum in Speyer and/or Sinsheim are not far from there.

No changes from 2009 in F3P-Expert (except of a different Unknown in the Finals of course. ).

A slightly modified F3P-Sport sequence (no 1/2 roll in the turn, i.e. less inverted flying - see attachment).

Jürgen

Jurgen, do you have the K factors and written descriptions of the maneuvers for the F3P-Sport sequence?

thanks aerolite

Originally Posted by aerolite

Jurgen, do you have the K factors and written descriptions of the maneuvers for the F3P-Sport sequence?

thanks aerolite

The score sheet might help.

Originally Posted by Jurgen Heilig

The score sheet might help.

That helps with the k factors, do you know if anyone has translated the written portion of the score sheet of the maneuvers?

It would be a great help for us to use whenever we use the new 2010 sport sequence at a contest.

thanks aerolite

Originally Posted by aerolite

That helps with the k factors, do you know if anyone has translated the written portion of the score sheet of the maneuvers? ...

No problem, I will translate it in English.

Jürgen

Originally Posted by Jurgen Heilig

No problem, I will translate it in English.

Jürgen

thanks, that would be a big help in transitioning to the new schedule.

aerolite