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Old Feb 16, 2013, 09:55 AM
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Hilton (Rochester), NY
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Gapi, remember that the level swash plate is only a starting point. When you are done and the thing hovers well, it may not look anything like a level swash, but that's OK. It may be that even hovering hands free is not in the cards. It should hover close to hands free, but may never be completely hands free. The perfect heli hasn't been made yet. Get as close as possible and then just fly the thing!!!!!!! It's at times like this when you just can't deal with the stock front and rear canopies. The rear is a giant PITA to deal with when you're trying to set a heli up. If it had a one-piece canopy, the frustration is multiplied by about 10X!!!!!! Been there, done that and have the tee shirt to prove it!!!!!!!!!!!
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Old Feb 16, 2013, 11:00 AM
Fly em if ya got em.
leethetreeguy's Avatar
Winder Ga
Joined Sep 2008
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+1 on that.
I remember leveling a swashplate on a big outdoor lama I built in a daulphin and a eflight seahawk (both one piece fuse's) that I built. It was like a ship in a bottle. Try doin that sometime. Whew!!!
Lee
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Old Feb 16, 2013, 11:07 AM
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North Georgia
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Thanks guys, A couple more CX2 noober questions and comments.

Just to confirm because I see pics of, and this bird came with, the servo horns pointing a little upward in their home positions by 2 splines. I pulled them off and leveled them. This OK?

Is it normal for one set of blades to start spinning a little after the other set?

And want to note the rods are in the 1st hole nearest the servo.

Thanks for the help. I'll be back with my progress.
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Old Feb 16, 2013, 11:31 AM
Fly em if ya got em.
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Winder Ga
Joined Sep 2008
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First...as with planes, yes put the horns on as close to 90* as possible. But, yes, this is normal what you have from the factory.
Secound, Pot adjustments keep the yaw on target. Sometimes, that means one set starts spinning before the other.
Third, for a begineer, first hole is fine. Stabile hover, good for small indoor spaces.
Lee
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Old Feb 16, 2013, 12:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gapi View Post
Thanks guys, A couple more CX2 noober questions and comments.
Newbie-experience observations here, so it's still all very fresh in my mind.

Quote:
Just to confirm because I see pics of, and this bird came with, the servo horns pointing a little upward in their home positions by 2 splines. I pulled them off and leveled them. This OK?
90 deg is better especially in roll/aileron axis where you want it to most behave the same way in both directions. It's such a lot rate that it doens't ned any expo.

Elevator/pitch accuracy is a little less important for beginner because you really shouldn't be 'backing up' at full throw anyway.

Quote:
Is it normal for one set of blades to start spinning a little after the other set?
I notice the lower blade starts first, then the upper blade - and the -upper- blade at that slow speed rotates much -slower- than the lower blade. It's the 'relative rotation speed' of the two blades that controls -yaw-.

Quote:
And want to note the rods are in the 1st hole nearest the servo.
That's fine to get started, and do it in -near- -zero- wind. (And I mean very-near-zero, not 2-3mph.) Launching facing into slight breeze, at 3mph breeze full travel could just barely hold it, and 5mph pushed it back. This is all as designed for newbies, as this is a 'beginner' heli.

I moved both throws to the second notch and sub-trimmed to 90deg, and set expo to 60. Still having yaw-proportional issues so haven't tried it in a 'real' breeze yet but slight experience shows it pitches/rolls *much* stronger.
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Old Feb 16, 2013, 01:43 PM
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North Georgia
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Thanks,

I made some crash repairs, new shafts, blades & gears. Boom-town sent me a newer version of their extended inner that's silver now instead of blue and a tad longer. - No more blade strikes on the harsh noober landings (with training gear). This is a full boat Boomtown stage three CX2 kit.

After the above I aligned everything and tried it out on the smooth kitchen floor and had a 45 right and rearward crawl. The nose is pretty stable.
So I did the right servo rod a turn longer and it took allot of it out and then the left servo rod a turn out and it was better still but took some of the left right correction out.

So I think I see the picture in being one needs to go back and forth in small 1/2 turn adjustments because one will effect the other a little? Correct?

What methods or steps do you guys like to use? One direction at a time?

I feel like I am Getting there thanks to you guys.

Here is a picture.

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Old Feb 16, 2013, 07:01 PM
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Hilton (Rochester), NY
Joined Mar 2008
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NO, grasshopper, I just told you they are ONE turn pots, so, going 1/2 turn at a time is 1/2 of the TOTAL adjustment. You have to go in baby steps. You have to go in super tiny increments and, like Flyeroo explained to you, you also have to unplug the battery and re-initialize after each adjustment. This is very time consuming. Don't rush it. In most instances, the lower rotor might start before the upper rotor. The lower rotor is the main thrust with the upper rotor trying to counter the torque so the heli doesn't spin.
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Old Feb 16, 2013, 08:54 PM
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North Georgia
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Thank You Master(s)!

She is doing MUCH better. I am hovering in my living room!

The only trim adjustment I have is the Aileron and the slider is about 3/4 to the right.
I tried centering it and backing a half turn out on the right rod looking at it tail in and it seemed like a different heli all together so I put it back and settled for the trim slider to the right for now until I hear your thoughts.

As for the proportional, I gotcha thanks. I now power down, move it a c-hair, and power back up. I think I have it nailed down now. She is pretty still in that respect.

I was getting some fish bowling and seen a little tail wag so I started backing off the gain and as the wag decreased so did the fish bowling until finally they were both gone. That big white tail will not let you miss any kind of wag at all.

Loving it. I would like some words on that Aileron trim and the rod adjustment. Am I Knit Picking or should I just be happy like it is?
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Old Feb 16, 2013, 09:08 PM
Fly em if ya got em.
leethetreeguy's Avatar
Winder Ga
Joined Sep 2008
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Yea, KJ's post was referring to the pot adjustments. hahaha. He is a little slow! ahahahaha
Sorry KJ, just joshing at ya.
You are getting it my. The servo pushrod adjustments have to be in half turns. On some copters...it is one whole turns. Just keep at it if you like. Or, just use the sticks and fly what you have. Up to you. Remember, just keep having fun. We are all here to help.
Lee
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Old Feb 16, 2013, 09:22 PM
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Hilton (Rochester), NY
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OK, I did think he was talking pot turns, but I guess I am slow! On most heli's we deal with, the 1/2 turn on the rod would be nice, but, the rod ends usually don't let you pop the link onto the swash balls but one way.
If you can get it up in the air and hover nicely, get the training gear off. It's usually for bigger FP or CP heli's. You'll do fine without it.
BTW, the 55 Degree blades you have on there ( I know they were part of the package ) have less lift for better fast forward flight (FFF). If you bought any plane jane Xtreme blades, start out with those first.
Terminology, grasshopper, it's toilet bowling. Your progress is good. You paint the garage tomorrow.
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Old Feb 16, 2013, 11:31 PM
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North Georgia
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Thanks,

Yes, I was messing with the POT's and the rods, heh!

But you guys flew me in nicely.

Now.......... after I made more rod adjustments to take back some of that TX Aileron trim adjustment its doing fine with only a click or two to the right.
But this was with no canopy.

So I decided no more of the above was needed and put the canopy on and things changed a little with the nose wanting to drift out in hover with no TX trim applied.

So I am in a quandary as to if I am equalizing motor speeds with the POT with no canopy and then it drifts with a canopy, Hmmmm?

Should I have been doing all my testing and adjustments with the canopy on in the 1st place?
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Old Feb 17, 2013, 12:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gapi View Post
Thanks,

Yes, I was messing with the POT's and the rods, heh!

But you guys flew me in nicely.

Now.......... after I made more rod adjustments to take back some of that TX Aileron trim adjustment its doing fine with only a click or two to the right.
But this was with no canopy.

So I decided no more of the above was needed and put the canopy on and things changed a little with the nose wanting to drift out in hover with no TX trim applied.

So I am in a quandary as to if I am equalizing motor speeds with the POT with no canopy and then it drifts with a canopy, Hmmmm?

Should I have been doing all my testing and adjustments with the canopy on in the 1st place?
The canopy should not make much difference. If it is heavier then it would change the COG, but I haven't found that the stock canopies will change anything. If you adjust the gain too much, it will affect the proportional, and the helicopter will start to yaw. You need to set the gain first, so the tail does not twitch back and forth quickly. This means there is too much gain, and needs to be lowered. Adjust just enough until the tail is steady, then check the proportional to see if the helicopter is yawing. If so correct this, but make sure the trims are centered. Which direction is the helicopter drifting when hovering? I also noticed the short flybar. This will make the helicopter more agile, and you might want to install the stock flybar until you become more experienced. The longer flybar will give more stability when flying. One other thing you might want to try is the all white Xtreme blades, or I guess they come in all blue, and maybe yellow I don't remember. The thing is, they have more pitch than the 55 degree blades you are using, and the more pitch will give more lift, and may even give more stability than the blades you have on the helicopter. It wouldn't hurt to give them a try, I prefer them over the 55 degree blades.
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Old Feb 17, 2013, 08:45 AM
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Hilton (Rochester), NY
Joined Mar 2008
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You've gotten yourself right in the middle of modding that heli without learning to really fly it first. I know it's tempting to do that, but you may cause a problem and not know if it's the heli or a mod you installed or you not being very experienced. I can say that because I've done it. At least you have pivoting blades and grips on it so, you won't be replacing blades every 5 minutes. Your #1 thing to learn is to cut the throttle if it looks anywhere close to a crash. Having the blades under power when they can't turn because it's on the ground on its side will kill a very expensive 4-in-1 in a hurry. With pivoting blades, you may get a bent inner shaft in a bad crash, but from here out, it shouldn't be too bad. The best thing for you now is experience. Fly it, learn what it does in certain situations and fly some more.
The shortened flybar has weights that are held to the flybar by set screws. If you get into flying forward for a decent stretch and see the heli actually stop mid flight pause and then go forward again, that is called porpoising. Usually the shorter flybar cures that problem, but if not, move the weights inboard at very small intervals. Every single thing on that heli has to be done to maintain balance. Whatever you do on one side of the flybar has to be exactly the same on the opposite side to maintain balance. An unbalanced heli will fly like crap and you will, without a doubt, see it magnified by vibration in the boom.
Get the pots set for proportional and gain and then don't touch them again.
I hope you snipped the zip ties and removed the training gear. From your picture, they're too far forward and the center of gravity is very important to flight characteristics. The extra little bit of weight moved forward will likely make it want to go forward. Later, after you become the Coax Master, you'll want an extra bias forward for better fast forward flight ( FFF ), but for now, be as neutral as possible.
Come on back; we'll leave the light on.
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Old Feb 17, 2013, 08:43 PM
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North Georgia
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Where I am now..........

I am hovering fine but have some questions or should I say confessions.
I can fly simple circuits, funnels.

I took the training gear off and tried some generic blades I have and they vibrate and track terribly.

The flight bar adjustment for tracking the blades is as I found it, as short as it can get. I tried lengthening it but the tracking got worse. I put it back and remounted the 55 blades and its smoother.

I confess I am at a loss as to where I am between the Gyro and Proportional pots. Yes, I know not what I do.
In my quest to find the line between tail wag, and no tail wag by increasing the Gain until it wags and then backing off a bit method I found it also effects nose drift.
At one point I got rid of the nose drift with the proportional and then experimented with the gain. I found when I moved the gain, even just a teeny weeny the nose drift would reappear.
Its there when I said, Oh, Boy, you have tangled that up.

Anyways, I put it back and just practiced flying with what I have. I guess there is no factory reset eh?
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Old Feb 17, 2013, 09:32 PM
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United States, MA, Malden
Joined Mar 2008
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gapi,balance your blades. Unbalanced blades will never track. You must get her mechanically tuned (smooth) before you can get her electronically tuned (IE: gain/prop).

Just my 2 cents..

Mike.
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