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Old Feb 18, 2007, 09:46 PM
John Cock...tos...ton
Stephan8's Avatar
LaGrange, GA
Joined Oct 2006
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New and Improved Go Bipe!

Hey Guys,

It's been along time but I finally got enough will to piece my Go Bipe back together with a full fuse this time. I also changed the bottom wing. I added about 3 inches to the chord and 3 inches in wing span. With the set up I am using, my weight was coming in close to 8 oz so I wanted more wing area. I also now have "barn door" style ailerons.

Will this be the second death of my GO Bipe? We will see!!

Magic....So sorry to butcher your plans and sucha great flying plane, but...boredom is the mother of destruction....right! So I will get video as soon as possible.

The full fuse is almost done....and no landing gear yet. It weighs about 8 oz now so I wanted to give it a test toss before I go any further.

The wind has been crazy here...and so has my workload so I will post more soon. Here are the pics......

Thanks, Stephan
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Old Feb 18, 2007, 09:51 PM
John Cock...tos...ton
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LaGrange, GA
Joined Oct 2006
117 Posts
By the way, can any of you guys help with uploading pics. The smallest size I can take is 640x820 or something to that efect. Anyway, how can I make them smaller so they will upload? I only can change them into thumbnails.

Sorry to waste a post here in this but any help would be appreciatted.

Stephan
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Old Feb 19, 2007, 04:42 PM
Bernoulli+Newton=Lift
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Somewhere south of Chicago, IL
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stephan8
Magic....So sorry to butcher your plans and sucha great flying plane, but...boredom is the mother of destruction....right! So I will get video as soon as possible.
NO APOLOGY NECESSARY!

Stephan, this plane is MEANT to be tweaked, changed, pushed, pulled - whatever! The whole point is that it is so basic you can do whatever you want with it, and see what happens.

Let the rest of us know how it works for you - flight reports are the only requirement for modifications!
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Old Feb 19, 2007, 11:05 PM
John Cock...tos...ton
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LaGrange, GA
Joined Oct 2006
117 Posts
Hey Magic,

Thanks for your kind words. I got home late tonight...right at dusk. I ran inside and grabbed the plane and ran out front to give it a toss. But it flew all kinds of wierd. But I think the CG was off. Too far aft. I moved the battery forward and it flew a touch better but I still think it needs some work. It was so dark that I decided to call it a night and try again tomorrow. So I will try again and let you know how it goes.

The plane basically stalled and dumped over to one side...more to the right when it slowed down. So like I said, new cg and new flight tom,


Thanks, Stephan
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Old Feb 20, 2007, 02:12 AM
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Looks like this will be my first biplane build. I have been looking at all the others and I get discouraged seeing the upper and lower wings both have ailerons and the full fuse when I crash wont be pretty. This looks like is exactly what I need!

Just tagging it, it took me a long time to find this post again.
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Old Feb 20, 2007, 09:00 AM
John Cock...tos...ton
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LaGrange, GA
Joined Oct 2006
117 Posts
Kurpal, you are going to love this one. Easy build and flyer. On the first one I built...I followed the plans but added a front fuse "box" to protect my gear.

But it is definately easy and fun no matter how you build it.

Stephan
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Old Mar 01, 2007, 04:57 AM
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Ok here is my gear and I am looking for some suggestions:

Building material is going to be protection board (blue stuff)

My lightest battery pack is a 1200 mah 3s 10C ~3oz, second is a 1350 mah 3s 20C ~4 oz. My motor will be a hacker clone 43g, 15 amp motor @ ~1000 rpms spinning a 9" prop. Should I scale the plane up to fit with my battery packs/bluecor/motor size being larger than those of the build recommendations? I was thinkin about 20% scaled up. What d oyou all think?
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Old Mar 01, 2007, 01:33 PM
Bernoulli+Newton=Lift
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Somewhere south of Chicago, IL
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Kurpal - You might want to scale it up even more than that. I've flown this plane with a relatively heavy 1.4 oz NiMh pack, but now fly it with LiPo packs in the 0.5 and 1.0 oz range. And the motor you'll be using is already .5 oz heavier than a GWS IPS motor or the little blue brushless some of us have used. I think the bluecor weighs more than depron, too. So just going on the specs of "as designed", you'd be tipping the scales at 2-3 more oz than the plane was designed for. That's about 33-50% more weight than I intended. I realize though, that you've suggested a larger plane.

As it is, it's designed to be around 3 oz / square foot of wing area. At 20% larger, I'm estimating you'd be in the neighborhood of 3.5 - 4.0 oz / sq. foot. Will it fly? Probably - BUT - in order to get lift your airspeed would have to be far greater than a lighter model. Given that you're adding that much more weight, I'd increase the design by 30% - that should put you back closer to the 3 oz / square foot range. That should keep the airspeed back in the intended range. You might want to consider a basswood fuse-spar instead of balsa, too.

Let us know how your progress goes!
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Old Mar 01, 2007, 05:38 PM
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Maryland, USA
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@Kurpal
I think magic612 offered some great advice there. Mine was up-scaled by 18% (23") and at an AUW of 7.25oz it is close to becoming the average parkflyer with 3.4oz sq/in wing loading. She still flies slow and relatively floaty but I can easily envision it at under 2.8oz wing loading making it a true level floater.

The suggestion of a 30% up-scale is probably right on the mark...if not 35%. Those really are some BIG batteries you intend to use and that motor seems to have over-gorged just a bit on electrons (for this particular application).

That said, you really should continue with this endeavor. The LGB is a great little design that you will have loads of fun with. All my other foamies are considered expendable while I really take care of this one. After over 120 flights she's still a cream-puff. Thanks magic612!


@Stephan8
Did you ever get that image conversion figured out? Those pics you posted show a great looking bird but I now look Chinese after squinting for so long while viewing them. Also, anxiously awaiting that flight report! Hope you've had some agreeable weather.

Cheers,
golem
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Old Mar 01, 2007, 09:23 PM
John Cock...tos...ton
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LaGrange, GA
Joined Oct 2006
117 Posts
Hey Golem,

Well, I got some work to do. The plane has a weird tendancy to dump over when turned to the right.

I used the same top wing but increased the size of the bottom wing so that it is actually much bigger than the top wing. I was womdering if this size difference would create more lift on the bottom and that would give it the tendancy to roll over or dump over when turned? It will do the same when turned left but not nearly as bad. I was thinkin of enlarging the top wing this weekend and seeing if that helped.

Maybe some input would help. And I will try and post new pics. Sorry for the squinting...funny.

Stephan
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Old Apr 25, 2007, 01:13 PM
Bernoulli+Newton=Lift
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Somewhere south of Chicago, IL
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In the works:

- "Mini Go Bipe" - estimated AUW of 2.75 oz, wingspan 14"

AND

- "Biggie Go Bipe" haven't decided on wingspan yet (maybe 30" or so), but likely in the 8-9 oz range, I think. Should be a super floater, and with a little Hextronic brushless, should also scoot around nicely for acrobatics as well.

Mini-Go-Bipe" is mostly finished, sitting on my dining room table, only needing the radio and motor installation. "Biggie" is still in the works in CAD - each have some slightly different characteristics from the "Little Go Bipe" to account for the size / weight differences.

I'll post more about each soon.
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Old Apr 27, 2007, 07:43 PM
Bernoulli+Newton=Lift
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Somewhere south of Chicago, IL
Joined Jan 2006
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Mini Go Bipe

Okay, here's some pics of the Mini Go Bipe. AUW ended up right where I had hoped - 2.75 oz. Here's what I used:

GWS EDP50 motor - weight: .53 oz
Common Sense R/C 200 mAh 7.4V 10C Lipo - weight: .51 oz
Futaba R124F micro receiver with micro plug sockets: .28 oz
Blue Arrow 5A ESC - .21 oz.
Two Blue Arrow 3.6g servos (converted to micro plugs): .14 oz each
.032" piano wire for pushrods
3M Long-Term Packing Tape for hinges
2 mm Depron
1/4" balsa stick for fuse

Amazingly, this little sucker MOVES!! For a brushed motor, I didn't quite expect such speed, but at this voltage and with a 3020 prop, it generates almost 70 watts per pound. At an AUW of 2.75 oz, that's what it works out to (if my math is right!!!). Anyway, if anyone's interested in plans for this, I can post them. Weight is critical on this version, so make sure you have VERY LIGHT stuff for it!!!

I'll be working on a very large, scaled up version soon.
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Old Apr 27, 2007, 08:28 PM
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Maryland, USA
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Oh magic612, I love it!

If she handles anything like her bigger brother I have a feeling you, without doubt, have that small-lot flier you've been searching for. I'm guestimating the chord was left a bit fatter than the 28% scaling giving you about 3oz sq/ft (or less) wing loading?

Hope you get a chance to post both plans (especially if it's not a direct scale-down) and a vid or two! I still haven't acquired the proper Depron therefore have put off this version of the project but definitely felt from the original versions flying characteristics she would be a prime candidate.

Keep up the great work! Btw, I'm STILL flying my original LGB. The only thing I ever scavenge from it is a RX crystal from time to time but she always remains ready to go on short notice.

Cheers,
golem
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Old Apr 27, 2007, 08:31 PM
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Stephan8!

I just looked through the thread and noticed I missed your post from last month. Sorry!

Now I'm curious, did you ever get back to that project and work it out?

Cheers,
golem
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Old Apr 28, 2007, 10:32 AM
Bernoulli+Newton=Lift
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Somewhere south of Chicago, IL
Joined Jan 2006
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Quote:
Originally Posted by golem
Oh magic612, I love it!

If she handles anything like her bigger brother I have a feeling you, without doubt, have that small-lot flier you've been searching for. I'm guestimating the chord was left a bit fatter than the 28% scaling giving you about 3oz sq/ft (or less) wing loading?

Hope you get a chance to post both plans (especially if it's not a direct scale-down) and a vid or two! I still haven't acquired the proper Depron therefore have put off this version of the project but definitely felt from the original versions flying characteristics she would be a prime candidate.
Hey golem -

Thanks for the kudos! Wingspan of the "Mini" is 14", chord is 5.25", so yes, it's a little fatter in the chord. Makes for a total wing area of about 1 square foot, so wing loading is easy to calculate - whatever it weighs, that's the loading per square foot! It does fly just like it's big brother - since it's lighter by about half, it doesn't really require landing gear - just belly land it in grass.

I think it may be that "small lot" flier, though it does scoot a bit faster than I expected. Like I was telling my wife yesterday - I need a bigger backyard!!!! I guess that's where my Dragonfly helicopter will have to serve.

It's definitely not a direct scale down, because in order to save weight, I eliminated the landing gear, rubber band attachment, changed the tail, adjusted the size of the elevator, put a hole in the wing supports, and came up with a method to easily remove the top wing to access the radio and stuff. So it's definitely got some differences, but if you look at each at a glance there's clearly a "family resemblance".

I need to clean up my plans first, then I'll be sure to post them. I think I can probably fit them on an 11 x 8.5 sheet (with a few things overlapping), so it'll be an easy printout for anyone. I'll post vids as soon as I get a bit more practive with it and can fly it close to me. It gets small AWFUL quick when flying away from you!!!
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