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Old Nov 17, 2006, 10:11 AM
Peter Gavin
Guest
n/a Posts
Myford and metric threads?

Hi I have an early change wheel Super 7, apart from a 127 tooth gear what
else do I need to form 1, 1.25, 1.5, 1.75 and 2mm pitch thread.

Regards, Pete
Old Nov 17, 2006, 12:11 PM
Peter Neill
Guest
n/a Posts
Re: Myford and metric threads?

On Fri, 17 Nov 2006 15:37:45 GMT, Peter Gavin <petegavin@tesco.net>
wrote:

>Hi I have an early change wheel Super 7, apart from a 127 tooth gear what
>else do I need to form 1, 1.25, 1.5, 1.75 and 2mm pitch thread.
>
>Regards, Pete


I went the 2 x 21 tooth changewheel route and the Myford manual lists
the gear train setup for these.
It's not *exactly* accurate in the pedantic sense, but accurate enough
to more decimal places than we can measure<g>

If you have a look at John's/Gert's shop on ebay - marypoppinsbag -
he sells these and includes a laminated copy of the setup chart with
it.

Peter

Old Nov 17, 2006, 02:11 PM
Peter Gavin
Guest
n/a Posts
Re: Myford and metric threads?

Peter Neill wrote:

> On Fri, 17 Nov 2006 15:37:45 GMT, Peter Gavin <petegavin@tesco.net>
> wrote:
>
>>Hi I have an early change wheel Super 7, apart from a 127 tooth gear what
>>else do I need to form 1, 1.25, 1.5, 1.75 and 2mm pitch thread.
>>
>>Regards, Pete

>
> I went the 2 x 21 tooth changewheel route and the Myford manual lists
> the gear train setup for these.
> It's not *exactly* accurate in the pedantic sense, but accurate enough
> to more decimal places than we can measure<g>
>
> If you have a look at John's/Gert's shop on ebay - marypoppinsbag -
> he sells these and includes a laminated copy of the setup chart with
> it.
>
> Peter


Hi, are you saying I can use 2 X 21 tooth gears as well as the 127 tooth or
instead of it? I don't have a metric setup chart so need to know what
number of teeth on which gear, and where each gear goes. Perhaps theres a
web page with this info.

Thanks, Pete.
Old Nov 17, 2006, 02:11 PM
Peter Neill
Guest
n/a Posts
Re: Myford and metric threads?

On Fri, 17 Nov 2006 19:02:37 GMT, Peter Gavin <petegavin@tesco.net>
wrote:

>
>Hi, are you saying I can use 2 X 21 tooth gears as well as the 127 tooth or
>instead of it? I don't have a metric setup chart so need to know what
>number of teeth on which gear, and where each gear goes. Perhaps theres a
>web page with this info.
>
>Thanks, Pete.


You can use the 21T gears instead of the 127T gear. I had neither with
mine when I got it and decided to go this way as it saved me doing any
simple calculations which I was bound to get wrong<g>.

I've scanned in the 2 pages from the manual here, and this will tell
you how to set it up.

http://www.btinternet.com/~p.neill/M...gewheels1.jpeg
http://www.btinternet.com/~p.neill/M...gewheels2.jpeg

Someone else on the list has en entire Super7 manual scanned in as a
PDF file on their web pages. I can't remember the link offhand, but
I'm sure that someone will soon post it up for you.

Peter
Old Nov 17, 2006, 02:11 PM
ravensworth2674
Guest
n/a Posts
Re: Myford and metric threads?



The Super 7 manual is accessed in the Files Section of Yahoo's
MyMyford.

There are a lot of other 'Myford' notes in the lathemod bits.
Sorry, I haven't been well enough to help put more on board.
There is a huge amount which is in Model Engineer- but not available to
newcomers who have bought Myfords.

Again, a lot is available in book form and I would suggest that you buy
" Screwcutting in the Lathe" by Martin Cleeve -Tee Publishing
" Model Engineers Workshop Manual" G.H.Thomas- also fromTee

After spending lots on your Myford, these are almost compulsive reading
and will add immensly to your enjoyment!

Cheers

Norman

Old Nov 17, 2006, 02:11 PM
Peter Gavin
Guest
n/a Posts
Re: Myford and metric threads?

ravensworth2674 wrote:

>
>


> The Super 7 manual is accessed in the Files Section of Yahoo's
> MyMyford.
>
> There are a lot of other 'Myford' notes in the lathemod bits.
> Sorry, I haven't been well enough to help put more on board.
> There is a huge amount which is in Model Engineer- but not available to
> newcomers who have bought Myfords.
>
> Again, a lot is available in book form and I would suggest that you buy
> " Screwcutting in the Lathe" by Martin Cleeve -Tee Publishing
> " Model Engineers Workshop Manual" G.H.Thomas- also fromTee
>
> After spending lots on your Myford, these are almost compulsive reading
> and will add immensly to your enjoyment!
>
> Cheers
>
> Norman


Thanks Peter and Norman, Things are starting to sense now :-)

Regards, Pete.
Old Nov 17, 2006, 04:11 PM
John Stevenson
Guest
n/a Posts
Re: Myford and metric threads?

On Fri, 17 Nov 2006 19:02:37 GMT, Peter Gavin <petegavin@tesco.net>
wrote:

>Peter Neill wrote:
>
>> On Fri, 17 Nov 2006 15:37:45 GMT, Peter Gavin <petegavin@tesco.net>
>> wrote:
>>
>>>Hi I have an early change wheel Super 7, apart from a 127 tooth gear what
>>>else do I need to form 1, 1.25, 1.5, 1.75 and 2mm pitch thread.
>>>
>>>Regards, Pete

>>
>> I went the 2 x 21 tooth changewheel route and the Myford manual lists
>> the gear train setup for these.
>> It's not *exactly* accurate in the pedantic sense, but accurate enough
>> to more decimal places than we can measure<g>
>>
>> If you have a look at John's/Gert's shop on ebay - marypoppinsbag -
>> he sells these and includes a laminated copy of the setup chart with
>> it.
>>
>> Peter

>
>Hi, are you saying I can use 2 X 21 tooth gears as well as the 127 tooth or
>instead of it? I don't have a metric setup chart so need to know what
>number of teeth on which gear, and where each gear goes. Perhaps theres a
>web page with this info.
>
>Thanks, Pete.


You can use either the 127 wheel or the two 21's to achieve metric
threads.
Myford recommend the two 21's and their metric chart reflects this.

The 127 is the only way to get truly accurate metric threads as 127 is
the lowest common denominator of 254, actually 1/2 and if you write
254 as 25.4 you will see where this figure comes from.
Advantages of using the 127 are true conversion but at the expense of
having to run without the guard as the 127 is too big to fit in.

Purists will say the 21's are not accurate as they don't work out
exact but the error in parts per inch is probably less than the
manufacturing error on the leadscrew allowing for wind, tide and the
curvature of the earth.

One point to note on whichever method you use, is that you can't
disconnect the half nuts whilst screwcutting metric threads on an
imperial leadscrew as the thread dial is useless because it only lines
up once in God knows how many turns.
--
Regards,

John Stevenson
Nottingham, England.

Visit the new Model Engineering adverts page at:-
http://www.homeworkshop.org.uk/
Old Nov 17, 2006, 04:11 PM
Robin
Guest
n/a Posts
Re: Myford and metric threads?


John Stevenson wrote:

> On Fri, 17 Nov 2006 19:02:37 GMT, Peter Gavin <petegavin@tesco.net>
> wrote:
>
> >Peter Neill wrote:
> >
> >> On Fri, 17 Nov 2006 15:37:45 GMT, Peter Gavin <petegavin@tesco.net>
> >> wrote:
> >>
> >>>Hi I have an early change wheel Super 7, apart from a 127 tooth gear what
> >>>else do I need to form 1, 1.25, 1.5, 1.75 and 2mm pitch thread.
> >>>
> >>>Regards, Pete
> >>
> >> I went the 2 x 21 tooth changewheel route and the Myford manual lists
> >> the gear train setup for these.
> >> It's not *exactly* accurate in the pedantic sense, but accurate enough
> >> to more decimal places than we can measure<g>
> >>
> >> If you have a look at John's/Gert's shop on ebay - marypoppinsbag -
> >> he sells these and includes a laminated copy of the setup chart with
> >> it.
> >>
> >> Peter

> >
> >Hi, are you saying I can use 2 X 21 tooth gears as well as the 127 tooth or
> >instead of it? I don't have a metric setup chart so need to know what
> >number of teeth on which gear, and where each gear goes. Perhaps theres a
> >web page with this info.
> >
> >Thanks, Pete.

>
> You can use either the 127 wheel or the two 21's to achieve metric
> threads.
> Myford recommend the two 21's and their metric chart reflects this.
>
> The 127 is the only way to get truly accurate metric threads as 127 is
> the lowest common denominator of 254, actually 1/2 and if you write
> 254 as 25.4 you will see where this figure comes from.
> Advantages of using the 127 are true conversion but at the expense of
> having to run without the guard as the 127 is too big to fit in.
>
> Purists will say the 21's are not accurate as they don't work out
> exact but the error in parts per inch is probably less than the
> manufacturing error on the leadscrew allowing for wind, tide and the
> curvature of the earth.
>
> One point to note on whichever method you use, is that you can't
> disconnect the half nuts whilst screwcutting metric threads on an
> imperial leadscrew as the thread dial is useless because it only lines
> up once in God knows how many turns.


I think it helps to have a motor you can reverse. Mine doesn't which is
a real pain (I think if I dismantle it, reversing should be possible
but can't be bothered as I write...). I tried cutting an M8 thread on
mine and then hand winding the lathe back but the threads still didn't
line up. To be fair, wasn't using a proper tool and was trying to cut
silver steel which apparently isn't so easy to thread...

Old Nov 17, 2006, 04:11 PM
Mark Rand
Guest
n/a Posts
Re: Myford and metric threads?

On Fri, 17 Nov 2006 20:44:50 GMT, John Stevenson
<john@stevenson-engineers.co.uk> wrote:


>
>You can use either the 127 wheel or the two 21's to achieve metric
>threads.
>Myford recommend the two 21's and their metric chart reflects this.
>
>The 127 is the only way to get truly accurate metric threads as 127 is
>the lowest common denominator of 254, actually 1/2 and if you write
>254 as 25.4 you will see where this figure comes from.
>Advantages of using the 127 are true conversion but at the expense of
>having to run without the guard as the 127 is too big to fit in.
>
>Purists will say the 21's are not accurate as they don't work out
>exact but the error in parts per inch is probably less than the
>manufacturing error on the leadscrew allowing for wind, tide and the
>curvature of the earth.
>
>One point to note on whichever method you use, is that you can't
>disconnect the half nuts whilst screwcutting metric threads on an
>imperial leadscrew as the thread dial is useless because it only lines
>up once in God knows how many turns.


I've just come in from the shed where I was using a 63t (3x21) gear from the
myford conversion set to cut a 16x1.5 thread. The reason that I came in was
that I hadn't let the Loctite, that I'd stuck the part onto a mandrel with,
set properly. Had to clean it off and glue it back together, with stronger
loctite. I'll leave it overnight before starting again.

The part is a gland with rounded edges for a cable to go through, because I
couldn't find a grommet the right size.

If you use back gear to cut the thread then it is simple to disengage the back
gear to wind the mandrel back. A handle in the back of the mandrel is good for
the turning. It is a good idea to back off the tool before winding back,
otherwise the slack in the gear train can cause the tool to rub hard enough to
chip the edge. DAMHIKT!

Mark Rand
RTFM
Old Nov 17, 2006, 06:11 PM
Andrew Mawson
Guest
n/a Posts
Re: Myford and metric threads?


"Robin" <creffield@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1163798641.602876.226270@h54g2000cwb.googlegr oups.com...
>>>SNIP<<<


> I think it helps to have a motor you can reverse. Mine doesn't which

is
> a real pain (I think if I dismantle it, reversing should be possible
> but can't be bothered as I write...). I tried cutting an M8 thread

on
> mine and then hand winding the lathe back but the threads still

didn't
> line up. To be fair, wasn't using a proper tool and was trying to

cut
> silver steel which apparently isn't so easy to thread...
>


Forgive me if I'm teaching grandma to suck eggs, but you need to
retract the threading tool from the cut before winding back to start
the next cut, as the backlash will be in the wrong direction and the
tool will foul what you have already cut. Then when you get to the
tailstock end of your thread, go a little further, advance the tool to
the new cut depth and start threading 'in air' for the back lash to be
taken up before the tool gets to the begining of the cut proper.

AWEM


Old Nov 18, 2006, 12:11 AM
Don Young
Guest
n/a Posts
Re: Myford and metric threads?


"John Stevenson" <john@stevenson-engineers.co.uk> wrote in message
news:dk7sl296ul4gc1kkq5r0e7dgg919pipdl6@4ax.com...
> On Fri, 17 Nov 2006 19:02:37 GMT, Peter Gavin <petegavin@tesco.net>
> wrote:
>
>>Peter Neill wrote:
>>
>>> On Fri, 17 Nov 2006 15:37:45 GMT, Peter Gavin <petegavin@tesco.net>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>>Hi I have an early change wheel Super 7, apart from a 127 tooth gear
>>>>what
>>>>else do I need to form 1, 1.25, 1.5, 1.75 and 2mm pitch thread.
>>>>
>>>>Regards, Pete
>>>
>>> I went the 2 x 21 tooth changewheel route and the Myford manual lists
>>> the gear train setup for these.
>>> It's not *exactly* accurate in the pedantic sense, but accurate enough
>>> to more decimal places than we can measure<g>
>>>
>>> If you have a look at John's/Gert's shop on ebay - marypoppinsbag -
>>> he sells these and includes a laminated copy of the setup chart with
>>> it.
>>>
>>> Peter

>>
>>Hi, are you saying I can use 2 X 21 tooth gears as well as the 127 tooth
>>or
>>instead of it? I don't have a metric setup chart so need to know what
>>number of teeth on which gear, and where each gear goes. Perhaps theres a
>>web page with this info.
>>
>>Thanks, Pete.

>
> You can use either the 127 wheel or the two 21's to achieve metric
> threads.
> Myford recommend the two 21's and their metric chart reflects this.
>
> The 127 is the only way to get truly accurate metric threads as 127 is
> the lowest common denominator of 254, actually 1/2 and if you write
> 254 as 25.4 you will see where this figure comes from.
> Advantages of using the 127 are true conversion but at the expense of
> having to run without the guard as the 127 is too big to fit in.
>
> Purists will say the 21's are not accurate as they don't work out
> exact but the error in parts per inch is probably less than the
> manufacturing error on the leadscrew allowing for wind, tide and the
> curvature of the earth.
>
> One point to note on whichever method you use, is that you can't
> disconnect the half nuts whilst screwcutting metric threads on an
> imperial leadscrew as the thread dial is useless because it only lines
> up once in God knows how many turns.
> --
> Regards,
>
> John Stevenson
> Nottingham, England.
>
> Visit the new Model Engineering adverts page at:-
> http://www.homeworkshop.org.uk/


If using a 127 tooth gear, the metric thread and the imperial leadscrew will
match up at every 127 pitches of the metric thread.

Don Young


Old Nov 18, 2006, 08:11 AM
Boo
Guest
n/a Posts
Re: Myford and metric threads?

> If using a 127 tooth gear, the metric thread and the imperial leadscrew will
> match up at every 127 pitches of the metric thread.


Does that mean if you put a carriage stop at the free end of the thread you
could use a tdi with a metric thread/ipmerial leadscrew by

1. winding the carriage back until it meets the stop, then
2. waiting for the tdi to indicate, then
3. engaging the leadscrew

Or is there a reason this doesn't work ?

--
Boo
Old Nov 19, 2006, 12:11 AM
Don Young
Guest
n/a Posts
Re: Myford and metric threads?


"Boo" <reply_to_group_not_me@spam_me_no_spam.net> wrote in message
news:WO2dnVM_X_N5jMLYnZ2dnUVZ_vGdnZ2d@biscit.net.. .
>> If using a 127 tooth gear, the metric thread and the imperial leadscrew
>> will match up at every 127 pitches of the metric thread.

>
> Does that mean if you put a carriage stop at the free end of the thread
> you could use a tdi with a metric thread/ipmerial leadscrew by
>
> 1. winding the carriage back until it meets the stop, then
> 2. waiting for the tdi to indicate, then
> 3. engaging the leadscrew
>
> Or is there a reason this doesn't work ?
>
> --
> Boo

Most US indicators have gears which have a pitch circumference of 4 inches
(32 teeth for a 8TPI screw). The dial makes one revolution for 4 inches of
carriage (or screw) movement. This should work for a 0.8MM thread pitch even
without the stop since 127 threads at 0.8MM pitch equals 4 inches.

You can get a good idea of what is required if you imagine the threaded work
to be very long and both the work and feedscrew to be stationary. From one
point where the threads match up, it is 127 threads on the WORK to the next
match up point for all metric pitches.

You could use a carriage stop by opening the half nuts, returning the
carriage to the stop, reversing the work and leadscrew to the starting
position, and then re-engaging the half nuts. The only problem is being able
to tell when the work and leadscrew are back to the starting point. Some
sort of external half-nuts on the leadscrew probably could be made to work.
A device to count 127 revolutions of the spindle also could do it, I think.

Don Young


Old Nov 19, 2006, 10:11 PM
Steve R.
Guest
n/a Posts
Re: Myford and metric threads?


"Don Young" <notme@nonesuch.com> wrote in message
news:12lvopfeln93q06@corp.supernews.com...
>
> "Boo" <reply_to_group_not_me@spam_me_no_spam.net> wrote in message
> news:WO2dnVM_X_N5jMLYnZ2dnUVZ_vGdnZ2d@biscit.net.. .
>>> If using a 127 tooth gear, the metric thread and the imperial leadscrew
>>> will match up at every 127 pitches of the metric thread.

>>
>> Does that mean if you put a carriage stop at the free end of the thread
>> you could use a tdi with a metric thread/ipmerial leadscrew by
>>
>> 1. winding the carriage back until it meets the stop, then
>> 2. waiting for the tdi to indicate, then
>> 3. engaging the leadscrew
>>
>> Or is there a reason this doesn't work ?
>>
>> --
>> Boo

> Most US indicators have gears which have a pitch circumference of 4 inches
> (32 teeth for a 8TPI screw). The dial makes one revolution for 4 inches of
> carriage (or screw) movement. This should work for a 0.8MM thread pitch
> even without the stop since 127 threads at 0.8MM pitch equals 4 inches.
>
> You can get a good idea of what is required if you imagine the threaded
> work to be very long and both the work and feedscrew to be stationary.
> From one point where the threads match up, it is 127 threads on the WORK
> to the next match up point for all metric pitches.
>
> You could use a carriage stop by opening the half nuts, returning the
> carriage to the stop, reversing the work and leadscrew to the starting
> position, and then re-engaging the half nuts. The only problem is being
> able to tell when the work and leadscrew are back to the starting point.
> Some sort of external half-nuts on the leadscrew probably could be made to
> work. A device to count 127 revolutions of the spindle also could do it, I
> think.
>
> Don Young
>


My old change wheel ML7 has an 8 TPI leadscrew, which I believe is typical
of Myfords. Two 21 tooth change wheels are/were available as extras for
metric screw cutting.

Steve R.


 


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