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Old Sep 03, 2002, 06:26 PM
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I need a small plane for backyard, less turning radius than J3-S

I like the J3-S, but it's about the biggest thing I can fly in my backyard. I'm pretty proficient at flying in small spaces, and I can barely figure-8 to change direction, but not continously. There are lots of trees, so there's plenty of obstacles. I drilled a hole in the horn to get the maximum throw, so it is super-duper nimble, and can hang at a high angle. I want something that can do figure-8's inside the tight turn radius of my J3. Wind is no issue since the backyard is surrounded by very tall trees. What's better is when people arent working behind my house, I have a BIG open flying field!

I was considering the IFO Mk-3, the mini-IFO is too expensive unless I can use a cheaper GWS drive. I want to be able to hang off the prop too. Basically a plane with performance of the J3 but with a twin IPS. Something like a micro mustang but slower is okay too. Any suggestions?
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Old Sep 03, 2002, 06:36 PM
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Tres Wright's Avatar
Forney, TX
Joined Mar 2002
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I'm a veteran backyard flyer, I have 7 Qualcomm planes 6 of which I fly regularly in my backyard. My number 1 recommendation is the Mini IFO. Given your constraints of limited area, tall surrounding trees and some obstacles, the Mini is the best fit for you. I'm not sure why you think it's more than the MK-3? You can indeed use it with a cheap DX motor. You can do a pretty impressive prop hang on a 10x4.7 prop on Qualcomms, I've heard it gets even better on 8 cell NiMH although I haven't tried it yet. Lack of a rudder makes it tough to hold, but it does some cool standing rolls and stuff while hanging. The Mini is an absolute blast to fly! It's also quite durable. I was trying some very low outside loops late yesterday evening and plunked mine in pretty hard 3 times in 25 minutes of flight (on one QC pack!) Each time I picked it up, checked it and tossed it right up again! Get one and laugh yourself silly at all the crazy stuff you're trying
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Old Sep 03, 2002, 06:39 PM
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Forney, TX
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By the way, Todd's Tiny is my 2nd favorite backyard flyer. Very nimble. Todd's Wing-E is also fun. But these and my other planes take at least double the room to fly that the Mini does.
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Old Sep 03, 2002, 06:45 PM
MKH
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Ohio
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The Mini IFO on GWS gear for all out acro and fun, or the Gym-E for smooth and stable loafing around. Both fly well in very small spaces.
Marcus
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Old Sep 03, 2002, 06:55 PM
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Good! The Mini IFO will work. It used to be expensive because they originally recomended a carbon fiber propeller, $15+, the 1515 or the more powerful one (forgot...), $60, an ESC, $30 (at the time), and battery pack that couldn't make it fly very long... I guess that's changed! I have 3 qualcomm packs which multitask for two planes, soon to be 3 or 4. I don't think I'll buy the mini IFO kit, I can do a scratch build just as good. What DX motor would be used? The standard IPS? What is used, I think I'll be needing a micro plane like that.
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Old Sep 03, 2002, 07:10 PM
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Ah ha! Plenty of info on the wild rc website. Thanks! Never heard of the RFS speed control, that's a really cool one, always wondered how they got so many cells. Since they use the A drive, could I use the IPS-D? On a 4 or so ounce AUW airplane, that sounds like a deal. Anyone try that?

I will do this if I can! 10 oz thrust from a IPS twin on a likely 5 oz airframe is awsome. I could fly at less than half throttle, and have a wild plane! YEEHAW!!
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Old Sep 03, 2002, 07:17 PM
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Indianapolis, IN
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I understand that the standard IPS DX-A is the power plant you want, not the Double, as it would be wasted power...
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Old Sep 03, 2002, 07:19 PM
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Has anyone proven that?

I've got a few ideas as to why use the IPS-D, with the downside being weight. Two motors are spinning the same prop at the same RPM as a single. More power is required from the single so the effieciency of the single motor is less than both of the two motors. You have more torque from two motors, and higher effieciency = less current. More weight to compensate means more current, so the duration is likely level to one another. The higher power levels is where the IPS-D begins to lose in duration. Hey, with kokams, I can live with it. I'll give this a try if I do get this plane (highly likely, no matter how long it takes)
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Old Sep 03, 2002, 08:12 PM
MKH
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Ohio
Joined Mar 2000
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You'll need the polymer packs to get the most out of the dual IPS, since the qc's don't like the 3-4 amps you will see if you prop the dual IPS for best use. I'm about to put the dual drive on my Mini, to test against the EDF hybrid I was running. A 2 cell polymer pack of 800-1000 mah will weigh about 1.5 ounces. I expect the dual IPS Mini to weigh 6 ounces with my 950mah polymers. With the recommended 11x4.7 prop, I should see close to 8 ounces of thrust at just under 4 amps.

I'm also going to get some 560 mah Kokams and run the Mini on an LPS or IPS drive. This pack should weigh about 1 ounce, and bring in the Mini at about 4.5-4.7 ounces.

They sure are fun!
Marcus
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Old Sep 03, 2002, 11:20 PM
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Cool! Well, I've run the QC's off of a 280 motor, and they did fine. However, the saftey circuit cut in after a few minutes, made a nice control-less glide. Didn't break the Mini Max. I guess I'll either run the single motor with QC's, or dual off of Kokams. Hard to pick....

BTW, Dave Hederich made a scracth mini-IFO, fortunately I can use that as a reference!
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Old Sep 04, 2002, 12:11 AM
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Forney, TX
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If you've got a DX-A lying around, put that on there 1st. You might be pleasantly surprised at the great performance you get, I know I was! Then if you decide to upgrade motors, you'll have a better idea of the baseline performance for comparison.

One thing about the IFO line, they don't like to go -too- fast. Strange things start happening like the "tuck" syndrome. I've noticed my Mini start into that on hard dives. The IFO is all about wild maneuvers in a small space, you kind of defeat its purpose if you load it down with too much motor.
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Old Sep 04, 2002, 12:14 AM
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One last thing, it might not be a bad idea to get a kit for your 1st IFO. Then if you want to scratchbuild one later, you'll have a plan to work from and a good idea of what size CF to use. I think Dave even mentioned that in one of his threads, that it's best to have a kit under your belt before taking on one from scratch. The IFOs aren't hard to put together, but the construction is very unconventional. It's best to have the "official" plan and instrux to go by.
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Old Sep 04, 2002, 12:24 AM
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Eugene, Oregon, United States
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Quote:
Originally posted by Tres Wright
One last thing, it might not be a bad idea to get a kit for your 1st IFO. Then if you want to scratchbuild one later, you'll have a plan to work from and a good idea of what size CF to use. I think Dave even mentioned that in one of his threads, that it's best to have a kit under your belt before taking on one from scratch. The IFOs aren't hard to put together, but the construction is very unconventional. It's best to have the "official" plan and instrux to go by.
What Tres said!! I've built 4 IFO's 1 each big & little from kits and 2 scratch built! Have just ordered my 5th Kit MK3 to play with with 300C-D power. Build your first one from the kit!
boomer
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Old Sep 04, 2002, 01:53 PM
MKH
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Ohio
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Quote:
Originally posted by boomerace

What Tres said!! I've built 4 IFO's 1 each big & little from kits and 2 scratch built! Have just ordered my 5th Kit MK3 to play with with 300C-D power. Build your first one from the kit!
boomer
What Boomer said, and Tres too! The parts in the kit are precut for you, and the plans will come in handy for future mods and experiments. It also rewards the designer with a few bucks, in appreciation for his time and efforts.

Tres is also right about power. With the new polymer batteries, the GWS setups can now come in almost as light as the original coreless setups, but much cheaper. The IFOs are one of those breeds that respond to weight loss just as well, if not better, than power increases, and you won't run into handling problems. I'm starting to talk myself out of the dual IPS experiment, simply because I can get a single IPS Mini IFO down to under 5 ounces, without resorting to expensive components.

Marcus
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Old Apr 11, 2003, 09:52 PM
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United States, UT, Payson
Joined Mar 2003
564 Posts
Turning Radius

A plane that has a great turning radius is the Mini Max, though it may be far too fast and big for you. This plane is so fun to play around with because it will turn within it's wingspan. It is really fun to tease people with this-

"It's going to hit the tree!" *pilot applys full stick and plane flips a U-turn like that* *Note: Observer (and usually pilot) makes big sigh afterwards.
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