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Old Apr 14, 2007, 10:27 PM
Philippians 4:13
Seward, NE
Joined Nov 2006
5,750 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Butch777
The IPS version Wild-Cat Boomer(6.5oz if built light) will fly slow enough for a beginner. I still have a couple Slo-Cat Boomers, that are outrunner powered and built light(6oz). I use them for training on a buddybox on windy days instead of a Slow Stick or, Pico Stick, Cub, Sky Scooter or Wing Dragon. The Boomers handle a crash tons better and are easy to repair. Plus there able to fly in high winds once You can.

I've got enough to put together a couple Short kits. The Wing, is preped and the booms installed. It comes with matched ailerons, CA hinges, quality push rods, horns, pattern for the 2 tails and dimensions for the elevator, plus pre-shaped fuselage and canopy for $45.00 plus shipping. I can supply you with a new IPS motor or outrunner, ESC, Props, etc and even do a bit more assembling if you more money than skill. Or I can sell you the EPP to shape your own fuselage for cheap.
But there really very easy to build and for the tails, motors, and batts, many types can be used.
But for a beginner, the lighter the better, so the slower it will fly and the crashes will be less damaging. And once you master it, it can be flown in a small area, like in the street or half a basketball court. Butch
Wow, this all sounds great. I have been wanting to build something like this for a long time. I was really getting ready to build a Super Dart (I don't know if you have been to that thread) but just couldn't bring myself to do that since they can only be flown inside.
I live in Nebraska where the wind is always blowing. Always! I fly my Super Cub all the time though. I am pretty confident flying it and am ready to move on. I don't know much of a beginner I am but I agree with you on the fact that light is better. How do the lighter versions compare to the heavier ones? They probably just handle less wind and move a little slower right? THe only thing that I would have on hand right now is a radio. I am assuming that the one that I bought for the 4 channel plane would work.
Please let me know exact numbers when you have time... I am very short on funds right now since I just had lower back surgery a couple weeks ago and I have been out or work since then... and we are expecting our 3rd child in a couple months. Nothing will keep me from flying though I would say that I am pretty handy and also believe that the best part of a plane is building it. So, I wouldn't need any assistance there unless I don't understand the plans. I do really appreciate the fact that you would be able to supply all that I need though because that was the problem with the super dart. I couldn't get a straight answer from anyone. They all had different suggestions.

Sorry to all who had to read through all of this. I should have send a PM.
Oops.
Thanks
Tyson
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Old Apr 16, 2007, 09:06 PM
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Butch777,

I sent you a PM
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Old Apr 16, 2007, 10:40 PM
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Livermore, CA
Joined Sep 2004
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The problem even with Boomers, is there's so many choices today. In the old days, it was a .049 engine and balsa. Then it was a speed 400 and nicads and balsa or styrofoam.
Now its EPP, EPS, Elapor, Balsa, Composite and more. And then outrunners, inrunners, Lipos and there C ratings, ETC. I could build 30-40 Boomers that all looked the same but were different.
Whats funny though, is my first Boomer, the Slo-Cat, has been crashed by me and students over 40-50 times, had the nose glued back on many times, been stuck in the trees several times and still flys great. And it only has a thin depron tail and used servos. But its glory is its CustomCDR cool single and Castle ESC. It stills goes vertical on a 2 cell lipo, with a flying weight of only 6oz and still alot of fun to fly in front of the house. Butch
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Old Apr 18, 2007, 10:24 PM
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Livermore, CA
Joined Sep 2004
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A bit of clarification on the tails and ailerons.
They can be built out of anything, balsa, depron, EPP or what ever.

For the slowest sloflyer, depron is best, because of its weight. Balsa could be used as a covered framework to keep it light, but that's a lot of work.

For 1st time beginners, covered balsa offers some strength for the ailerons, the vertical tail in EPP, with a carbon fiber rod imbedded to stiffen them and then depron for the horizontal stab and elevator, to keep them light and because there protected by the EPP tail. The lighter depon ailerons would give it a slower speed, better for beginners, but its a toss-up with beginners bound to crash more than most.

On a faster Boomer, like a 3 cell outrunner, with someone with some experiance, one could use balsa all around. If done right, it would still not weigh too much, so it would still have good sloflight and be strong enough for the faster speeds.

Also, on the beginners and sloflyers, we dont use any wing spars or tape, because its not needed. Maybe a piece of tape across the leading edge for beginners, but not really needed.
But the faster it goes, the stronger its got to be.
My 3 cell outrunner version has depron all around and no tape or spars and flys fine, but it doesn't go real fast, just fun fast! Butch
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Old Apr 18, 2007, 11:30 PM
Philippians 4:13
Seward, NE
Joined Nov 2006
5,750 Posts
Thanks for all of the info Butch!
I just need to round up some cash and get to building...
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Old Apr 19, 2007, 04:35 PM
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Butch, I sent you a PM. I want one just like in post #100, RTF.
I have a DX6.
Thanks
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Old May 03, 2007, 05:28 PM
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Livermore, CA
Joined Sep 2004
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Many have asked about a video. One of the guys I fly with, took a video of a couple Boomers and said he'll post it later.

I took the Slo-Cat Boomer out at dusk, yesterday in front of my house, in some nasty gusty winds. I was hopeing it would calm a bit, as it does sometimes as the sun sets, but the trash cans were still getting blown over!!
It was in a tree in about 2 minutes! I got it out and tossed it again, this time I kept it a bit higher. My neighbor comes out and says; Isn't it too windy to be flying that thing??
I said Yup, but that's what makes it fun!!
The Slo-Cat Boomer is getting very beat up flying on days like that. Its been crashed 30-40 times. Just the other day, real windy with a student on a buddy box, it got nosed-in and ripped the nose and part of the wing off.
The student was real up-set he crashed it, but I told him thats what its made for and its had the nose ripped off several times before, besides I should have been able to take it from you in time, but the gusty wind was just too quick.

So far the Boomers seem to do fine in the crash department. This Slo-Cat Boomer still has its original 3mm depron tail and has the depron ailerons cracked a couple times.
Besides that and the nose, which is easy to fix, the prop has been smacked into the street several times and replaced.
The Wild-Cat Boomers, both the IPS and outrunner versions, are mainly flown at the field and one has broke the nose a couple times, but so far out of 60-70 flights, the props haven't been hurt.
If I can find 1 lb black EPP, that would make the fuselages softer and less likely to snap, but would be harder to sand the shape. So I'll keep my eyes open for some and try it. Butch
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Old May 03, 2007, 08:22 PM
No Guts, No Glory
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Simi Valley, CA
Joined Feb 2007
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Great. I'm always looking forward to new post in this thread.
Cant wait to see the video
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Old May 03, 2007, 08:55 PM
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New Hampshire-seacoast area
Joined Jun 2005
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Hey Butch, got a question-- I've been flying my sorta boomer (posted a pic back a few pages), 19T cd kit motor, and I've found that with a 9050 propon a 2s, side to side stability is twitchy-hard to keep level-And when I put a 8040 on and a 3s the twitchy-ness goes away and it flies smooth and controlable. The 3s set up also lets me fly faster and roll faster.

Question is , do you think the larger prop is applying more torq to the wing, making it twitchy? It's strange to me, I found this out after slapping a 2s and 9050 at the field after I used up all my 3s's.

Look forward to your vids

Paul
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Old May 03, 2007, 09:35 PM
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Hey Paul, Its hard to say without seeing it, but I'd say that the smaller prop and 3's gave it some more speed, meaning more control. The faster a plane goes, usually the better it flys, up to where the controls become too sensitive.
Even my real Cessna Aerobat, at lower speeds, took alot of control movement and seemed real slugish and basicly didn't fly so good.
Just because a plane will fly at a slow speed, doesen't mean its flying at it's peek preformance speed.
My first GWS E-Starter, years ago, seemed to fly alright, but not so great on the 10" prop it came with. I switched it to the 9" prop it also came with and Wow what a difference, using the same motor and batt.
The IPS Wild-Cat Boomer will fly pretty slow, but its just kinda lumbering around.
It all depends on the total weight, wing area and airfoil.
If I built a Boomer with a undercambered airfoil and light weight, it would fly real nice, stable and slow, but would not handle any wind. On the other hand a symmetrical airfoil would be great for a fast Boomer and in the wind, but wouldn't slow down so well, unless it was really super lite.
Also the slower it flys, the bigger the control surfaces need to be. Butch
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Old May 05, 2007, 04:59 PM
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Livermore, CA
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I planed on going flying with the boys today, so last night I decided to take out the Stryker-Cat Boomer and change the GWS 350 motor to a small 24gram outrunner. Its the same motor on the Wild-Cat Boomer and my Ultrafly PC-9.
I set it up for a 910mah 3 cell and used the Unitedhobbies cheap/light ESC they sell.
I had to glue in a composite tube on top of the GWS mounting stick and make a clamp to hold the motor in. I soldered everything up, checked the C/G and batt location.
Installed it, tested it and went to bed.
When I left the house, there was a slight breeze, but at the flying field, it was really blowing. Wheather reports had it at 15-20mph, gusting to 24mph. I stood around till the guys landed there Wings and then we BS'ed a bit.

It really looked too windy to do a maiden, but I was there and at least I'd try.
It was so gusty, I had a hard time putting in the batt, in the right place to get a aprox C/G.
I gave it a toss, hit the power and off she went. I had plenty of control and power, even vertical climbs. It seemed a lot more stable than my Esskay powered Stryker.
It was blowing so hard, I couldn't tell if the C/G was ok or not.
I had just as much control as the Flying Wings the guys were flying, or more.
With the EPP tail and the new outrunner, its about 10.5ozs flying, the same as my PC-9. It seemed to handle the wind just a tad bit better than the Wild-Cat Boomer, but its got a thinner airfoil and weighs 3ozs more.

It was too windy to fly some of the other planes, but just for fun, I tossed my Sky Angel, a 3.2oz, EPP conversion, from a 2ch cheapo plane.
The guys were suprised it flew at all! But it did and was fun. Butch
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Old May 05, 2007, 05:05 PM
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Hum, My Yahoo wouldn't let me post pics, so I had to go over to AOL.
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Old May 05, 2007, 07:35 PM
No Guts, No Glory
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Simi Valley, CA
Joined Feb 2007
2,024 Posts
I would never think about flying my planes in even 15mph winds.
On the last page you mentioned that you finished the RTF planes. What components are you using. Looking forward to the video, any idea when it will be here?

Great job Butch!!
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Old May 05, 2007, 07:50 PM
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Thrust Line

Did you use a normal thrust line for lining up your motor, sor did you have it adjusted ? I thought that I remembered reading that keeping the motor inline with the bottom surface of the trailing section of the wing made this plane fly better than the original directions, but A can't find that thread and I was wondering if when you convert to a cat if this would go to a normal wing cord line and if any offset was needed to correct for torque/prop wach? Please let me know!
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Old May 05, 2007, 09:36 PM
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Each plane design, each airfoil and speed range had its own thrust line requirements.
In general, a non-undercambered wing, set up light, can just set the thrust line on the cord line, if the center line of the motor is close to the cord line as well.
I've lucked out with all my Boomers, setting them up that way. I also set up my fast planes that way as well.

On the stronger outrunners, swinging large props, there is some torque effect, but that's mainly during launch and not so noticeable in flight. Butch
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