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Old Oct 31, 2006, 12:00 PM
guillows basher!!
Pittsburgh Allegheny, Pennsylvania, United States
Joined Feb 2004
957 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by AirNerd
OK...I made a Quick Vid of the control throws on my Riot.

Expo

95% on high rates and 90% on low rates, on all surfaces.

Dual Rates

Ail...85% High-30% Low

Elev...90% High-40% Low

Rud...85% High-50% Low
thanks! i used all the gp hardware and i'm getting lockup on right ail. coupler,i'll redo,everything else seems solid and slop free btw i hate expo!! never used it, and trying it now is like learning to fly all over again! almost wrecked my buds geebee gasser this summer when he handed me the tx,me and expo do'nt go well together,i need to feel everything instantly from the git
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Old Oct 31, 2006, 12:29 PM
GIMMIE FOAM!!!
AirNerd's Avatar
Edwardsville KS
Joined Oct 2005
1,742 Posts
Wow ESB! I cannot imagine flying this particular plane without Expo.

If you do try Expo start off with small amounts. Also you must find out if you have to use pos. or neg. Expo (depends or Tx). I really think this Expo stuff is Awsome and can make you look like a better pilot.

My binding is in the hinges, they are still real stiff even after folding them a million times.

CT
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Old Nov 04, 2006, 01:05 PM
"I passed on the kool-aid"
Waco, TX
Joined Jan 2004
3,884 Posts
I moved the battery to the roof of the plane

behind the firewall and flew it last night...It was nice and calm again and the plane flew really well. It was not what I would call pitch sensitive this time out and I flew it at a pretty brisk pace at times just to make sure I was not imagining it. Snaps on high rates were wicked fast. The rudder coupling is still there but I managed to get it to KE decent but not nearly as good as most other planes. It really takes just a hair's throw of rudder (maybe 1/4") to KE this thing. I had a mix with the ailerons to try and fix the roll coupling but apparently had the mix backwards and need to get the aileron travel reversed of what it was. Harriers are a delight and you really feel comfortable dragging the tail through the grass. It is still a bit twitchy in hovering (due to the hyper sensitive rudder) and combined with the short wingspan will torque roll pretty easily, but I managed to hover a few times right on the deck for. The ailerons remain very effective even in a hover and at slow air speeds. Elevators have a fair amount of wing rock now I assume because of the forward CG but I can live with it as the pitch sensitiivity seems to be gone and the plane is flyable now. Up to now it has been a love/hate relationship with this thing but I am hoping that is all about to change for the better.
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Old Nov 04, 2006, 02:38 PM
GIMMIE FOAM!!!
AirNerd's Avatar
Edwardsville KS
Joined Oct 2005
1,742 Posts
I flew mine indoors today...Yes the harrier, is without a doubt, the eaisiest trick in the book for this guy! At any angle of attack BTW.

Hovering was also still a bit squirly for me also bu I may just need to speed up the elevator (it would fall out frount to back).

All in all I really just wanted to get used to it indoors again...its been all summer!
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Old Nov 05, 2006, 06:12 AM
guillows basher!!
Pittsburgh Allegheny, Pennsylvania, United States
Joined Feb 2004
957 Posts
p-smurf,try adding 2-3 degrees of down thrust in the motor,on my 4th flight i started to get the pitching problem you mentioned earlier,found out my batt slid back a tad(it does'nt take much) and the plane gets real twichy even on low rate,so what i did was added a 2mm shim to get down thrust,tried a flight again with the batt in the aft slid position and it solved the problem,i think that at neutral position and with a slightly tail heavy setting that the motor thrust and the horizontal start fighting each other
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Old Jan 21, 2007, 12:23 PM
X-15 Jockey
burkefj's Avatar
Joined Oct 2006
2,440 Posts
Riot flights

Mine came out about 10 oz rtf with a 730 TP 3s pack, it was very pitch sensitive, set up as recommended with the CG about 1/8" behind nominal. Extreme roll rate at speed. I tried a 480 pack with the CG at max behind nominal and it was worse, very hard to control, nose up and very pitch sensitive. I decided then to put the CG at max forward, which took not only the speed control right at the nose, but a TP 1320 pack, AND 1/2 oz of lead. I'm now at 12 oz rtf with it ballanced. I'm using futaba S3110's and a corona 5oz receiver, so I don't see how I could have made it much lighter on the rear, and using the stock rimfire motor with 8x3.8. Now with the CG forward, it flies like a dream, especially with some expo on all controlls(40%). Not pitch sensitive, harriers at almost no forward speed, hovers, still with extreme roll rate. It's quickly now becoming my favorite plane. I used to hate it. I also have a flat-out CAP580 which can knife edge better(riot has a lot of coupling), and hover a bit better, but you can't drive the cap very fast without flutter, the riot can hover and harrier, but you can go to normal flyin speed and have lighting quick rolls and snaps I finally decided to remove the wheel pants as they keep rotating under the wheels during flight and I wind up landing on them

Frank
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Old Feb 03, 2007, 08:35 PM
Plane Crazy!!!
Ft. Lauderdale, FL
Joined Sep 2006
754 Posts
Any of you try mounting the motor more forward of the firewall with spacers...

Might help in moving the CG forward without having to add dead weight or a bigger lipo.
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Old Feb 09, 2007, 04:12 AM
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Geoff2005's Avatar
Perth, Western Australia
Joined Jul 2006
1,514 Posts
I purchased a Riot today and after reading this thread and trial balancing mine I've installed the servos up the front to try and avoid adding ballast.

I think AUW will be around 200gm with Hacker A20S, CC Ph 10, Spectrum AR 6100, 400 2S pack and two Blue Arrow 3.6gm and 1 Bluebird 6gm servos.
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Old Feb 10, 2007, 02:36 AM
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Geoff2005's Avatar
Perth, Western Australia
Joined Jul 2006
1,514 Posts
Halfway through putting this together I thought this should be tried out as a light monoplane. So putting a 17gm MPJet motor on the front, AUW with 300mAh 2Spack is 150gm (about 5.3oz).

The winds are fairly gusty in Perth at the moment but I thought I would give it a go. The Riot is quite clean in the air so handled the wind well for such a light plane. It was just a little underpowered for hovering but otherwise this would fly pattern fairly well I think.

Here is the video http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=640251

Now to stick the top wing on and put in a bigger motor.
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Last edited by Geoff2005; Feb 10, 2007 at 03:24 AM.
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Old Feb 10, 2007, 08:51 AM
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ededge2002's Avatar
Newmarket,Ontario, Canada
Joined Dec 2002
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great idea! wish you could do some more testing with this project! i might have to get one and try it myself.
ededge2002
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Old Feb 10, 2007, 06:06 PM
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Geoff2005's Avatar
Perth, Western Australia
Joined Jul 2006
1,514 Posts
Tried it again in calmer air this morning. Tracks nicely and flys pattern fairly well. Stepped up to high rates, axial rolls were insanely fast. No pitch sensitivety problems as described earlier in the thread with the stock bipe but my CG was conservative being just in front of the spar.

Moving on to top wing install now.
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Old Feb 10, 2007, 06:37 PM
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Newmarket,Ontario, Canada
Joined Dec 2002
968 Posts
i see with your pics though that you put your servos forward my frined did on his this helps the cg a LOT on this thing! lots of others are just putting huge batteries in it to get it to balance. he has a 2204/54 on his and flies great with 480tp's insane vert and a roll rate that is blinding! very fun plane to fly.

ededge2002
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Old Feb 10, 2007, 07:00 PM
"I passed on the kool-aid"
Waco, TX
Joined Jan 2004
3,884 Posts
Did you still have the coupling issues with just the single wing?
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Old Feb 10, 2007, 10:12 PM
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Geoff2005's Avatar
Perth, Western Australia
Joined Jul 2006
1,514 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by papasmurf
Did you still have the coupling issues with just the single wing?

Didn't try any KE so can't comment on that.
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Old Feb 10, 2007, 10:18 PM
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Geoff2005's Avatar
Perth, Western Australia
Joined Jul 2006
1,514 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by ededge2002
i see with your pics though that you put your servos forward my frined did on his this helps the cg a LOT on this thing! lots of others are just putting huge batteries in it to get it to balance. he has a 2204/54 on his and flies great with 480tp's insane vert and a roll rate that is blinding! very fun plane to fly.

ededge2002
Yeah after reading this thread I took the tip and tried to avoid weight in the back.

I try and go as light as possible, it looks like I'll get the CG right with two wings and a heavier (hacker A20S with 2S 400mAh Hyperion) power system. RX, esc and Batt all fit in the bay between wing and firewall. I opened up the top of the bay as well instead of the bottom. Doesn't look as good from the top but can change battery without putting the model on its back.
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