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Old Jul 28, 2002, 02:49 PM
Registered User
Fremont, CA
Joined Jul 2002
11 Posts
A confused :confused: new bee needs help

Hi,

I got interested in RC about 2 weeks ago and I have already stopped watching TV. Yesterday I had my first intro flight on a .40 gas plane and decided that I have to start with a slower electric kit. I started reading about the FAQ at E zone but got confused.
Which ever electric plane I decide on seems to have gathered some negative review by some one adding to confusion. I am not able to figure about which is a better plane T-52 or Skyrunner or Firebird or duraplane. I am very

What plane I need. I am looking for RTF to ARF kits.
What servos do I need?
What batteries?
Do I need all the neat equipments mentioned in the FAQ armswitch, cut off.. etc
Where can I get info on circuits.

I really need to decide on a plane soon otherwise my wife will withdraw her share from yet-another-hubby-hobby-fund. The fund has around 300 dollers.

Help a nee bee.

vineet
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Old Jul 28, 2002, 03:09 PM
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Striker308's Avatar
Lancaster, PA
Joined May 2002
77 Posts
Jainvineet,
I'm still rather new and tend to point people towards the T-52. If I can build it and fly it then anyone can. The T-52 is inexpensive and very............and I mean very durable. The plane cost $35.00 and they do offer a complete kit minus radio equipment and servos for around $120.00.

I bought a cheap Futaba 4 channel radio off of Ebay and bought a GWS pico receiver and am currently using GWS pico servos. As for servos go with the Hitec HS-81 they offer much more torque.

I have recently been experimenting with a S480 motor and was able to get around 20 minutes of flight time last night with it on a geared S480, 7x4 Master Airscrew, and 9 cell 1200mah Nimh batteries.

You could definately have a great flying system for well under $300.00............just keep asking, searching on the internet and checking Ebay.

Striker
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Old Jul 28, 2002, 04:14 PM
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goofup's Avatar
Yukon, OK
Joined Apr 2002
267 Posts
First, get the money and hide it before she spends it.

Second, you sound like you're looking for the perfect beginner plane/setup. So was I. There isn't one. They all have their advantages and disadvantages. What you have to take into consideration is what kind of area do you want to fly in (backyard, large field, etc.), and what kinds of winds you'll normally be flying in. What works for person A won't work for person B. (For instance, I'd love to have a Tiger Moth, but I could only fly it about 20 days a year here in Oklahoma due to the winds we have).

Striker308 had the best advice you could get: use the search function here for more info about all the beginner/newbie planes available than you can imagine. Once you find a plane, then you can pick the setup to go with it. Go to all the major online retailers and check out their RTF, ARF, and combos. Personally, I feel that most combos do give you everything you fly matched to the plane, but remember that they're also trying to keep the cost down as much as possible.

With $300 you have lots of options. Do your homework so you spend it wisely.

Goofup
"What goes up must come down... the question is speed and direction."
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Old Jul 29, 2002, 12:47 AM
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staten island new york
Joined Sep 1999
829 Posts
So far all the posters here are right and have given you good advice. So here's my 2 cents worth. My experience is that I taught myself to fly after reading the Ezone and surfing the net. Building-wise I've built planes since a teenager so what I might consider easy building you might not.
Radio, my research so far tell me the best deal out there so far is the Hitec Lazer 4. I recommended this to my friend recently. The main reason is the cost and it has mixing (necessary when you move to the very popular Zagi or the now late and lamented FMA Razor) A step up from this is the Hitec Flash 4 or 5. Get the version with the HS 81 servos and the 555 receiver. Servocity.com has free shipping.

Planes, I am not familiar with the skyrunner.
The Firebird, I believe is the same one that goes undser many names (eg Black Maxx at towerhobbies.com), comes as a kit that has a pusher motor and a V tail. If you really feel you have a future involvement in this hobby that's more than take a plane out and toss it into the air a few times every now and then, this plane isnot for you. On reason is that the components are not really useable for any other plane. And in that all our planes are "toys". This packagee is design as a "casual toy"

T52, it's everything everyone says it is. It flys well (when built correctly), inexpensive and tough. It flys on the rudder elevator setup but can be converted to ailerons.

The Push-E-Cat, by garrison aerodrome. This is my favorite and I chose this rather than the T52. There reasons are; it's a pusher so when you crash it, you will unlikey bend the motor shaft. The whole plane is made of EPP (expanded polypropylene) foam. This is white packing foam that bounces back when you dent or bend it. The T52 while tough is made of EPS, a foam exacly like pink insulation foam and does not bounce back.

The Zagi, very popular, very tough. The wing is EPS with a leading edge of EPP. I personally don't recommend this as a beginning plane although some people have learned to fly on it. I couldn't fly it until after a few hours on the Push-E-Cat.

The Hitech Sky Scooter. Also a popular choice. It flies well, the components are reusable. Maybe not quite as tough as the other three, but actual users will have to comment on that.

You need a speed controler (ESC) otherwise you will have no throttle control. If you have an on/off switch, you switch-on, launch the plane and fly at full throttle tha whole flight and land when the batter runs out. As someone did an analysis it's not worth the money or time to build your own. There have been some good comments about the electrifly series of ESC and the Wattage. They are the the least expensive of the ones out there.

Batteries. Generally the sp400 size motors use the 600AE size. But Garrison sells a package that uses 1400AE, I also use them. The T52 will also carry bigger cells than 600AE. You'll need 8cells of Nicad or 9Cell NiMH packs. You'll also need more than one pack since you have to let them cool a bit before recharging. Other planes and motors will use different combinations.

Charger. Don't buy a cheap charger or a RC car charge that only does 8cells. The Hitec 330 or 335 are popular and work well. The dymond turbo charger and the FMA Supernova are good buys in the "smart charger" catagory. These will "read" your battery pack and select a proper charge rate for them.

Connectors. Get good connectors for your packs and motors. I use PowerPoles AKA sermos, others use astroflight or deans but I use sermos becasue they are cheaper.

Hope this helps.
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Old Jul 29, 2002, 11:49 AM
God is good
Viper Pilot's Avatar
Banjul
Joined Jan 2001
4,246 Posts
vineet,

I've seen a lot of newbees larn on a T-52. I've never flown one, so I say from personal experience. It is a rugged, durable plane. Flies great. Price is excellent.

Check it out here :

VP
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Old Jul 29, 2002, 05:45 PM
Registered User
Fremont, CA
Joined Jul 2002
11 Posts
Thanks everyone for the help. Here are few more questions.

I have never been on such a friendly news group before. Danke!!

With help from everyone I have decided on the following so far

T-52
H-81 servo (from servocity.com) thanks
Most likely Hitech laser 4 radio
Hitech 555 receiver.

A few more question if you guys can help on

1) Hitec 555 is 21 gms in weight and Hitec "Feather" 4-Channel FM Sub-Micro Receiver is 7.8 gms in weight and cheaper. But no one recommended it so clearly I have missed something. Is because Hitec "Feather" cannot be used later for more powerful planes.

2) Can H-81 be used in glow planes as well? (Talk of greed!)

3) What motor and battery and circuit to choose? Is there a tutorial somewhere which can tell what 300mAh, what does 7.4V motor means? By all means I was a dud in electircal classes back in school.


Hope I can place order for these cookies this week.

vineet
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Old Jul 29, 2002, 08:46 PM
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Redmond, WA
Joined Apr 2002
710 Posts
1. For the really light planes (indoor and light parkflyers), weight is a big issue. The feather meets the needs for these models at the cost of range and interference. Search for "feather, micro, glitching, receiver" on this site and you will get a lot more information on this topic. In your case, go with the 555. Or you can substitute it for the Extreme 5 from www.fmadirect.com or the Berg 5*DSP but you can't beat servocity's free shipping.

2. Don't know, I'll defer this one. I think it more a question of the torque and deflection specs than the energy source.

3. Again, search this site (Open Discussion, Training Area & Modeling Science) with the keywords. There was a fairly recent thread talking about battery voltage, capacity, etc with some great analogies.
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Old Jul 29, 2002, 10:49 PM
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staten island new york
Joined Sep 1999
829 Posts
Item 1; what electrifan said. The newer version is suppose to be better but the feather is for small "parkflyers" with a smaller range.

Item 2; Yes, but it depends on how bit the model is. However the real question is, who go glow when you can fly electric? I used to fly gas. But now, I go, I fly, I throw everything back in the car and go home. No cleaning, no smell, no oil.

Item 3; for the motor size in the t52 you need one that works up to 20amps or so.If you fly bigger motors you need one with a greater amp capacity. See my previous post for suggestion. I use Castle Creation ESC. I have 3 of them.
The hand waving easy not-neccessarily-entirly-accurate answer to motors is that teh rating is a nominal voltage given by the manufactured. In the E-plane worlda 6 cell pack is already 7.2 volts and most commonly speed 400 size are run with 7-8 nicads or 9 Nickel Mtal Hydride (NiMh) batteries. Generally, 6v motor at 8cells give you more power, 7.2 @8cells a little more duration, this is how the HobbyLobby catalog blurb tells it.
300mAh means 300 millamps/hour. It's a capacity rating of the battery. Meaning you can draw 0.300 amps out of it per hour or any ratio thereof. eg 0.600 amps in 1/2 hour. Typically a speed 400 motor in a T-52 size plane will draw anywhere from 9-13 amps. This is why most posters recommend using bigger batteries ie 1400 maH or 1700maH. Personally I recommend 1400 Nicads (sanyo 1400AE). They are cheap and reliable. There are several sources with links at Ezone. I also recommend 1300cps. These are physically shorter and thicker but they can be used with bigger motors that draw more amps. I think the faq has link to tutorials.
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Old Jul 30, 2002, 06:01 AM
Rehab is for quitters
LuckyArmpit's Avatar
West Middlesex, PA, US
Joined Jun 2001
4,853 Posts
You could go with this on a T-52...
speed 480
gearbox that is 3 to 1 ratio
9x6 graupner cam prop
8 cell 1250 SCR's or 1400 AE cells or even 1700 cells and you could even use 1600 nimh cells
20 to 30 amp ESC
Hitec 555 rx

Dave...
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Old Jul 30, 2002, 06:46 AM
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djspnz's Avatar
Central Massachusetts
Joined May 2002
72 Posts
Nevermind all those other planes, if u really want to learn how to fly without frustration check this plane out (its better than the wingo because it comes with the gearbox that u would have to add to the wingo for better performance) u can get it at your LHS for $240 with the JR Quattro lite radio system and you'll be ready to fly in no time.This plane is easy to build, comes with motor,gearbox,battery,esc,charger and prop, all u need is the radio system (JR Quattro is really dependable, i've never had a problem with mine) Good luck!!!!!!!

http://www.thehobbystopptc.com/new_items.htm
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Old Jul 30, 2002, 11:37 PM
Registered User
Fremont, CA
Joined Jul 2002
11 Posts
A little more help needed

Quote:
Originally posted by LuckyArmpit
You could go with this on a T-52...
speed 480
gearbox that is 3 to 1 ratio
9x6 graupner cam prop
8 cell 1250 SCR's or 1400 AE cells or even 1700 cells and you could even use 1600 nimh cells
20 to 30 amp ESC
Hitec 555 rx
Dave...
I decided on this S400 motor for my T-52.
The following are the ratings on the motor specifications.

Motor Type 3320
Watts out 50
Volts 6
Free RPM 26.7K
Load RPM 14.2k
Prop size 6x3
Amps 17
Thrust 8
Case long" 1.5
Dia" 1-3/32
Shaft mm 2.3
Wt. oz. 2.6

My question is what are the rating "Watts out" , Amps, Thrust mean?


If I choose the following gear box with the following specification will be it ok?

Motor/Gear R3321/GR170303G
Gear Ratio 2.33:1
Volts 9.6
Watts out 62
Prop RPM 7.5k
Prop Size 9X5
Amps 11
Thrust 15

If any one can explain these ratings also it will be great.

thanks
vineet
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Old Jul 31, 2002, 01:27 AM
Int'l Slope Observer
webguyjv's Avatar
Fremont, CA
Joined Oct 2001
1,887 Posts
Did You Buy Your T-52 Yet?

Hi Vineet

If you haven't bought your T-52 yet, maybe I can con you into coming flying with us sometime in the near future. I live in fremont also, and I try to fly each weekend. I have a few buddies that I usually fly with (one or the other -- nto always lucky enough to get them all at the same flying site on the same day).

Here's the hitch -- I fly slope.

I know you want to buy a T-52 and I don't discourage that. If I were you, I'd buy the Push-E Cat -- that's what I did and I've never been happier. After about a year flying the Push-E Cat, I graduated to a slope sailplane from Dave's Aircraft Works -- the DAW Schweizer 1-26 2-meter. Interms of slope planes there are probably dozens of good entry-level panes out there to consider,and they're all pretty cheap to purchase and even build.

The reason I think you should come flying with us sometime is to just look at a sloper, and get a feeling for what they're all about, and maybe even fly one for a few minutes, AND THEN, go back to the drawing board and either buy that T-52 and all of the goodies, or change course and look into slopers.

One really neat thing about starting with a decent slope sailplane is that all that is required inthe electronics area is a receiver battery, a receiver, and servos. You may not even need to get any cables, wires, etc... if these items are close enough to each other when you build them.

Oh yes -- and (IMO) one REALY important thing if you're truly a beginner -- whatever you buy, make sure it's made of 100% EPP. I was a beginner just over two years ago and both the Push-E Cat and the Schweizer have been brokern in half at least twice per plane -- and those were the most intense of all of my hundreds of crashes. Most of the crashes involved putting a piece of tape on the plane and flying again, followed by an overnight glue repair at home.

A typical EPP slope trainer kit will cost you between $40 and $80, add another $20 or so for glue, tape, etc..., and then (if you don't have a radio) add about $80 or so for something like a Hitec Focus III FM (which comes with charger, a NiCD RX battery, a NiCD TX battery, the TX, and servos). The whole thing can cost as little as $140.

At any rate, the best way for you to understand what I'm talking about is to meet us sometime in the near future and see the planes we fly. Our favorite sites are Coyote Hills Regional Park in Fremont, Cal State Hayward, and Del Valle Regional Park in Livermore.

Oh, by the way, electric trainers usually do a really nice job on the slope as well. When there is lift, you simply throw if off the hill with the motor off and when the wind is stiff, your plane may be outperforming the traditional slopers because it's got that heavy motor and battery up front. It's amazing to see these planes sloping so nicely with the motor turned off. And when the wind dies and the slopers are landing, you simply turn on the motor and head skyward.

Send me a private message is you'd like to meet us sometime on the slope.

Happy Flying ;-)

Webguyjv
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