HobbyKing.com New Products Flash Sale
Reply
Thread Tools
Old Nov 01, 2009, 09:04 PM
Registered User
Joined Nov 2005
26 Posts
help with esc/batts

okay not sure on this so im going to ask. originally i was going to put 2 2200 3cells in parrellel with each other but i just got thinking would it be better to just hook them to each motor and run a y harness for the speed controller bec???????? reason im asking is if i do it this way would i not have a better outcome if a battery decided to go south on me ?? it would atleast still give me power to one engine????

what is everybody else doing??? and why ???

im new to this edf stuff so please DUMB IT DOWN LOL
warhawk69 is offline Find More Posts by warhawk69
Reply With Quote
Sign up now
to remove ads between posts
Old Nov 01, 2009, 10:27 PM
MN WATTS Master
Vintauri's Avatar
United States, MN, Mankato
Joined Jul 2003
7,378 Posts
having the packs to each motor direct would in fact be worse. You do not want to be in a situation where you have power to one side obut not the other. You'd be in a situation with lots of power on one side and none on the other. This will most likely end up with you in a spin. It's best that they both cut out by parallelling the esc's and Y'ing that off to both motors.

Steve
Vintauri is online now Find More Posts by Vintauri
RCG Plus Member
Old Nov 01, 2009, 10:29 PM
Registered User
gwong's Avatar
Vancouver, B.C., Canada
Joined Sep 2003
933 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by warhawk69 View Post
okay not sure on this so im going to ask. originally i was going to put 2 2200 3cells in parrellel with each other but i just got thinking would it be better to just hook them to each motor and run a y harness for the speed controller bec???????? reason im asking is if i do it this way would i not have a better outcome if a battery decided to go south on me ?? it would atleast still give me power to one engine????

what is everybody else doing??? and why ???

im new to this edf stuff so please DUMB IT DOWN LOL
On my airliner...I have the 2 3S 2200 packs running parallel to both the ESCs. The reason is if one pack goes I still have power to the electronics and motors. If you run 1 pack to 1 motor and if 1 pack goes I am sure you will have some yawing to deal with. In either case you will need to run a y cable from your receiver to both the ESC and need to disable one of the internal BEC.

This is the way I wired it on my Airliner for several years now.

Thanks,

Gord.
gwong is offline Find More Posts by gwong
Reply With Quote
Old Nov 02, 2009, 03:14 AM
Registered User
San Jose, CA
Joined May 2004
432 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by gwong View Post
On my airliner...I have the 2 3S 2200 packs running parallel to both the ESCs. The reason is if one pack goes I still have power to the electronics and motors. If you run 1 pack to 1 motor and if 1 pack goes I am sure you will have some yawing to deal with. In either case you will need to run a y cable from your receiver to both the ESC and need to disable one of the internal BEC.

This is the way I wired it on my Airliner for several years now.

Thanks,

Gord.
From someone that HAD a functional 777, my setup is a little different.

First, I am using the 1 - 3S2P Rhino 4000mah pack. Why? Because I
didn't read the "2P" part when I ordered it. As it turns out, it is an
absolutely perfect fit and leaves room for the steering servo (retracts).

Now, from there I run a uBEC and disable BOTH esc BECs. I do this because
I am using mechanical retracts and the mains are hauled in with a full sized
High Torque servo. I simply didn't trust the speed controls to not go into
thermal shutdown due to excessive servo current draw.

Now for the twist. I am running a Liposhield for the LVC. The controllers I
am using are Super Simple 30A and have a cut off of about 8,5V The
two sides NEVER cut out at the same time (ground testing). With the
addition of the Liposhield, the cut off is now exactly 9.0V AND both
motors shut down at exactly the same time and same rate because
there is only one Liposhield talking to both sides. As far as Low Voltage
shutdown, it acts like a BRUSHED system running two fans off one esc.
I absolutely love this little jewel on multi motor planes. The Liposhield
is a soft "stepped" shutdown. It is slow enough to get you back to the
strip. Never once in my testing did one side quit before the other. I
like that.

The good news is that the 777 CAN be landed with only one side lit. The
rudder is capable of controlling the yaw. The down side is you will need
counter ailerons to stop the roll from the rudder. It is not a trick for the
timid. During my behavior testing of my TWA bird, I flew one complete
flight without touching the ailerons (just elevator and rudder). It's a
little sluggish, but it works.

NW, if you do not do parallel hookups, the chances of getting the fans
out of sync is highly possible. ALL batteries, motors, speed controls, wires
and connectors are slightly different. Their discharge properties can be
slightly different. Tied together they will tend to balance each other out.
I would highly recommend that you balance them and charge them
separately while keeping an eye on the final voltage on each.


PS, All this is making me miss my TWA 777 more! The wing is almost
done. Still looking for a nacelle. I may have to repair this one if horizon
doesn't get them in. It won't be the first Blu-core FFF repair job on a
white foam airframe for me...


Arnold
ala722 is offline Find More Posts by ala722
Reply With Quote
Old Nov 02, 2009, 01:48 PM
Registered User
Joined Nov 2005
26 Posts
Help

Okay than i will take the 2 batt's and keep them hooked up in parallel.


Second question?????

I am running 2 hyperion 30 amp Titan series speed controllers. they have 5 volt 3amp bec's. do i have to disable one or can i run them both at the same time???? I feel that if i could run them at the same time i would never have to worry about a bec over heat situation as i am only running analog mini servoes( tunrigy 1800a). The biggest one is a Hitec 225 for the elevators.

any help greatly appreciated

darryl
warhawk69 is offline Find More Posts by warhawk69
Reply With Quote
Old Nov 02, 2009, 06:16 PM
Screw the wind, let's fly!
Naval Warfare's Avatar
Lawrenceville, Ga
Joined Feb 2008
2,722 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by warhawk69 View Post
Okay than i will take the 2 batt's and keep them hooked up in parallel.


Second question?????

I am running 2 hyperion 30 amp Titan series speed controllers. they have 5 volt 3amp bec's. do i have to disable one or can i run them both at the same time???? I feel that if i could run them at the same time i would never have to worry about a bec over heat situation as i am only running analog mini servoes( tunrigy 1800a). The biggest one is a Hitec 225 for the elevators.

any help greatly appreciated

darryl
Use a UBEC. Those internal BEC's aint gonna cut it.
I run the Pentium 60a's and they got hot as hell w/o it.
Every airliner owner will tell you to use one.
Read LK2TNKR's posts on here.He "had" one of the prettiest airliners.. See what no UBEC did for him.
Naval Warfare is offline Find More Posts by Naval Warfare
Reply With Quote
Old Nov 03, 2009, 02:48 PM
Registered User
LK2TINKR's Avatar
Long Island, New York
Joined Apr 2006
374 Posts
Hey N/W,

Even though I seldom prowl these pages, my ears were burning so I looked and saw your post! Definitely true, do not rely on the internal BEC's for any kind of multi-engine project. Believe it or not, my airliner lives. It took a couple of nights with the glue and some light-weight spackle and she was back. I have logged well over a 100 flights on her up until last summer. One of the aileron servo's burnt out during a flight in a slightly up position, it made for an interesting approach and landing. When I found the time to fix it, I also found that the nose wheel steering servo was missing a few teeth and would not return to neutral from a right turn so back it went into the rework pile which is where it sits today. I will definitely fix it soon, I hope.

I did of course, fit a 10 amp UBEC after my famous landing and have never used an internal BEC on any builds since. Most of my builds involve retracts, flaps and other moving parts, so UBEC's are mandatory anyway but on a multi-engine bird, even if it's just ailerons and elevators for servo's, the separate BEC is a must to avoid single engine situations. The liposhield set up that ala722 is using is even better than just the UBEC. I'm slowly getting in gear with another multi-engine project and hope to start posting progress soon.

LK2TINKR
LK2TINKR is offline Find More Posts by LK2TINKR
Reply With Quote
Old Nov 03, 2009, 06:28 PM
Screw the wind, let's fly!
Naval Warfare's Avatar
Lawrenceville, Ga
Joined Feb 2008
2,722 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by LK2TINKR View Post
Hey N/W,

Even though I seldom prowl these pages, my ears were burning so I looked and saw your post! Definitely true, do not rely on the internal BEC's for any kind of multi-engine project. Believe it or not, my airliner lives. It took a couple of nights with the glue and some light-weight spackle and she was back. I have logged well over a 100 flights on her up until last summer. One of the aileron servo's burnt out during a flight in a slightly up position, it made for an interesting approach and landing. When I found the time to fix it, I also found that the nose wheel steering servo was missing a few teeth and would not return to neutral from a right turn so back it went into the rework pile which is where it sits today. I will definitely fix it soon, I hope.

I did of course, fit a 10 amp UBEC after my famous landing and have never used an internal BEC on any builds since. Most of my builds involve retracts, flaps and other moving parts, so UBEC's are mandatory anyway but on a multi-engine bird, even if it's just ailerons and elevators for servo's, the separate BEC is a must to avoid single engine situations. The liposhield set up that ala722 is using is even better than just the UBEC. I'm slowly getting in gear with another multi-engine project and hope to start posting progress soon.

LK2TINKR
I'm glad to hear she's back. I hated to use you as an example but it was the best example of a gorgeous plane, brought down by one stinkin cheapo part.Made me sick to watch that. Really.
We sure would like to see any of your new handy work. Stick around and help us by posting your ideas.. Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery ya know. Keep up the great work and post more often if ya can.Thanks
Nav
Naval Warfare is offline Find More Posts by Naval Warfare
Last edited by Naval Warfare; Nov 04, 2009 at 10:38 PM.
Reply With Quote
Old Nov 04, 2009, 07:20 AM
Registered User
Joined Nov 2005
26 Posts
Shes ready

Okay well last night i go a chance to finish up the girl and i also had a chance to run it up. I installed a 3a/max 5amp BEC and disabled the internal ones.

First run up i found that i had reversed one engine so i fixed that and then installed my WATT meter my findings are as follows

2 fully charged 2200mah 3cell in parallel 12.54volts
WATTS at full throttle ( a slow roll into full throrrle) ++++627WATTS
AMPS """""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""" """""""""""""""""57.7 AMPS
how are these numbers to what you guys are getting?????

Found that there was jut a little rubbing on the one motor and it does sound like the fans are in sink at WOT but there is a small amount of resenating at about 1/4 stick. is this normal ?:confused:

all in all it appears to be okay. The weather is to be okay this weekend up here so it will get its maiden on FRI,Sat
just have to set up throws and balance and we are off to the races( oopps wrong hobby ) sorry i mean the maiden .LOL
warhawk69 is offline Find More Posts by warhawk69
Reply With Quote
Old Nov 04, 2009, 04:50 PM
Screw the wind, let's fly!
Naval Warfare's Avatar
Lawrenceville, Ga
Joined Feb 2008
2,722 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by warhawk69 View Post
Okay well last night i go a chance to finish up the girl and i also had a chance to run it up. I installed a 3a/max 5amp BEC and disabled the internal ones.

First run up i found that i had reversed one engine so i fixed that and then installed my WATT meter my findings are as follows

2 fully charged 2200mah 3cell in parallel 12.54volts
WATTS at full throttle ( a slow roll into full throrrle) ++++627WATTS
AMPS """""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""" """""""""""""""""57.7 AMPS
how are these numbers to what you guys are getting?????

Found that there was jut a little rubbing on the one motor and it does sound like the fans are in sink at WOT but there is a small amount of resenating at about 1/4 stick. is this normal ?:confused:



all in all it appears to be okay. The weather is to be okay this weekend up here so it will get its maiden on FRI,Sat
just have to set up throws and balance and we are off to the races( oopps wrong hobby ) sorry i mean the maiden .LOL
does it sound like this?
B-777 award winning light setup. (1 min 0 sec)


or this
Boeing777 R/C Maiden Flights (9 min 28 sec)



[Provided your in parallel, then the numbers are fine.Divide those by 2, thats what the motors are doin.

ie 30a and 300w+ per side

O, if you watch the maidens, it ends before you see the results of the 4th and last attempt at landing in that gale of a x wind.
Here it is...42 seconds of .....
Boeing 777 RC Extreme Crosswind Landing (0 min 42 sec)
Naval Warfare is offline Find More Posts by Naval Warfare
Last edited by Naval Warfare; Nov 04, 2009 at 09:58 PM.
Reply With Quote
Old Nov 05, 2009, 02:19 AM
Registered User
San Jose, CA
Joined May 2004
432 Posts
Music, pure and simple...

Hey NW, where are the vids of the NEW Delta scheme???

A
ala722 is offline Find More Posts by ala722
Reply With Quote
Old Nov 05, 2009, 04:04 PM
Registered User
Joined Nov 2005
26 Posts
sUCCES

Well yesterday was beautiful so i rushed out to the field and maidened her. Before i left i had to balance her and i needed to put 1oz of lead on her. Is this what you guys are needing to get her to balance at 5 1/2 inches ???

anyways took her out and did about 30 sec. of ground control and then slowly mashed the throttle. well she was airborn in about 50-80ft and i hadn't even really tried to lift her. i found that with the lead on the tail she was a bit tail heavy so i trimed here out and she had a little role fixed that and i was good to go. Flew it for a bit just straight and level and then decided to try a ailerion role holy S$^t is this thing slow. OOOPPPSS on low rates. tried it again and a little better on high but not by much. I set my timer for 5 minutes and by this time i needed to land so lined her up and GGGGGGGRRRRRRRRREEEEEEEAAAAAAASSSSSEEEDDDD IT This thing land like a trainer.

As far as power it is good but i was expecting a little more. It will stay the way it is and it will become my sunday flyer.
our weather is to be good the next couple days so i hope to fly her again.



NAVEL WARFARE

the motors sound like your first vid up to say 1/4 throttle (holding the plane) but at wide open they sound in sink like the second video.

any help greatly apperciated
warhawk69 is offline Find More Posts by warhawk69
Reply With Quote
Old Nov 06, 2009, 04:20 PM
Die Meistertinkerer
Frankensteen's Avatar
United States, GA, Columbus
Joined Jan 2006
486 Posts
nacelle avaialble

Arnold,
I read that you are in need of a nacelle-
You are welcome to the spare one I have here. I'm a scarce poster here, but have a question for the group.
I've converted my airliner to represent a KC10 Extender, to include shortening the fuse behind the wing by 3 inches. She looks great in air force gray with custom printed decals, etc, but I have yet to remaiden because after getting her balanced I fear the 3 e-flite 400bl motors are not up to the task. I'm looking for the best motor out there to replace them with. Do you all think the wicked 4000kv motor and pentium 60 escs would be worth the $ upgrade? I'd like to stay with 66mm fans since my custom rear nacelle wont accept 70mm, and am concerned about running different motors front and back. I'm trying to stay with 3s, and no more than 6000mah. help!
Jody
Frankensteen is offline Find More Posts by Frankensteen
Reply With Quote
Old Nov 06, 2009, 09:46 PM
Screw the wind, let's fly!
Naval Warfare's Avatar
Lawrenceville, Ga
Joined Feb 2008
2,722 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frankensteen View Post
Arnold,
I read that you are in need of a nacelle-
You are welcome to the spare one I have here. I'm a scarce poster here, but have a question for the group.
I've converted my airliner to represent a KC10 Extender, to include shortening the fuse behind the wing by 3 inches. She looks great in air force gray with custom printed decals, etc, but I have yet to remaiden because after getting her balanced I fear the 3 e-flite 400bl motors are not up to the task. I'm looking for the best motor out there to replace them with. Do you all think the wicked 4000kv motor and pentium 60 escs would be worth the $ upgrade? I'd like to stay with 66mm fans since my custom rear nacelle wont accept 70mm, and am concerned about running different motors front and back. I'm trying to stay with 3s, and no more than 6000mah. help!
Jody
Those are the motors I use in my YT videos. I'm also getting the original 6 blade SF fans That it originally came from SF with, from extremerc australia, as I'm not even using half its potential..I clocked mine as it is now with the dons wicked 4000 and 60a pentiums, at 70mph.Inflight about 25a @ 250W per motor.Its got plenty of gas. Especially if you stay 25c Batts or greater.30c is awesome.
It is a lot easier to fly than I ever dared dream it would.
Please send pic of custom nacelle.Thanks

Good Luck Shipmate
Nav
Naval Warfare is offline Find More Posts by Naval Warfare
Reply With Quote
Old Nov 07, 2009, 08:47 PM
Registered User
San Jose, CA
Joined May 2004
432 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frankensteen View Post
Arnold,
I read that you are in need of a nacelle-
You are welcome to the spare one I have here. I'm a scarce poster here, but have a question for the group.
I've converted my airliner to represent a KC10 Extender, to include shortening the fuse behind the wing by 3 inches. She looks great in air force gray with custom printed decals, etc, but I have yet to remaiden because after getting her balanced I fear the 3 e-flite 400bl motors are not up to the task. I'm looking for the best motor out there to replace them with. Do you all think the wicked 4000kv motor and pentium 60 escs would be worth the $ upgrade? I'd like to stay with 66mm fans since my custom rear nacelle wont accept 70mm, and am concerned about running different motors front and back. I'm trying to stay with 3s, and no more than 6000mah. help!
Jody
Jody, This may sound weird here in the world of "more power is better", but
the original E-Flite edf400 3500KV motors worked well. If you have three of
then, you are getting 34% more thrust than the stock twin. If I were you,
I would simply go with the originals you already have installed first. Then,
once she is tuned and sorted out, consider an upgrade to either the 420's
or the Wicked motors. The most important thing here is to get the CG
correct for your configuration. You probably already know about balancing
the fans and since you have three, it becomes even more critical.

With three fans, I think she will surprise you. You can also push the 400
3500KV motors to 4S if you stay with the stock 3 blade impeller. That
might even help offset the motor in the tail weight for cg.

Arnold

Sure, if you have ONE nacelle, I could sure use it. These will not be back
in stock at Horizon until after December! I think most of that nacelle is still
sprinkled all over Paso Robles, CA... Please Zap me a PM with details...


Good shot of speed control locations...
ala722 is offline Find More Posts by ala722
Last edited by ala722; Nov 07, 2009 at 09:46 PM.
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools

Similar Threads
Category Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Discussion NEW E-flite Super Airliner Jim T. Graham Product Announcements 31 Apr 10, 2008 11:13 PM
Video E-flite Super airliner, grass field dogon1013 Electric Plane Talk 3 May 01, 2007 11:58 AM
Discussion E-Flite SUPER AIRLINER TRASMITTER SET UP FedericoA Foamy EDFs 0 Oct 31, 2006 12:59 PM
Sold E-flite Super Airliner Cheap shschon Aircraft - Electric - Jets (FS/W) 5 Sep 28, 2006 04:29 AM
Discussion E-Flite Super Airliner DF - Edgewater Video RktMan North Coast Electric Flyers 5 Jul 06, 2006 08:19 PM