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Old May 29, 2006, 09:58 PM
Bi-Planes
Tim Farrar's Avatar
Houston Texas
Joined Apr 2006
1,589 Posts
Build Log
Bristol F2B Build

This is my first build thread, It is for the Flair Bristol F2B, Actually I already have it framed up and some covered.
I didnt know about these build threads when I started, but I would like to start now, getting ideals from you and shareing ideals with you.
Ill have to just post pictures of what Ive got done and put the footnotes in the bottem.

Ill start with a few pictures tonight and if anyone wants to reply, please do,
Everyone is welcome with coments and pictures of any kind.

SEEYA , TIM

Oh! And sorry for things being so out of order, but I havnt known computers long and when trying to get them in order, it was just to hard. It will be better when I get to the point Im at with the plane.
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Old May 30, 2006, 01:38 AM
Registered User
mRqS's Avatar
Venray, The Netherlands
Joined Oct 2003
172 Posts
Hey,

Great flyer! Looks beautiful.
I had a Flair F2b some time ago.

If you can, reinforce metal tube and horn, because it likes to twist (because of quite big elevators).

Here it is: http://rc.marekszulen.net/bristol.html
it flew great with Magnum 4stroke XL.91 engine and 14x7 prop.

Site is in Polish, but there a lot of pictures.

Marek
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Old May 30, 2006, 06:40 AM
North East England
Joined Feb 2004
3,181 Posts
Good start to your thread, Tim!

That's a very clever use of the roof vent for those louvres - might have been made for the job! One of the advantages of building big models is that there's a lot more items you can modify for use in them. Nice tidy servo installation too. I'm waiting to see how you did that wicker seat - are we going to get a basket-weaving lesson then?

Steve
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Old May 30, 2006, 05:15 PM
Bi-Planes
Tim Farrar's Avatar
Houston Texas
Joined Apr 2006
1,589 Posts
Steve :

Ill go back there in a few minutes and gather up the stuff to show off the wicker seat.
That really struck me funny when you ask if your going to get a basket weaving lesson.
But remember, On the louvers, I cant take total credit, My friend John Norwood give me the ideal. On the other hand I could (NOT) tell him about the thread and take the credit. LOL Also I dont think he has a computer. He is a caveman like me. LOL

SEEYA , TIM
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Old May 30, 2006, 06:45 PM
Bi-Planes
Tim Farrar's Avatar
Houston Texas
Joined Apr 2006
1,589 Posts
Marek :

Man do we have to talk. We got more in common. Is that the Mead 114 telescope ?
I got that one too. I like dogs too, I got three. Four counting my neighbors.

You have a really nice build thread, I would have done mine like that if I had known of them when I started my Bristol.

Im using the Saito .91 and the 14x6 Scimitar prop, I sanded it down and varnished it and painted those metal blade protecter things on. LOL

Does the metal tube and horn really twist ? I might try to split a piece of brass tube and put around it as good as I can to help.

Where did you get that machine gun ? You didnt make it did you ? It is nice.

On my exhaust I am going to try and make a scale one out of copper or brass tubeing. I dont know for sure just yet what Im going to do. Im going to let that be one of the last things. I am also makeing the wood ones just in case. LOL

I see you mounted your tank at the recomended hight, Have you had any flood problems or running out when just setting ?
The reason I ask is it looked a little high to me so I lowered mine and even after lowering it, the center of the tank is still about a 1/6" above the carb.
I really didnt lower it, I just put it on the eng. mount rails, that lowered it about 3/4".

You have a really nice plane Marek, I know it does, but I just want to hear it. Does it just float by at almost o mile an hour. Thats what I cant wait to do, just fly by and watch it go down the runway about 4 foot in the air.

SEEYA , TIM
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Old May 30, 2006, 09:21 PM
Bi-Planes
Tim Farrar's Avatar
Houston Texas
Joined Apr 2006
1,589 Posts
Steve:

Here is the information on the wicker seat, or I should say cheater wicker seat.
In the picture I did a quicky with balsa, but I used 1/64 ply in the plane for the back of the seat.

(1) Take 1/64" ply and cut it in the shape you want for the back of the seat, Mark what ever pattern you want for your holes and cut them out with a hole punch.
(2) Cut out the bottem of the seat, basically a half round circle or what ever size you want. I used lite ply for this, but balsa would due.
(3) If you want the seat to lean back some, you will have to cut a arch out of the bottem of the seat back, Like the black line I drawed on the bottem of the seat back in the picture.
(4) Glue the seat back around the bottem.
(5) Put the magic mesh tape around the seat back inside and out, glue in place,it is sticky but it wont stay.
(Magic mesh tape is some tape I found at a craft store) its in the picture.
(6) Trim the edge of the mesh tape around the seat back.
(7) Put 1/16" cockpit coaming around the seat back edge.
(8) Glue the cockpit coaming to the seat back. Use a needle and thread, and sew the cockpit coaming to the seat back. Its not that hard, I used a needle nose plyers to push the needle through.
(9) Stain the seat and when dry thin down some epoxy with alcohol and coat the hole thing. The reason I coated it with epoxy is the Magic Mesh tape is sticky on both sides and the epoxy kills that stickyness.

I hope everyone can bennifit from this, I love to share ideals.

SEEYA , TIM
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Old May 31, 2006, 04:47 AM
North East England
Joined Feb 2004
3,181 Posts
Very clever, Tim. I actually have something similar to that mesh tape, but it's made from very thin rubber and you put it under things to stop them sliding about - never thought of using it for wicker seats though. Keep those excellent pics coming.

Steve
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Old May 31, 2006, 07:05 AM
Registered User
mRqS's Avatar
Venray, The Netherlands
Joined Oct 2003
172 Posts
Hey Tim

Quote:
Originally Posted by timfarrar
Marek :
Man do we have to talk. We got more in common. Is that the Mead 114 telescope ? I got that one too.
haha.. yep, I've many other hobbies
No, it isn't Meade 114, It's custom made telescope (and finder):
170mm of mirror diameter and 1200mm of focal lenght.
The rest (oculars etc) is from Meade and german Soligor


Quote:
I like dogs too, I got three. Four counting my neighbors.
My dog is quite old, but behaves like a puppy He likes rc models. Last weekend he have watched rc's whose day on our airfield

[qyote] You have a really nice build thread, I would have done mine like that if I had known of them when I started my Bristol.[/quote]

Thanks. I started my building threads because of lack of this kind of site's (about models I build).
My newest threads are in english as well (http://rc.marekszulen.net) - many models are already in "archive".

Quote:
Im using the Saito .91 and the 14x6 Scimitar prop, I sanded it down and varnished it and painted those metal blade protecter things on. LOL
I had the same prop on the beginning but broke it because... I didn't expected that great flying capabilities of Bristol.
It didn't wanted to land and touched ground 5m before an obstackle


Quote:
Does the metal tube and horn really twist ? I might try to split a piece of brass tube and put around it as good as I can to help.
Yes, it really tends to twist. Many times after arriving to the airfield I noticed, that elevator halves are not on the same level.
It wasn't caused by soldering (I used a hard -torch- solder instead of silver one - the tailskid was silver soldered), but because a tube twisted.



Quote:
Where did you get that machine gun ? You didnt make it did you ? It is nice.
If I remember it's made by Williams.

Quote:
On my exhaust I am going to try and make a scale one out of copper or brass tubeing. I dont know for sure just yet what Im going to do. Im going to let that be one of the last things. I am also makeing the wood ones just in case. LOL
I thought about it as well, but left this idea, because at that moment I didn't had any flyable mode on hand, so I was a little bit in hurry

Quote:
I see you mounted your tank at the recomended hight, Have you had any flood problems or running out when just setting ?
The reason I ask is it looked a little high to me so I lowered mine and even after lowering it, the center of the tank is still about a 1/6" above the carb.
I really didnt lower it, I just put it on the eng. mount rails, that lowered it about 3/4".
No, I didn't had any problems

Quote:
You have a really nice plane Marek, I know it does, but I just want to hear it. Does it just float by at almost o mile an hour. Thats what I cant wait to do, just fly by and watch it go down the runway about 4 foot in the air.
SEEYA , TIM
Thanks
Yes, it realy does It's why I broke my prob on a maiden flight
And it climbs rapidly. The "bad side" is that it's really wind sensitive.
My weighted ab. 9 lbs, so it was ab. 25g/dm2 (less than many sailplanes).

cheers

Marek
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Old May 31, 2006, 06:02 PM
Bi-Planes
Tim Farrar's Avatar
Houston Texas
Joined Apr 2006
1,589 Posts
Marek :

Thanks for your post, Im going to have to see what I can do about that elevator horn twist. I dont want any problems.
Yes, I know about the wind all to well, Ive been flying a Flair Sopwith Pup for about 3 years now and I had one pretty bad crash do to it. My Sopwith weights 8 lbs with 60" wing span and it looks like my Bristol is going to be about 9 lbs with 77" wing span, so it will be the same in the wind or worse because of the wing area.
It may turn out 9 1/2 lbs, but that still isnt much for that wing area.

Thanks again for the tip on the elevator horns tube thing twist.
Ill probably check out your new site tomarrow maybe, Im going to try to get a little done on the plane and maybe post some more tonight, I still got alot to post in this thread to get caught up to where Im at on the plane.

SEEYA , TIM
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Old May 31, 2006, 07:26 PM
Bi-Planes
Tim Farrar's Avatar
Houston Texas
Joined Apr 2006
1,589 Posts
Steve :

Thanks for checking my ideals out.
What I do sometimes is, Ill go into a craft store and look around and get ideals on how to make stuff and buy stuff to make it.
For what ever, the cockpit insides, guns, bombs, seat, just walk around and look.
I look around at toy stores for pilots, any kind of cheaply made doll that dont weigh anything. The pilots for my Bristol cost .99 cents (USD).
I saved a bundle on that seat and instrument panel in my Bristol, You can buy it at this website http://www.3seabees.com/index.html but it cost $125.00 (USD) and I think mine looks better.

SEEYA , TIM
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Old May 31, 2006, 09:05 PM
It actually Flies!
Float Flyer's Avatar
Salmon Arm, British Columbia, Canada
Joined Feb 2006
548 Posts
Hi Tim,

Joining in here late, but wow, what a build!

I love the mesh tape idea. I usually wonder through the Craft Store as well to get the ideas going. I always find something I need in the Beading area such as silver or gold crimps for holding control lines together or great nylon coated scale cable as beading wire. Some unique tools as well. I go to Michael's up here in Canada. Don't know if you have that store down there.

Your attention to detail is great! I wish I could add that much detail to my lightweight models without the weight gain.

Keep the great ideas coming.
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Old May 31, 2006, 11:30 PM
Bi-Planes
Tim Farrar's Avatar
Houston Texas
Joined Apr 2006
1,589 Posts
Float flyer :

We had Micheals, but it closed down for some reason, we still have Hobby Lobby.
Thats funny, the last time I was there I was looking at those nylon coated cables, there pretty cheap until you look at the 40 strand, those are pretty high.

Im supposed to be trying to get my thread caught up to my plane sense I started it late, but tonight I worked on my plane a little.

Here is what I did and thanks for looking and your commints

SEEYA , TIM




I just thought, I should have given a picture of the leather work around the covering on the real plane so you could compare with my simulation.
And I need to give some credit to my friend Tommy for helping me come up with the ideal. ( THANKS TOMMY )

I hope everyone catches this update !

SEEYA , TIM
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Old Jun 01, 2006, 02:25 AM
Registered User
mRqS's Avatar
Venray, The Netherlands
Joined Oct 2003
172 Posts
Tim,

What can I add:

Bristol flew a bit strange when balanced as per plans (related with rudder - described below), so I moved cg more forward.

what else about F2b:
Rudder is a must for turns. If not - tail fails down into inside of a turn - it was more noticeable when balanced as per plans.
Quite strange wing mounting : I'My impression is, that almost every time I got a bit different angles (due to flexibility of wings).
On the ground, rudder is not so effective, but it's a scale model with a small rudder

And one of most important things (which is sometimes a bad thing, because you can't fly): it makes "oohhs" and "aahhs" every time you arrive on airfield

Marek
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Old Jun 01, 2006, 04:11 PM
Bi-Planes
Tim Farrar's Avatar
Houston Texas
Joined Apr 2006
1,589 Posts
Marek:

Man! I see you know quite a bit about computers, Those are some real impresive websites. The darker background brings out the pictures so good, it some how makes it more interesting.
I have the Corsair also, but I cheated a little on that one, I got the Hanger 9 ARF. I beleave it probably flys better than I could have done myself.
I like that Spitfire too, you did a nice job there.
Your 330L is really nice too, You can really build.
You can tell your friend Jesus' is really proud of his Pitts, ( I would be too )
I like your friend Zenons Vicomte, but I hate what happen to it. Has he made funneral arangements yet? For real though, it was nice.

On the Bristol :
When you mension the wings seem to line up a little different each time you put them on.
Does it just require a little aileron trim to correct it ? Just wondering because there isnt anything I can do about it.
I thought of something about the elevator horn tube twist. You used a small tourch. Do you think you might have got it to hot ?
I think if brass tubeing is gotten to hot, It looses some of its strength.
Wishful thinking on my part, Im still going to look at it and see if there is something I can do to decrease the posibility of it happening.

New Question : ( For anyone that knows )

The screws that mount the wings are 6ba.
Do you or anyone know where I can find 6ba socket head screws ?
The screws that come with the kit are flat blade head screws.
Its to late to use different nuts, I didnt snap to it and I have already soldered all 26 6ba nuts in place.
What screws and nuts did you use Marek ?
I might have to try and tapp out the nuts to 4-40 or 3mm, but that will be hard because the strut end brakets lay right on the wings, One good thing is I havnt covered them yet.

Marek :

Im going to use this post to you to tell a little more about my build and Ill post some pictures of the nut and bolt problem I am haveing.

Man! I tried and tried, but I just cant take a picture of a screw, Its to blurry up close and to small far away!!!! , But Im sure you all know what a socket head screw looks like, I need a 6ba socket head screw, 50 of them would be nice, so I could drop them and not worry if I cant find them.

SEEYA, TIM
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Old Jun 01, 2006, 05:02 PM
Bi-Planes
Tim Farrar's Avatar
Houston Texas
Joined Apr 2006
1,589 Posts
Marek:

I looked at your soldering again and the brass tube doesnt appear to be discolored like it would be if you had gotten it to hot.
Im going to have to give that issue some attension.
Trouble is, I cant really think of anything just yet.

SEYA , TIM
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