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Old Nov 15, 2006, 11:18 AM
Off 2 The Edge of Reality
TeamTEOR's Avatar
Scottsdale, AZ
Joined Sep 2003
7,479 Posts
Hey Aussie, nice looking moth. That aftermarket gear looks pretty strong too, looks like a hobbyzone set. I guess there is a shortage of microballoons down under? Did you try the local hardware store? I have heard people using talc powder as well.
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Old Nov 15, 2006, 01:51 PM
My first Build
radralph's Avatar
Vancouver WA
Joined Jul 2006
973 Posts
What are microballoons and what is their use? This has been bugging me for a while!!!
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Old Nov 15, 2006, 02:16 PM
Been There! Done That!
boomerace's Avatar
Eugene, Oregon, United States
Joined Sep 2001
19,187 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by radralph
What are microballoons and what is their use? This has been bugging me for a while!!!
Microballoons are tiny little beads of glass that look like powder. You can use them as a filler in Epoxy or shape a small amount in a balsa joint and hit with thin CA and they make a very strong fillet.
boomer
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Old Nov 15, 2006, 02:41 PM
Always room for improvement...
der Oberflügel's Avatar
Schertz, TX
Joined Jun 2004
847 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by radralph
What are microballoons and what is their use? This has been bugging me for a while!!!
As seen on "Mythbusers"!!!!

Well, for use in a concrete glider anyway....

Boomerace nailed it for our useage.
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Old Nov 15, 2006, 02:46 PM
My first Build
radralph's Avatar
Vancouver WA
Joined Jul 2006
973 Posts
What if...

So would that work for something likegusseting a stick mount? Off topic huh?
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Old Nov 15, 2006, 03:14 PM
Forever WTTM Pilot #7
Buzz's Avatar
Daytona Beach, Florida, United States
Joined Aug 2002
11,314 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Doug Sipprell
Hmm....maybe that better explains the 25 ft max altitude. Could it be just a slight miscalculation.....and the real figure is......2500 feet!!
HAHAHAHAHA! Yes, with math like I just demonstrated.... there's no telling how high it really flies. I guess I figured that since I have to fly UNDER power lines.... it couldn't be much higher than that. LOL!


[QUOTE}Well, I absolutely did, and I want you to know I resemble every bit of it!!!
[/QUOTE]

You're a good sport, Doug. I really enjoy your posts.

Quote:
Cloak: We are fast becoming indebted to you. First the resurrection of the WTTM website, and now the compilation of the Tiger Moth modifications. Such committment by one with an already very busy schedule. I can't help but be a little embarrassed for not having been more helpful myself. It's folks like you and a hand full of others such as BC, Keith, Kitty, Buzz, and others whose names escape my dwindling memory, that have really nurtured and helped further the "cause". Many thanks from this end of the swamp.

RD
I couldn't agree more. Cloak, you're doing a great job and a great service to fellow Mother's. I did help out in the WTTM when the plane was stolen.... and I was happy to contribute the time and money for the cause. Do you want the pictures of the WTTM being released from jail in Kahoka, Mo?
I talked the police there into sending me pics of them letting it out of jail.
I think it might add to the overall story on that site. There are many others who continue to contribute to the tour.... but after such a scare, it turned out to be really funny.

In this site about mods, you are making is so easy for new comers to get all the good stuff I don't know how you find the time to do it. You're a very smart young man! Thank you from all of us for your diligence!

Buzz
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Old Nov 15, 2006, 03:26 PM
Forever WTTM Pilot #7
Buzz's Avatar
Daytona Beach, Florida, United States
Joined Aug 2002
11,314 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by der Oberflügel
As seen on "Mythbusers"!!!!

Well, for use in a concrete glider anyway....

Boomerace nailed it for our useage.
I saw that show! Concrete gliders fly like a lump of concrete.

Radralph... no, you are not off topic at all. That's a very legitimate question.
But, why are you using it on your gussets? I'm no expert on microballoons... but it seems like gussets would work fine if you just CA or epoxy them in place.
Are you using them for strength or cosmetics. I think in either case they might make the joint a bit stronger. Someone step in here..... I seldom use them myself.
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Old Nov 15, 2006, 03:32 PM
Been There! Done That!
boomerace's Avatar
Eugene, Oregon, United States
Joined Sep 2001
19,187 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Buzz
I saw that show! Concrete gliders fly like a lump of concrete.

Radralph... no, you are not off topic at all. That's a very legitimate question.
But, why are you using it on your gussets? I'm no expert on microballoons... but it seems like gussets would work fine if you just CA or epoxy them in place.
Are you using them for strength or cosmetics. I think in either case they might make the joint a bit stronger. Someone step in here..... I seldom use them myself.
Buzz,
They can be used in place of gussets. They just make a very strong small gusset. I usually use balsa however but for joints not shown needing gussets they do make the joint bullet proof particularly if the joint isn't too good! (of course this never happens when I build)
boomer
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Old Nov 16, 2006, 02:30 AM
My first Build
radralph's Avatar
Vancouver WA
Joined Jul 2006
973 Posts
I was asking as a what if..... I've used thick and thin CA, epoxy, and hot glue but never microballoons. Strength would be an objective. Is that the only reason for MB use?

Ralph
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Old Nov 16, 2006, 06:09 AM
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althulas's Avatar
Banbury,Oxfordshire,UK
Joined May 2002
567 Posts
MB are great with epoxy, less drying time and a stonger filling joint, if you run out of MB try using talcum powder, used it with epoxy for the fillit joints on the tm wings.
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Old Nov 16, 2006, 07:31 AM
KLH
Pack Rat
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Hayward CA / Valley Springs CA USA
Joined Jan 2001
1,778 Posts
You can also use Baking Soda, but it's not as fine grained as MB or Talcum powder so getting a smooth joint isn't as easy.
I've used it for some field repairs where I wasn't to concerned with looks, but just wanted to get back in the air.

Kern
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Old Nov 16, 2006, 01:09 PM
My first Build
radralph's Avatar
Vancouver WA
Joined Jul 2006
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Hoohoo. Bondo for foam!
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Old Nov 16, 2006, 01:41 PM
Registered User
United States, WA, Bonney Lake
Joined Jun 2005
179 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by radralph
I was asking as a what if..... I've used thick and thin CA, epoxy, and hot glue but never microballoons. Strength would be an objective. Is that the only reason for MB use?

Ralph
Epoxy with microballoons is lighter than without. I don't have specific numbers, but the reduction in strength (if any) is minimal compared to the reduction in weight. Also, until it sets up, epoxy mixed with microballoons is "thicker", ie, more viscous, so it's less prone to running.
The important thing is to mix the epoxy first, then add the microballoons, because if you wet a surface with only resin or hardener, the other component won't penetrate all the way and the resulting joint will be weak.
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Old Nov 16, 2006, 03:53 PM
Forever WTTM Pilot #7
Buzz's Avatar
Daytona Beach, Florida, United States
Joined Aug 2002
11,314 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by radralph
I was asking as a what if..... I've used thick and thin CA, epoxy, and hot glue but never microballoons. Strength would be an objective. Is that the only reason for MB use?

Ralph
No, Microballoons are also used as fillets.... you can fill areas with them to blend a surface. That's the only reason I've ever used them. Your comment about "Bondo" is about right! <grin>

Hey, Boomer! Thanks for the additional info! I don't even know why you bother buying them. I've only used them on balsa....

I had a dream last night that I built the fastest Tiger Moth on earth! I have kidney stones so I get delerious when I dream! <g> The plane I built in this dream was a 3D Moth ...ailerons and way beefed up with carbon fiber. The wings had been clipped very short and the struts were made of carbon fiber as were the wing wires! It had a huge brushless motor and I was doing outrageous stunts (way above 25ft.) I can still visualize it as if it were real!
It would roll out about 3 ft. on take off, then go straight up in a tight roll. I made pass after pass with it and it sounded like the end of the world when it went by. It must have been going at least 80mph....INVERTED!!! I could take it straight up to about 500ft. and then I'd cut the power and let it tumble... I was giving it left rudder, and right aileron, and it was falling and tumbling fast! At about ...ahem.... 30 ft. I'd let it go neutral and it would straighten out and come over my head just screaming!

I woke up in a sweat! I sat up in bed and at 4:30am today.... I decided I was going to build it!!! I am! I know there's a lot of drag... I know it will be difficult...there will have to be little or no dihedral, and wings will be clipped so it has to reach a high speed to even gain lift. It will be heavy.

Have I gone crazy? Nope! I want the fastest 3D Moth in captivity! If the truth be known, my Urologist put me on some strong narcotic pain killers. I am high as a dang kite!! If my warehouse blew up, I'd probably just laugh! LOL! But, I just ordered the 3D Moth... that's how serious I am. I have no idea what I'm getting into.... but I don't think this has been done before. A racing Moth!

I wonder what I'll dream about tonight! lol....

OK, Doug.... let's hear it! Hahahahaha! Whew! I'm ok, really!

Buzz
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Old Nov 16, 2006, 04:37 PM
Rich
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USA, SC, Lexington
Joined Sep 2001
1,134 Posts
And you haven't even started your white Tiger !!!!! Good grief Buzz.
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