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Old Jan 23, 2006, 11:33 AM
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Colwyn Bay, North Wales, UK
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Simple Question, Does Weight Affect Wind Handling?

Hi,
Title says it all really, pretty simple question...

But Im guessing the answer(s?) wont be quite as simple , as it may depend on the plane e.t.c.?

For eample, if I used (heavier) Nimhs instead of Lipos in my flying Wing (SuperFly-E), would it be less affected by the wind?
Or those little micros, obviously they dont take wind well, but is it due to thier size, or thier weight, or both?
And again, 3D. Is heavier better for breezes?


Any input will be appreciated

Cheers, Duane
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Old Jan 23, 2006, 12:10 PM
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United States, CA, Orange
Joined Jun 2003
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More weight AND power help in the wind.

The problem I have with my wing is, the as the winds pick up they will tend to flatten the wing in a bank. Slope flyers usually add more weight known as "ballast" to the CG if the lift (breeze) is high.
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Old Jan 23, 2006, 12:18 PM
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I think drag is the main factor in the wind, not weight.
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Old Jan 23, 2006, 12:23 PM
Turn down for what?
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United States, IN, Indianapolis
Joined Feb 2004
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Speed is what you want in the wind. Adding weight increases your planes wingloading. This increases the stall speed.

If you have the extra batteries, just try it out to see how it works for you.

We add weight to gliders all the time in windy conditions.

Ryan
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Old Jan 23, 2006, 01:23 PM
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Actually, wind is only apparent to the pilot . The plane always whats to go with the wind (air). The wind only becomes apparent when the pilot whats to keep the plane flying in relationship to his point or the point he whats to get to, on the ground.
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Old Jan 23, 2006, 06:54 PM
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Media, Pa/Blacksburg Va
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yeah, but if the wind is 15 miles per hour, and your flying a tigermoth with a top speed of 5 mph, the plane is always heading downwind at beeween 10 and 20 mph, so more speed would probably be usefull to you.
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Old Jan 23, 2006, 07:32 PM
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Actually what matters is wing loading.
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Old Jan 23, 2006, 07:41 PM
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ya it is wingloading that makes the difference.

My .40 ultrastick is way over powered and much too heavy for its own good. But because of that i can fly it in 20mph + winds with almost no problem. Even landings really arent an issue.

On the other hand, my Funtana 90, which is a MUCH larger plane, and is quite a bit heavier really doesnt like wind because of its wingloading..which is very low for such a large plane...
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Old Jan 23, 2006, 08:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HarleyDog
Actually, wind is only apparent to the pilot . The plane always whats to go with the wind (air). The wind only becomes apparent when the pilot whats to keep the plane flying in relationship to his point or the point he whats to get to, on the ground.

That's weird; when I'm riding in an airplane, I can tell when we hit wind.

Must be my imagination.
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Old Jan 23, 2006, 08:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HarleyDog
Actually, wind is only apparent to the pilot . The plane always whats to go with the wind (air). The wind only becomes apparent when the pilot whats to keep the plane flying in relationship to his point or the point he whats to get to, on the ground.
That is only true with a perfectly smooth and laminar wind. So, in practice, its often not true at all.

This is because turbulence tries to "buffet" the plane, and move it into different attitudes. Higher weight, larger wing loadings, and a bigger size will ALL help this.

--Alex
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Old Jan 24, 2006, 12:42 AM
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I thought I might get a debate on this.
Quote:
That's weird; when I'm riding in an airplane, I can tell when we hit wind.

Must be my imagination
Goatzilla
your right , it is your imagination. Like I said, it's from the point of view from the pilot. You can tell when you hit wind , but the airplane still See's the same airspeed
Quote:
That is only true with a perfectly smooth and laminar wind. So, in practice, its often not true at all.

This is because turbulence tries to "buffet" the plane, and move it into different attitudes. Higher weight, larger wing loadings, and a bigger size will ALL help this.

--Alex
That is very true, but that is turbulence, which is just variable air pressure that resides within a larger body of air (wind), which may or may not be moving in relationship to the ground. An increase in weight on a given airframe will help dampen out unwanted movement caused by uneven air pressure (turbulence) along the volume of the airframe, but adding weight, in any case, just increases stall speed.
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Old Jan 24, 2006, 06:56 AM
Giz
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Bath, UK
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HarleyDog
That is very true, but that is turbulence, which is just variable air pressure that resides within a larger body of air (wind), which may or may not be moving in relationship to the ground.
It is also true for gusting wind which is the type of wind I get all of the time. In a steady wind, you are correct in that the aircraft does not "see" it. However, a gust changes the wind speed and direction. The changed wind speed exerts a force on the aircraft causing it to accelerate in the direction of the wind but this is not instantaneous because the aircraft has mass. F = ma applies. A lighter aircraft will accelerate more quickly in the gust than a heavier one. Once the gust has gone by, the aircraft then accelerates in the opposite direction (decelerates).

The force generated by the gust will depend on the size of the surfaces that it impinges on. So lower wing loadings will tend to produce higher accelerations. Larger aeroplanes tend to have higher wing loadings because they have smaller surface areas in proportion to their volume/mass. By my calculations, the wing loading of a Boeing 747-400 is 2200 oz per sq ft . It isn't greatly affected by the type of gusts that push my park flyer around.
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Old Jan 24, 2006, 10:09 AM
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Urm, actually the gusts (changes of wind direction and speed) apply accelerations to the airframe. The amount by which these accelerations will affect the airframe (be noticeable to the pilot/passengers) depends on the amount of the acceleration (change in speed and direction) and the mass of the airframe. Good old F=ma at work, with some help from momentum.
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Old Jan 24, 2006, 10:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Giz
It is also true for gusting wind which is the type of wind I get all of the time. In a steady wind, you are correct in that the aircraft does not "see" it. However, a gust changes the wind speed and direction. The changed wind speed exerts a force on the aircraft causing it to accelerate in the direction of the wind but this is not instantaneous because the aircraft has mass. F = ma applies. A lighter aircraft will accelerate more quickly in the gust than a heavier one. Once the gust has gone by, the aircraft then accelerates in the opposite direction (decelerates).

The force generated by the gust will depend on the size of the surfaces that it impinges on. So lower wing loadings will tend to produce higher accelerations. Larger aeroplanes tend to have higher wing loadings because they have smaller surface areas in proportion to their volume/mass. By my calculations, the wing loading of a Boeing 747-400 is 2200 oz per sq ft . It isn't greatly affected by the type of gusts that push my park flyer around.
All very true, I was just knit picking the question . which ask about the way a aircraft handles wind, not wind gust or air turbulence
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Old Jan 24, 2006, 10:30 AM
Turn down for what?
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United States, IN, Indianapolis
Joined Feb 2004
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HarleyDog
All very true, I was just knit picking the question . which ask about the way a aircraft handles wind, not wind gust or air turbulence
Problem for most of us is wind causes turbulence. Unless that is you have a nice slope (and then you can have a rotor) or a very flat field without obstructions. This is one of the reasons I suggest to new pilots to fly higher than normal and keep the nose down and speed up on landing when flying in windy conditions.

Ryan
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