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Old Nov 28, 2005, 10:11 AM
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Remembering

Quote:
Originally Posted by Eco8gator
The 109 is a pretty good charger, just have to remember to check the cell count after you plug the pack in to make sure its correct
About 90 % of Li Po fires have been caused when you have to remember.
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Old Nov 28, 2005, 10:36 AM
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Dan Baldwin's Avatar
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hoppy
Wouldn't it ne neat if it beeped the cell count it selected twice before it moved on.

beep beep beep
beep beep beep

OK, it recognized my 3 cell pack correctly.
That would be better than what it does, but I think it should stop the charge if it changes the cell count, start beeping, and wait for the user to do something.

Dan
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Old Nov 28, 2005, 12:41 PM
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Yeah - best of all worlds.

beep beep beep
beep beep beep
beep beep beep


etc etc until you pushed the accept button.
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Old Nov 28, 2005, 12:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hoppy
Yeah - best of all worlds.

beep beep beep
beep beep beep
beep beep beep


etc etc until you pushed the accept button.
When it comes to LiPo charging, IMHO the machine should never be allowed to make its own decisions--at least during the cell detect mode. I agree that it ought to beep, and wait for a deliberate confirmation by the user before proceeding.

Rick
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Old Nov 28, 2005, 12:52 PM
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I believe you might get an argument from those that want to charge high cell count Lipo's where bumping the cell count in stage 1 is what you want the charger to do.

Actually, that points out the main problem that the Astro 109 has with trying to solve with the "auto cell count" for both smaller <4S and larger >4S packs.

For the high cell count packs the ASTRO is safer than a user set cell count, but for the small packs that does not appear to be the case.

Brad
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Old Nov 28, 2005, 01:06 PM
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So..........

Can you on record here stating that all of your chargers, lipoly packs are perfect and never cause any problems?

If not, why don't you stay away from this thread, it's about a 109 charger, nothing that FMA makes.

thanks,
Steve


Quote:
Originally Posted by Fred Marks
About 90 % of Li Po fires have been caused when you have to remember.
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Old Nov 28, 2005, 01:17 PM
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Haralson County GA. USA
Joined Oct 2004
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Due to this announcement
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/announcement.php?f=129

all are now fair game.
It looks like perhaps the only safe way to set a LiPoly charger to the correct cell count at 4 cells and greater is by way of taps.

Charles
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Old Nov 28, 2005, 01:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sjslhill
Can you on record here stating that all of your chargers, lipoly packs are perfect and never cause any problems?

If not, why don't you stay away from this thread, it's about a 109 charger, nothing that FMA makes.

thanks,
Steve
We believe that intelligent readers will see the illogic of your cynical request.

The thread has a great deal to do with all of us who sell Li Pos in just the same way as the so-called Super Brain charger does. When a fire occurs, all litigators of liability claims come at all involved and selling a charger that is known to have such a defect affects us all, including you. You wannta know how? The liability insurance premiums come right to you as an part of the price of every Li Po. I personally encountered the problem being discussed immediately after the 109 charger came out, asked Red Scholefield to confirm the fault independently and objectively which he did in the posted referenced , informed the manufacturer and spoke with the designer. We do understand the design issue: an analog pot is used to reset currrent and the microprocessor can not automatically reset current to zero after each charge is complete. We had felt that using a digital pot and reworking the software could be used to mitigate the fault. Understand that the designer is a great guy and is respected by us. Not much more we can do.
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Old Nov 28, 2005, 01:47 PM
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Nope

No, I think most intelligent readers will make their own decision on what is correct.

thanks,
Steve


Quote:
Originally Posted by Fred Marks
We believe that intelligent readers will see the illogic of your cynical request.

The thread has a great deal to do with all of us who sell Li Pos in just the same way as the so-called Super Brain charger does. When a fire occurs, all litigators of liability claims come at all involved and selling a charger that is known to have such a defect affects us all, including you. You wannta know how? The liability insurance premiums come right to you as an part of the price of every Li Po. I personally encountered the problem being discussed immediately after the 109 charger came out, asked Red Scholefield to confirm the fault independently and objectively which he did in the posted referenced , informed the manufacturer and spoke with the designer. We do understand the design issue: an analog pot is used to reset currrent and the microprocessor can not automatically reset current to zero after each charge is complete. We had felt that using a digital pot and reworking the software could be used to mitigate the fault. Understand that the designer is a great guy and is respected by us. Not much more we can do.
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Old Nov 28, 2005, 02:17 PM
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Fred, I've sent you a PM.

- RD
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Old Nov 28, 2005, 02:22 PM
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To quote from the post by the "expert" referred to above:

"I've been beating on an Astro 109 for a couple of weeks now trying to get it to change the cell count as was reported by a user. Now I have suceeded."

How did he "suceed"? Takes a FULLY CHARGED 700 mAh pack. Cranks the starting current up to 3.7 AMPS (more than 5C). Posts the inevitable result.

All very professional, by both these guys.
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Old Nov 28, 2005, 02:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Harry D
To quote from the post by the "expert" referred to above:

"I've been beating on an Astro 109 for a couple of weeks now trying to get it to change the cell count as was reported by a user. Now I have suceeded."

How did he "suceed"? Takes a FULLY CHARGED 700 mAh pack. Cranks the starting current up to 3.7 AMPS (more than 5C). Posts the inevitable result.

All very professional, by both these guys.

Actually my favorite part of that thread was that Red was given instructions on how to do that by Greg Covey, FMA Direct, Director of Marketing and Promotions.

I quess that's what you call a "Marketing Promotion" these days.

Brad
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Old Nov 28, 2005, 02:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bjpaul
I believe you might get an argument from those that want to charge high cell count Lipo's where bumping the cell count in stage 1 is what you want the charger to do.

Actually, that points out the main problem that the Astro 109 has with trying to solve with the "auto cell count" for both smaller <4S and larger >4S packs.

For the high cell count packs the ASTRO is safer than a user set cell count, but for the small packs that does not appear to be the case.

Brad
I don't know why anybody (high cell count or not) would have a problem with what we are suggesting.

All that would be necessary would be for the user to confirm the new cell count if the charger changes it. The user has to stand there for the first 3 minutes anyway, doesn't he?

Bob could change the firmware so that the user would just have to turn the current all the way down and wait for a few seconds until the charger beeps to let him know that it saw his acceptance of the new count, then he turns the current back up. Bob wouldn't have to add a button, so no hardware mods. Bob could also make the new chip available for anybody that wanted to upgrade.


Dan
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Old Nov 28, 2005, 02:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan Baldwin
I don't know why anybody (high cell count or not) would have a problem with what we are suggesting.
Dan
Dan, all I am pointing out is that bumping the cell count in stage 1 for high cell count Lipo's is exactly what the charger was designed to do in stage 1.

I personally would not have a problem, but with human nature I am sure somebody will.

Brad
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Old Nov 28, 2005, 02:49 PM
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If you check this post, you will see an example of an Astro 109 jumping to the wrong cell count while charging at 1C. It includes photos of the charger before and after jumping the cell count.

Dan
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