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Old Nov 24, 2005, 01:54 AM
Will work for lift...
Flying-Addict's Avatar
Provo, Utah
Joined Jul 2004
774 Posts
Any flying advice for a newbie composite flyer?

I completed my first composite plane last week, 60" V2--Really similar to the Destiny. Got it from Tom at F3x--he's a great guy to buy from--good customer service). I threw it out on the slope ("Point of the Mountain"-Utah) and had a few good passes, needed hardly any trim at all, and the plane was flying beautifully...I finally tried to set up for a speedier pass by cutting a turn a bit...looking back now, without enough speed, I guess...the thing did a spiral of death. It just dropped out of the sky and I couldn't pull it out. I ran to the edge of the hill thinking it was going to be toast. Luckily, it landed in some soft gravel nose first...thank you gravel pit...(it was in about 6" deep). It was just sticking out like the proverbial dart. The area under the wing saddle got crunched up a bit, but I've repaired it, reinforced it, painted, and it's ready to fly again. Tough plane! I've also balanced it with a little more nose weight to increase the stability a little on the next flight.

Does anyone have any general recommendations for flying and landing approach on this type of plane?

What are the do's and don'ts when flying one of these? I guess I've already found out ONE of the don'ts...Need to keep lots of speed in the turns?

What are good throw values to set on the ailerons for a plane like this for a beginner crunchie flyer like myself? I have the elevator set at 3/16" up and down, and the spoilerons 25 deg. up when activated (I never got to try them out).

I've flown a lot of thermal planes, dlg, slope foamies, power planes over the years and have never seen such a violent tip stall in all my flying days...I'm just hoping to have a better experience this weekend and keep it one piece for a little while this time.
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Old Nov 24, 2005, 01:59 AM
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slopemeno's Avatar
Joined Jan 2003
6,932 Posts
Go easy on the elvator. My Destiny will do that little trick at the drop of a hat. You probably have too much throw. Tone it down and be aware of the warning signs (wing tip drops or plane appears to get sideways). By the way, when you get it up really high sometime, get some speed up and shove the stick into a corner...that thing will probably do some impressive flicks from the sound of things.
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Old Nov 24, 2005, 02:31 AM
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Daemon's Avatar
Lakewood, Colorado
Joined Aug 2002
28,643 Posts
Planes that small rarely give much warning when they snap stall. Just dial
your elevator rates down some, and try to keep the speed up. Think
smooth. You can still be agressive, just do it smoothly. Of course
inducing snap stalls is fun too, but do it with lots of altitude. If you've
got a rudder, you can exit the resulting spin quickly with a lot of rudder.

When it comes time to land, keep going around until you feel comfortable.
It won't hurt anything to spend a few minutes more in the air.
Forcing it down when it'd rather be flying is a sure fire way to break it.
Spoilerons (as much throw as you can get while still retaining some roll
control) usually work better than flaperons to get it down quick, but I like
to use them in combination with a good hard downwind turn
to burn off both speed and altitude, then feather the spoilerons
to control your glide slope on the upwind leg to landing.

ian
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Old Nov 24, 2005, 10:06 AM
Will work for lift...
Flying-Addict's Avatar
Provo, Utah
Joined Jul 2004
774 Posts
Thanks for the info. So, I'm going to dial the rates down a little on the elevator, keep the speed up, keep the turns smooth and take my time on the landing approach... Anyone else want to chime in? Other advice/experience?
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Old Nov 24, 2005, 10:15 AM
ARE YOU READY KIDS???
Sloper Dave's Avatar
Camarillo, California, United States
Joined Mar 2004
390 Posts
FOAM!!!

Sorry, couldn't resist...

SD
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Old Nov 24, 2005, 10:21 AM
gas tires and oil
prplgoat's Avatar
malad, idaho
Joined Dec 2004
2,450 Posts
when did you find wind at pom! i've been down there twice in two weeks and could barely fly a hlg!
come up saturday or sunday (sunday's lookin better) there will be a few of us up there if you need some help!!
join in the race if want! it's all for fun!

marty
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Old Nov 24, 2005, 10:26 AM
Permanently Banned
pinolefm1's Avatar
Joined Aug 2005
1,292 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flying-Addict
Thanks for the info. So, I'm going to dial the rates down a little on the elevator, keep the speed up, keep the turns smooth and take my time on the landing approach... Anyone else want to chime in? Other advice/experience?
Yes..next time instead of trying to "pull out of it" try pushing instead and fly out of the snap..this requires having enough air below you to work but pulling never works.

HTH

Steve
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Old Nov 24, 2005, 10:26 AM
Feeling FrSky
surfimp's Avatar
United States, CA, Santa Barbara
Joined Feb 2003
20,091 Posts
My advice, for what it's worth:

1. Faster is better. Let the plane run, don't dog it around. Easy on the elevator!

2. You gotta land it, for real! Downwind, base leg, final, flare, touchdown. That is landing. Pointing at the hill and hoping for the best is not.

3. Wait for decent wind. Your first flights with a fast glass plane are NOT the time to test its light wind capabilities. Make it easy on yourself, pick a bumpin' day.

Steve
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Old Nov 24, 2005, 10:36 AM
slope'n the Colombian Andes
ShredAir's Avatar
Colombia, Antioquia, Girardota
Joined Mar 2001
4,692 Posts
Sometimes there is a little flashing or ridge running down the leading edges of molded wings and tails. Make sure to smooth all LEs completely by scraping with a sharp blade and/or sanding with a hard sanding block. This is particularly important also on these small V-tails.
Be careful not to get the plane too nose-heavy; that again will contribute to sudden stalls.

Dieter Mahlein, ShredAir
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Old Nov 24, 2005, 10:46 AM
Detail Freak
target's Avatar
Harbor City, CA
Joined Oct 2003
21,667 Posts
Dieter is right on the nose heavy thing. I'v learned the nose heavy planes require MORE up elevator to negotiate a turn, so sometimes adding weight to the nose is a bad fix. Turn down the elevator throws, and you will be fine.
You can test for the dreaded snap, at altitude, an turn it down until it wont do it, especially if you have dual rates, you can use the low rate for this "safe" setting.

Good luck,
Target

PS. try new manuevers on foamies first, was to be my original advice!
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Old Nov 24, 2005, 10:52 AM
Phil.T-tailer
Phil.Taylor's Avatar
Devon, UK
Joined Jun 2003
4,231 Posts
[QUOTE=Flying-Addict]I finally tried to set up for a speedier pass by cutting a turn a bit...looking back now, without enough speed, I guess...the thing did a spiral of death. It just dropped out of the sky and I couldn't pull it out.
What are the do's and don'ts when flying one of these? I guess I've already found out ONE of the don'ts...Need to keep lots of speed in the turns?

Sounds like a nice spin to me - just like too many full size gliding accidents.
DO take the time to check out the spin characteristics with lots of air under the model next time. Take it up high, slow it up & turn - notice when it starts to drop a wing - get the nose DOWN to recover - if you pull up you'll make it worse. Then - lots of height again & deliberately go into a spin - same thing, but pull full up elevator & watch it spin! - down elevator to recover. The reason its worse than anything you've flown before is the narrow wingtips which will stall easily. The flip side is that it could be lots of fun - do a fairly high speed pass (lots of height!) and bang full aileron and elevator (and rudder if you have it - same direction) - it may do a lovely snap roll for you! (see the video on the VoltiJ thread if you've never seen it done before!)
Happy flying!
Phil
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Old Nov 24, 2005, 12:03 PM
Will fly for food
davidjensen's Avatar
Bellevue WA,
Joined Dec 2003
6,970 Posts
For landings set up some spoiler. I have mine on the throttle stick. When the the stick is down both ailerons go up about 3/8". This requires some down elevator (about 1/8") to compensate. When deployed the nose will rise but the track will not and the plane gets dirty and slow nicely. My Destiny really works well with spoilers
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Old Nov 24, 2005, 12:26 PM
Can you spot the giraffe?
daleksw's Avatar
Glasgow, Scotland
Joined Jun 2005
832 Posts
Have a friend standing beside you. Tell him that when he sees you heading at the ground, he should distract your attention so you miss.
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Old Nov 24, 2005, 12:28 PM
Mr. Innocent's Avatar
Oceanside CA
Joined Dec 2004
4,046 Posts
If it starts to stall, tug on the string! OH wait... its not a kite?
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Old Nov 24, 2005, 12:31 PM
Cat Rack
MtnGoat's Avatar
Lyle, WA
Joined Dec 2000
1,478 Posts
yup, faster is better. it's odd, but some foils have their best l/d at a fairly high speed.
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