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Old Jan 17, 2007, 05:52 PM
Tinkerer
jfhspike's Avatar
RI
Joined May 2005
184 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by wjbite
I just tried to fly a Yellow Bee...Only way to land is let it "glide" into the ground - for the Yellow Bee that means CRASH.

The A1 must have a lower wing loading and MAYBE you can trim it for a glide that is shallower and slower than the YB. Somebody should be able to try this by just keeping hands off of the elevator. Somebody, please try it and report, eh?
Without even testing, I can tell you that almost all our landings are with the throttle almost off. As mine is currently configured (it's about 20% oversized from the original plans), the motor is a little lower than I meant to put it; applying power helps point the nose up; reducing power drops it down. By adjusting the elevator trim, I'm pretty sure I could fly it without the elevator at all. I might try to do so tomorrow. Problem is that the climb rate is pretty low, and I have lots of trees around where I fly...I might have to cheat a little for the takeoff part :-). But I'll bet that with some adjustment of the motor height, you could make this thing work pretty well without elevator...

-Spike
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Old Jan 17, 2007, 06:37 PM
gpw
“There’s no place like Foam”
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United States, LA, New Orleans
Joined Jul 2002
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In the "oldays " all we had was rudder, and we flew quite alot ....anybody have a Jr. Falcon , or Jr. Skylark ??? both Fun RO planes ... want to try ro ...????? disconnect the elevator servo , test for a level glide , and go for it.... the common problem is ballooning as you turn into the wind ... nose goes UP too much , give it some rudder and turn out of the stall.... works .... for maneuvering, gain speed in a spiral dive , release rudder into the wind and you should have enough speed for a loop or barrel roll .... depending on the plane ... Fun stuff and simple ...
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Old Jan 20, 2007, 03:55 AM
Good glue is evil
melbourne australia
Joined Sep 2003
774 Posts
hey all
how do you stop the wing from warping after bending ?
I am new to fff its a very rare item here in australia.
the fff i have has aluminium on one side and brown paper on the other, i removed both sides.
i figured out the wing is 38" long x 7 " chord.
the flat middle section is 21" wide.
I used the bend foam jig, and hot air gun, i tried several peices of scrap to test bend first
which worked ok, but when I tried the 21" peice, it warped badly, a big bow length ways
this FFF has a grain, i guess the grain should run length ways.
Any clues guys how to get a straight wing after bending, with a heat gun ?????
thanks
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Old Jan 20, 2007, 07:33 AM
Tinkerer
jfhspike's Avatar
RI
Joined May 2005
184 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by brucej
hey all
how do you stop the wing from warping after bending ?
I am new to fff its a very rare item here in australia.
the fff i have has aluminium on one side and brown paper on the other, i removed both sides.
i figured out the wing is 38" long x 7 " chord.
the flat middle section is 21" wide.
I used the bend foam jig, and hot air gun, i tried several peices of scrap to test bend first
which worked ok, but when I tried the 21" peice, it warped badly, a big bow length ways
this FFF has a grain, i guess the grain should run length ways.
Any clues guys how to get a straight wing after bending, with a heat gun ?????
thanks
I have no clue how to do it...but maybe you don't need to! As long as the bow is "upwards" (i.e., tips higher than center), you can just count this as some of your "dihedral" and put a little less (2" instead of 3"?) into the outer pieces, and I'll bet everything still works pretty well. (I'm assuming the "warp"is only an inch or two..)
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Old Jan 20, 2007, 07:44 AM
gpw
“There’s no place like Foam”
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United States, LA, New Orleans
Joined Jul 2002
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Bruce... Not having any of your foam , it's hard to tell why it didn't bend properly ...If the bend is UPwards as Spike mentioned , then just do as he says and don't worry about it...You could try heating the foam with some weights on it to keep it flat .... carefull , might get some other unwanted warps ...
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Old Jan 20, 2007, 09:33 PM
Good glue is evil
melbourne australia
Joined Sep 2003
774 Posts
hi
yes the bow is "upwards" and it gave the wing some "dihedral" the bow was about 1.5" end to end, it has a LOT of lift when waved around.
this foam is the real bluecor FFF made by dow in the USA, there seems to be 3 kinds.
one with plastic on both sides, one with aluminium on one side and brown paper the other, and i forget what the third one is, its very hard to get in australia and VERY expencive, and is flimsy with the backing foil and paper peeled off
Any how i wanted to make this model to the plans and i was very dissapointed with the warp in the wing, i glued some bambo skewers to the LE and TE, and that has straighted it a fair bit, but i will try some more bending and try to perfect my bending skills.
I had thought about useing it with the warp in, but i did not think about reducing the tip height thanks for that idea
back to the drawing board
btw how long would you guys take to heat and bend the 21" wing section ?
thanks
brucej
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Old Jan 20, 2007, 11:48 PM
Registered User
DeSoto Kansas U.S.A.
Joined Jul 2004
15 Posts
Speaking of Flying in the Dark Ages

I found this thread a few days ago and just finished reading it. Reading about the rudder only flying reminded me of one of my early planes. It was a .049 Cessna Skylane with a 42.5 inch wing span and weighed more than a pound. Mine was rudder and elevator only no throttle. I flew it for years before it got to heavy with oil and extra epoxy. The person who taught me how to fly, who was much better than I was, ended up getting one that was rudder only. He could do loops and rolls and I just tried to stay out of his way (chuckling). He always wanted to do patterns with me but I was worried that he would crash into me, the only thing I could do that he couldn’t was climb faster. Reading this thread brought back a lot of fond memories. I pulled the old bird out of my airplane graveyard and took some pics to share.
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Old Jan 21, 2007, 06:42 AM
Use whatcha got!
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Metairie, LA
Joined Sep 2000
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Too cool Radial... Thanks for sharing the pics.

-mike s.
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Old Jan 21, 2007, 07:57 AM
gpw
“There’s no place like Foam”
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United States, LA, New Orleans
Joined Jul 2002
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In Australia , you guys have the best surfing and all the great lookin' women and NO FOAM .... What's that about ????

I think the Bendfoam jig induces an elliptical dihedral (warp) if there is too much space between the sticks .... are you heating the underside too when you bend... ???
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Old Jan 22, 2007, 12:51 AM
Good glue is evil
melbourne australia
Joined Sep 2003
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gpw the space between the sticks would be about 1/2inch, I thought about reducing it
no i am only heating one side of the foam.

Yep we got some great aussie girls, great beaches, great beer, but no foam
guess there is very little "KNOWN" demand for it,
brucej
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Old Jan 22, 2007, 07:13 AM
gpw
“There’s no place like Foam”
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United States, LA, New Orleans
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Brucej, the space between the sticks should be the thickness of the foam , plus a hair...that's why you're getting a bow...You guys need to talk to MS ...
Radial ... What a Classic!!!!!!! R/O is Fun and challenging ... who's the painter in the house , nice impressionist still life ...?
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Old Jan 22, 2007, 06:06 PM
Good glue is evil
melbourne australia
Joined Sep 2003
774 Posts
gpw i just rechecked the distance between the sticks its one and a half foam thickness's wide, i only have a hand drill so will redo and give it a try thanks
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Old Jan 23, 2007, 06:05 AM
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Joined Jan 2007
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I love this plane, could you pls forward me the plans to punani@eim.ae
Please suggest which ESC, receiver, servos and Tx would suit it and for similar ones.
Jalal
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Old Jan 23, 2007, 06:35 AM
gpw
“There’s no place like Foam”
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United States, LA, New Orleans
Joined Jul 2002
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Bruce , that should take care of most of the problem... try heating the bottom side of the foam too ... On a double skinned foam (both sides) it also takes the wrinkles out and makes a smooth underside too ...
Jalal ... www.FoamFly.com/gallery/Glen and it's free... Just double click on the image for full size tiles...let us know if you have any trouble...OK
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Old Jan 23, 2007, 09:22 AM
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Rudder/Throttle control

Some asked about rudder/throttle control; I went out this morning (brrrr...27 degrees) and flew in a light north wind -- 3 - 5 knots -- and managed to do an OK rudder/throttle only landing (basically cut the throttle almost completely, and used rudder in the obvious way), but control in the air wasn't great ... in my small flying area, with trees on one side and water on the other, I was just too nervous to stop using all elevator control. If one had a large field, it seems as if it'd be not only possible but kind of fun.

(All this was with my "expanded by 20%" T1 with a 4025 prop on a J250, which flies a good deal slower than the standard sized one...)

-Spike
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