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Old May 18, 2005, 11:07 PM
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Century City, CA
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Composite ARF Extra 2X2, Funtana140 or RAZZIA?

After putting my Thunder Tiger Rare Bear to rest, I want to take the components and put them in a slower, more fun flying aircraft. I have been practicing my 3D moves for quite a while and as with my music, the more I know, the more I realize I don't know. I love hobbies for a lifetime! I wanna use the following power system:
HACKER C50-13XL ACRO
JETI77
TP 10S3P 6000 LiPo

I had been leaning toward the Funtana 140, but as I continue to ponder the composite ARF, I am growing fonder of this plane. The Funtana 140 will probably fly slower, but will it be as impressive? I think the Composite ARF is a more impressive plane to electrify. I'm a person who likes to go his own way and take looks back.

I don't fly hardcore 3D, only basic 3D and think the Composite ARF would serve fine in this respect.
Are there any reasons not to go with the Composite ARF?
I would love any comments!

I'm gonna order my plane tomorrow before noon and will post the build if it's not a Funtana 140.

Thanks!

Caleb
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Last edited by lebdog; May 19, 2005 at 12:48 AM.
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Old May 19, 2005, 12:45 AM
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Century City, CA
Joined Jan 2004
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As I contemplate learning how to cut the composite arf perfectly as I would want. I really scare myself in to the more complete Funtana 140 where it's pretty much done for me.

I would really love to go with the composite arf extra 2x2, but there are so many extra's that I need to get to make that plane work for me. I really wish the Funtana had a better covering job though. I hate to remove the purple and probably won't because **** it, but come on. It's tough to imagine getting away with a perfect 1st assembly of a model like the composite arf.

Again any comments or encouragement welcome as this is a tough decision and I've got a few hours to decide.
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Old May 19, 2005, 01:08 AM
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Los Angeles, CA (UCLA)
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the composite arf is likely heavier... but you could get a hot paint job..

rhett
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Old May 19, 2005, 01:24 AM
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USA, CA, San Francisco
Joined Aug 2004
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The nice thing about the Funtana Pro 1.40 is that there is a huge amount of info on this forum already, as I'm sure you've seen. Based on the knowledge and experience posted in those threads by the folks that built them, you could be certain of making it perfect, first time out.

Extras are cooler though

Edit - words of encouragement? If you go with the Extra, take your time. I'm actually electrifying a much smaller Extra right now (60") and have taken months so far and still have work to do. But taking alot of time to just sit and stare at it, and think of the best way to do everything has saved me from making alot of booboos along the way. Still made a few though, but recoverable ones. The decision of which plane to buy is actually the easiest part! Then you get to agonize over all the other choices...
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Old May 19, 2005, 02:47 PM
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Century City, CA
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Thanks for input

Going with the Funtana 140. I choose to go this route mostly out of fiberglass paranoia. I hate ichy hands! I have never assembled a fiber glass kit so entailed and don't want to learn with such a nice model. I think I will spend some time learning how to glass a foam kit first. Then, I'll use that experience to get further in to composites. I really really like the Extra though, but I really really want a blank color scheme to start with.

I placed my order with Hacker for the Funtana and should have it tomorrow AM. I ordered a 20x11E and a 20x13E prop. also. You'll recognize me from the yellow hat! (unless it fits like doo doo). I don't want to use digital servos in this kit so I'm gonna request some assistance with this also.
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Old May 19, 2005, 03:54 PM
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Uhm, the composite extra doesn't really require fiberglassing stuff, as far as I know. It required drilling etc through fiberglass, but all the composite work is already done.

Rhett
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Old May 19, 2005, 07:03 PM
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Epping, Essex
Joined Nov 2002
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Please feel free to correct me but from what I've read on this site the jeti77 has problems with 1500w+. That may be just somebody else's paranoia but if you are going over that, either the jeti90, Hacker90 would be a better option, or hang on and see what the new castle creation HV stuff costs. As you will have 2.5kWish to play with, it would be a shame to have the esc shut down. Me, I've got a Midwest cap 232 (80") sitting in my loft waiting for me to stump up the money for the 10s li-pos and a AXI 5330.

Mat
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Old May 19, 2005, 07:34 PM
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Los Altos, California
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Guess I will put in my $0.02 cents.

I have 2 of the Funtana 1.40's and a RAZZIA with the oversize Wonka-Vator Tail..

Your power system would be ideal for either of these planes.
You did not mention what gear ratio you were using. The 20 inch prop might be slighly short if this is being used with the 6.7:1 GB.
We are flying C50-13 and 14 XL's with 22 x 10 props.
We have flown with the 22 x 11 but this is pushing the current draw on system a bit too high. However, all of this is covered in the threads.

Both Aircraft are well built and fly extremely well, as you can see from some of the videos in my threads on these two aircraft.

That said, they are two very very different airplanes.
The Funtana is more of a cross over plane between IMAC and 3D.
The construction is excellent and flight characteristics are very good.

The RAZZIA on the other hand is pure 3D. MUCH larger control Surfaces,
extremely thick wing. It flys like a huge 3D park flyer.

If you want a very nice cross between Sport/IMAC/3D, I would opt for the Funtana 1.40..
If you want all out pure 3D, go with the RAZZIA.
The RAZZIA is a much slower flying plane than the Funtana, and likes to really hang on the prop.

However, I have never flown a RAZZIA with the stock tail system.
All I can tell you is that the oversize tail really provides unbelievable control authority. Really a LOT of fun to fly!

BTW, ZB at Esprit will be bringing in some RAZZiAS with an optional tail system that is similar (but slightly smaller) than the Wonka-Vator tails....
Should be in, in about 3-5 weeks.

I would consider the HS645's to be slightly marginal but usuable on the Funtana. They would not be adequate on the RAZZIA due to the large control surfaces..

I don't have any first hand experience with the CA 2X2 so I cannot offer any direct comment or opinion.
I happen to like the looks of Extras, but there are a LOT of them out there.
The Funtana 1.40 and the RAZZIA are a bit more unique and they tend to fly more akin to my preferred style of flying.

In either case, you will enjoy the aircraft immensly, I assure you.

Regards,
Harley
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Old May 19, 2005, 07:55 PM
And You're Not
Timbuktu, Mali (Happy?)
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Who makes and sells the Razzia, and where can I see a pic of one??
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Old May 19, 2005, 08:41 PM
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RMihara's Avatar
San Mateo, California, United States
Joined Nov 2001
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Hi Jeffrey,

The Razzia is available through Esprit Model.

Harley created a thread on his Razzia where you can see pictures of this plane.

-Roger
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Old May 19, 2005, 08:49 PM
And You're Not
Timbuktu, Mali (Happy?)
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Man, how'd I miss that?? Thanks, Wild Moose.
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Old May 23, 2005, 12:41 AM
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Century City, CA
Joined Jan 2004
246 Posts
I ordered the FUNTANA 140 and have been assembling it over the weekend! I've got a stiff neck so it won't be completed this weekend. I noticed my HS645's don't just fit in the laser cut servo holes, so I've been slowly filing/cutting them open a bit. I got an HS5645 digital servo for the rudder.

Ro;
Cutting fiberglass sucks and is messy weakening the structure. I would want to repair/treat (re-seam to avoid freying the area) any fiberglass areas I would cut. I will learn glassing skills before I screw with an expensive model. What do you fly Ro, I see posts from you everywhere, but haven't seen any airplanes?

Tallyho:
I've had pretty good luck pulling 2500+ watts using the Jeti77. I keep my amp draw under 70 using an appropriate propellor size.

I think you'd be fine using the Jeti77 with that AXI, just don't mess with the timing.

Harley
Thank you Harley for your writings.
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Old May 23, 2005, 09:39 AM
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Los Altos, California
Joined Nov 2002
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Lebdog,

The 5645 servo for the rudder may have adequate torque (I personally prefer a bit more torque for full 3D flying), but it is also a relatively slow servo.

I would suggest that you consider running your receiver and servos on 6 volts.
This will increase the speed and the torque of the servos that you are using.
If you use a 2S1P Lipo or LIon receiver battery and 6 volt regulator that should provide a good solution to this...

Have fun with the new plane. I know you will enjoy it.

Harley
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Old May 27, 2005, 05:51 AM
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Century City, CA
Joined Jan 2004
246 Posts
A long night with the Funtana 140

It's about 4AM before I''ll get to sleep with sore neck sleeping doesn't help. I used this to make some good progress with the Funtana. Linkage/Radio is all I got left to go now. Hopefully nothing goes wrong with and I'll be able to get up for an early Saturday maiden.

I am getting pretty excited now...
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Old Jun 07, 2005, 07:05 AM
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Some clarification on the Composite ARF Extra 2x2 required. I've been flying one for a few months now with an AXI 5330/18 on 10S Lipo and a 20x11 prop with some stunning results.

Firstly, it's not fibreglass - it's a composite vacuum bagged foam sandwich. There is no glassing required and only minimal cutting/trimming of the elevator servo holes and the front of the cowling. The servo holes towards the rear of the fuse can be cut accurately, cleanly and quickly with a razor saw, whilst the front of the model can be initially cut with a dremel cutting disk and nicely cleaned up with a dremel sanding drum. It's real easy and doesn't take long.

It's not a difficult build and probably reflects a week of evenings to complete. There is some attention required to the final fit and clean-up of some pre-made assemblies but I suspect that this was down to me receiving one of the earlier models and I would guess that this may be improving. The woodwork for the electric option kit requires no modification for the inital fit and it's quite easy to get the intial thrust angle set due to the way the different sections are cut and fit together. Final adjustment to the thrust angle can be adjusted easily by tightening against the rubber gromets which sit between the motor mounting plate and the firewall.

Complete with 2 x Flightpower 5S3p 6450mAh F3A packs the model weighs around 14lbs and flight times are good for around 13 - 14 minutes. It offers unlimited vertical performance (how big do you like your loops to be?) and will prop hang at half-throttle. It flies beautifully in all respects and is a real pussycat, but at the same time has an incredible roll-rate and snap-rolls look pretty devastating and come out in the same direction with very little effort. In the knife-edge there is very little or no elevator coupling. Best of all, it makes that really cool whisltling noise so typical of Composite ARF top-hinged control surfaces. ;-)

Highly recommended.

Phil
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