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Old Apr 17, 2012, 11:08 AM
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Andy W,

I am considering a Siren or a Ion Pro +.
I read both your reviews, and both planes seem fantastic planes.
What should I consider in choosing one over the other?

Thank you,
Marcos
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Old Apr 19, 2012, 08:16 PM
Dir. of Innovation at Alert 5
Demon 6's Avatar
United States, FL, Fort Lauderdale
Joined Jul 2011
653 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flypingol View Post
Andy W,

I am considering a Siren or a Ion Pro +.
I read both your reviews, and both planes seem fantastic planes.
What should I consider in choosing one over the other?

Thank you,
Marcos
Strictly my opinion...
The Ion looks like a nice plane... comes with carbon spars etc... the price looks good too.
The Siren, which I have built, flown, enhanced, and improved is also a great plane. I have fallen in love with this plane, but I'm sure if I would have started with an Ion, I would be in love with that plane also.
I prefer the Carbon fuselage of the Siren and the balsa sheeted wing, (which I have stripped down, added carbon spars, and glassed) is as strong as any plane I have come across, short of a full competition F5B plane (see Raketwurm for an example)....
In short, as a starting point, by specifications alone, the Ion may have the edge... but, bear in mind... All planes need enhancements and improvements to be all that they can be... Good luck and get flying!
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Old Apr 19, 2012, 08:28 PM
Dir. of Innovation at Alert 5
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United States, FL, Fort Lauderdale
Joined Jul 2011
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Project Super Siren Update...
I picked up the epoxy and 3/4oz Glass cloth today... I repaired the wings to a flawless finish and added the 6mm carbon tube spars and bonded them together with EPO Steel.
Tomorrow, I'll do the final sanding and glass the bottom of the wing (one contiguous sheet) with black tinted resin (EPO Steel again), then do the top after it cures... This sucker is going to get punished, I can assure you!
I have a new, unassembled main wing that I will weigh and compare it to the "enhanced wing"... stay tuned.
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Old Apr 22, 2012, 06:00 AM
RIP Ric
Andy W's Avatar
Marietta, GA
Joined Jun 1999
43,312 Posts
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Originally Posted by Demon 6 View Post
K5-

Any pics of the 4S Battery setup? How many mAh? I have a 2650mAh 4S from another plane, but alas, it's too big.... Thanks in advance.
Did you remove the battery tray?
..a
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Old Apr 22, 2012, 06:01 AM
RIP Ric
Andy W's Avatar
Marietta, GA
Joined Jun 1999
43,312 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flypingol View Post
I am considering a Siren or a Ion Pro +.
I read both your reviews, and both planes seem fantastic planes.
What should I consider in choosing one over the other?
I have not flown or even seen an Ion in person, so I can't really comment.
..a
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Old Apr 22, 2012, 03:54 PM
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United States, FL, Fort Lauderdale
Joined Jul 2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Andy W View Post
Did you remove the battery tray?
..a
I have removed the tray and reinforced the interior (2 sections of 6oz carbon cloth set at +45/-45 deg).
I took some measurements of my current 3S 2200 and I did some research on H.King and I have found a few 4S battery setups that will fit...
My 3S 2200 is 35mm wide (laying down flat). The current 4S 2650 is 45mm wide in the same config (too wide)...
I found some 4s' that are 35<36mm wide so I am going to trust that H.King is putting out the right information...
I am massaging my wing to perfection and will glass it this week. Can't wait to get back in the air... Should have unlimited dive and close to unlimited yank performance... Gotta love the "Whistling" noise in full dive!
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Old Apr 23, 2012, 08:45 PM
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United States, FL, Fort Lauderdale
Joined Jul 2011
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Some good progress was made today. I glassed the underside of the wing with some 3/4oz cloth. It was not too bad, but the lightweight cloth is a pain to work with, but I got it all sorted... I'll feather sand the wing when it cures... and then proceed to glass the top side. I tinted the resin black for fun...
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Old Apr 25, 2012, 08:30 PM
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United States, FL, Fort Lauderdale
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Finished up the top side tonight... I'll let her cure, some simple sanding and should be back in the air in no time!
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Old Apr 27, 2012, 06:02 AM
RIP Ric
Andy W's Avatar
Marietta, GA
Joined Jun 1999
43,312 Posts
If I was going to that much trouble, I would have installed flaps as well!
..a
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Old Apr 27, 2012, 03:47 PM
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United States, FL, Fort Lauderdale
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Originally Posted by Andy W View Post
If I was going to that much trouble, I would have installed flaps as well!
..a
Well... as for flaps. I didn't want the added weight of the additional servos primarily. I have had alot of success with Spoilerons and have not experienced an issue slowing her down per-se. I will agree that she will come in hot and landing must be very deliberate, but overall I just wanted to reinforce the wing and see how she behaves. I do have another spare wing that I haven't assembled yet and I wanted to do a bit of comparing the two side by side, apples to apples. So far, the wing feels equal in weight in a basic hand lifting... But about 10 fold in rigidity! I will put them on a scale tonight and give you all the real numbers. I will also do some deflection tests and record the numbers to compare against the replacement wing once I assemble it....
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Old Apr 27, 2012, 07:35 PM
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United States, FL, Fort Lauderdale
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Alrighty then... after weighing my "Glassed" wing, complete with control surfaces against the Monocoated factory wing (un-assembled) this is how it breaks down...
Glassed Wing = 415g
Factory Wing = 380g
So, considering my glassed wing has been assembled, epoxied together w/carbon spars, glass covered etc... equals 415g.
The un-assembled factory wing still needs the plywood spars installed etc...
I say I'm net even with no significant difference in weight, but about 10 fold in rigidity... So, I will definately do this again, and maybe with flaps
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Old Apr 28, 2012, 07:23 AM
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Demon6,

Thanks for your insight!

Marcos
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Old Apr 29, 2012, 08:38 PM
RIP Ric
Andy W's Avatar
Marietta, GA
Joined Jun 1999
43,312 Posts
Cool.

I am fine with models that only have ailerons, setting up spoilerons. That said, if I was to build another Siren, I'd probably take the time (and weight penalty) to add flaps. It's a hotliner, not a thermal ship, so the weight isn't critical, and the benefits of flaps outweigh the effort and weight penalties. I also say this after making the conversion for another pilot a few years back - it was pretty trivial..

.. but that's just me!
..a
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Old Apr 30, 2012, 07:58 AM
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Toronto, Ontario
Joined Oct 1999
363 Posts
Keep it Light

Hi guys,

I was out thermalling my Siren yesterday in 30 km/h (20 mph) winds yesterday.

I like my stock (except for tray removal) set up. It can still dive and roll per hotliner requirements and then I can thermal whenever I want to as well. All of this can be done on one 10 - 15 minute flight.

My thermal record last summer was about 65 minutes. I probably could have gone 2 hours or more but I was getting tired. I still had about 3.85v per cell battery left on a 3s2p 2200x2 mAh set up.

I used to think a Siren could not thermal until I was told to try it by the world class pilots at the Central Ontario Glider Group (COGG). After that, the more thermal practice I put on the Siren the better I get at it. Now I try to thermal every flight - in between vertical rolling climbs and whistling dives...

On dead calm evenings I get a blast out of floating it around. Using two 1800s to keep it light and lots of up trim, I can walk it around on the edge of stall. I do this at least 35m up as the chances of tip stalling are very high.

As for landing, 45 - 60 degree spoilerons are fine for me as long as I have enuf approach space. In higher winds I often land with no spoilerons. This is no park flyer.

Of course you can always have two wings; one with the stock two servos and another with 4 or more.

What a versatile bird!

Cheers,

P.
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Old Apr 30, 2012, 08:28 AM
RIP Ric
Andy W's Avatar
Marietta, GA
Joined Jun 1999
43,312 Posts
Any model can thermal, it just takes the right conditions for some vs. others, and knowing the best speed to fly. Even F5B/F3B has a TD portion..
..a
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