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Old Jan 01, 2008, 05:02 PM
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The reason beginners "don't do scale"

Quote:
Originally Posted by **neons**
.................... I like scale planes very much but in practicality manufacturers would lose some of their purchasing audience. The newbie will have one heck of a time to get a scale plane to fly. GWS as other companies widened there purchasing audience by doing this. The scale plane cannot fly as good as the modified version in my opinion. I hear there is a designation (standoff scale) for the these type of planes. It all boils down to flight experience on the stick and your personal choice here.
**Neons** Bob
edit; sorry, I was typing while spinetti was posting;

You say it so well; first, MY impression is that GWS is NOT in ANY MEANS into "true scale" planes................ and as you said, if these planes WERE true scale, the scalers would often have a ROUGH time getting them to balance, and most ifportant of all, GWS sales would go down so fast that a large percentage of buyers would stop buying. They/me/we wnat planes that ESEMBE scale while being easier to fly........ ok, ok, ok,...... Formosa, not for a beginner, but, uh, it's not in the SCALE category either....

True Scale planes are generally built by modelers who are higher skilled than guys like me, and I think, guys that BUY GWS in general...... I'm getting long winded............ GWS seems to addressing a market like me that simply wants to have fun at a generally lower price............

I'll gladly stand corrected if I made an error here.

LarryR : )
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Old Jan 01, 2008, 05:16 PM
The Revegetator
Chris F's Avatar
Melbourne Australia
Joined Jun 2006
2,061 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by **neons**
I like Chris F's overlay drawings. As far as scale goes, I think it is a matter of what you want to float your boat. GWS seems to have done their home work here. I think a true scale FW-190 model's flight charecteristics won't match the configuration that GWS came up with. The longer nose moments will help balance the plane better and smoothen the flight for a more general RC flyer. The larger tail surface will give a better control and forward stability even though there size would add weight in the tail section. If the stock scale nose was kept, you may then have to add more weight up front to get the CG right thus a heavier logy handling plane. It is a trade off here. I like scale planes very much but in practicality manufacturers would lose some of their purchasing audience. The newbie will have one heck of a time to get a scale plane to fly. GWS as other companies widened there purchasing audience by doing this. The scale plane cannot fly as good as the modified version in my opinion. I hear there is a designation (standoff scale) for the these type of planes. It all boils down to flight experience on the stick and your personal choice here.
**Neons** Bob
Hi Bob,

I am sure you are generally right about many 100% scale models having some unsavoury flight characteristics, especially warbirds that were designed for manoeuvrability. I agree with spinnetti that models don't need to be 100% scale, but at least look right. As you say, what looks right is in the eyes of the beholder, but the supplied cowl on this model spoils it for me. My model balances on the wing spar without extra weight. Although my cowl still isn't quite scale it looks better than the GWS one, well to me anyway. I think GWS could make this model look better and fly just as well with minimal changes.
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Old Jan 01, 2008, 06:00 PM
5,200 Led Lighted Bike-Bob P.
**neons**'s Avatar
USA, MA, Swansea
Joined Mar 2003
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Hi Chris,
I know you are right about some of the FW-190 cofigurations are out of whack. Still, your plane in my eyes looks beautiful. Now if it was a contest for scale the beauty is only as deep as the skin. Measurements would be decisive. It is something that the average builder has to live with because it was molded into that model.
For me if I wanted truer scale I am a scratch builder and it would not be a problem for me to modify it. I would probably vacu-form my own canopy and nose cowling. I also think I could make a nice looking standoff scale FW-190-D with this GWS kit. I have a nice GWS ME-262 back someplace in this thread. I know that the nacelles are not proper on it but she still is a beauty in my eyes also. I would not like to have the scale engine nacelles on that plane because I would trade off the power output thrust to make it look real because the scale nacelles would be smaller diameter. I prefer to live with the larger kit nacelles because I will have a more powerful better flyer despite the unreal scale look. Now if I was in a contest build for scale I would be very fussy and go with scale look. GWS new what they were doing here. It is about widening sales and all around performance. They still all look good in flight.
**Neons** Bob
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Old Jan 01, 2008, 06:28 PM
The Revegetator
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Melbourne Australia
Joined Jun 2006
2,061 Posts
I can't disagree with you about scale; you have to make some compromises to make a good flying model. I have had a go at scratch building but unfortunately I just don't have the time these days, that's why I decided to go the GWS route. EDF makes scale even more of a challenge that's for sure. There are definitely a lot of happy GWS flyers out there including myself
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Old Jan 25, 2008, 10:54 PM
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Red Lake Falls, MN
Joined Aug 2004
157 Posts
Mustang Rehabilitated!

Hope she flies as good as she looks! Will have brushless motor and lipo battery.
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Old Feb 06, 2008, 05:04 PM
100mph club member
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NW O-town
Joined Jun 2005
1,653 Posts
Some of my GWS-38

Day was kind of cruddy but this plane didn't care. Flies awesome.

Incidentally, these pictures are taken AFTER a major 11 piece repair caused by pilot error during the maiden. Can't tell? That's why I love GWS planes. EASY to fix.





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Old Feb 06, 2008, 06:50 PM
5,200 Led Lighted Bike-Bob P.
**neons**'s Avatar
USA, MA, Swansea
Joined Mar 2003
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Turbo,
Nice comeback! great looking repairs. The P-38 photos look exceptionally nice. Keep up the great work.
**Neons** Bob
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Old Feb 06, 2008, 10:24 PM
Retardedly intelligent
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beavercreek,ohio
Joined Jan 2007
3,857 Posts
heres the latest GWS plane in me and my brotheres fleet that idiot built this it actually turned out ok besides his inability to hook up the servos to the aleroins
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Old Feb 06, 2008, 10:29 PM
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Darwin Australia
Joined May 2002
6,960 Posts
Here are two photos shownig the results of my four year old GWS Me-109 getting caught up in a "Cat Fight". I had just put the 109 in the back of my hatchback and left the hatch open while I went inside to get my Formosa II. My cat had jumped into the open hatch to investigate but the next door neighbors cat decided it was a good time for an ambush. After 30 second of squalling mayhem on the top of the 109, this was the result.

One reads stories of WWII "Dog Fights" but this is the first Me109 involved in a "Cat Fight"

Edit:- The !09 is now back in one piece and this is the eighth time it has had a major repair. So now the 109 is on its ninth life.

Ken
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Old Feb 06, 2008, 11:20 PM
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A 22 rifle will get even. All's fair in war.

Ken
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Old Feb 07, 2008, 12:35 AM
At peace with his albatross
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United States, CA, Vacaville
Joined Oct 2003
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I've always found Airsoft to be good for cat repellant.
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Old Feb 07, 2008, 09:52 AM
David
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Monrovia, AL, USA
Joined Mar 2001
1,253 Posts
Tubo... nice!!!
What do you use specifically for painting these??? I've tried el cheapo WM rattle cans -- of course with no success. I am looking for another method without having to invest in a sprayer. I've got a new "white" P51 and want to paint it the same gray color as your P-38.

Thanks.
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Old Feb 07, 2008, 07:55 PM
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USA, KY, Verona
Joined Nov 2001
3,148 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris F
I can't disagree with you about scale; you have to make some compromises to make a good flying model. I have had a go at scratch building but unfortunately I just don't have the time these days, that's why I decided to go the GWS route. EDF makes scale even more of a challenge that's for sure. There are definitely a lot of happy GWS flyers out there including myself
Depends on the plane-its incorrect to assume you can't both have a good flying airplane and at least a scale outline. Not like the GWS way off scale canopy made it fly better. GWS had a great opportunity to build a nice bird at no extra cost, but apparently put the "C" team on it... the 262 is a great example of looking "right" even though the motor nacelles can't be sized right and still work well. Their P40 also looks really nice. Besides, FSK has a beautiful scale 190 that flies excellent, and Alfas 190's are nearly as good and also fly great. Here's examples of great flying FW190s: The FSK, ALFA, a reference image and my almost complete, nearly full scale struts I'm making for my FW190. You can have it all with a bit of effort..... I'll probably get a GWS190 at some point and "fix it".
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Old Feb 07, 2008, 10:50 PM
latinflyer
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United States, CA, Milpitas
Joined Dec 2004
747 Posts
Best GWS

ok, here is the second time trying to post my pics here, this are my favorites 3 airplanes and are GWS of course.

Latinflyer.
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Old Feb 07, 2008, 11:48 PM
The Revegetator
Chris F's Avatar
Melbourne Australia
Joined Jun 2006
2,061 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by spinnetti
Depends on the plane-its incorrect to assume you can't both have a good flying airplane and at least a scale outline. Not like the GWS way off scale canopy made it fly better. GWS had a great opportunity to build a nice bird at no extra cost, but apparently put the "C" team on it... the 262 is a great example of looking "right" even though the motor nacelles can't be sized right and still work well. Their P40 also looks really nice. Besides, FSK has a beautiful scale 190 that flies excellent, and Alfas 190's are nearly as good and also fly great. Here's examples of great flying FW190s: The FSK, ALFA, a reference image and my almost complete, nearly full scale struts I'm making for my FW190. You can have it all with a bit of effort..... I'll probably get a GWS190 at some point and "fix it".
Yes spinnetti, I take back what I said. You can often have a 100% scale outline and get away with it. I also agree that GWS could have done better with their FW-190, but you know that already. The reason I went with the GWS 190 is that it is so easy to modify to fit retracts and flaps. It's just a pity you have to fix all the other stuff too.
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