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Old Oct 26, 2012, 10:14 AM
Will it ever Fly?
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United States, SD, Platte
Joined Nov 2011
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Originally Posted by Turner2 View Post
It's not that you should never fly with the wind, just that you should not let the plane get far downwind of where you stand.
Unless you like a LONG walk, Don't ask me how I know
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Old Oct 26, 2012, 04:09 PM
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LI, New York, USA
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Originally Posted by chaddlee1978 View Post
When flying upwind, how do you supposed to land the plane while heading upwind? Wouldn't you have to go downwind some and then go upwind in order to land upwind and if that is the case then you can't keep plane upwind all the time. I just a little confused on this. thanks.

Chad
Good question. There are two points in play here.

1) My advice to keep the plane upwind.
2) Always land into the wind.

When I say keep the plane upwind, I am talking about the physical part of the sky where you fly. The area of ground that is in front of you when you face into the wind. I will illustrate.

UPWIND VS DOWNWIND

Imagine you are standing on a football field. You are on the 50 yard line. The wind is blowing from goal post to goal post. OK, got the picture?

Now, face the goal post that would have the wind blowing into your face. You are now facing "upwind" Every part of the field between you and that goal post is upwind of you.

Behind you is the downwind side. If you were to turn and face the other goal post the wind would be at your back and you would be facing down wind.

So I tell new pilots to fly UPWIND of their position, not downwind of their position.


INTO THE WIND AND AWAY FROM THE WIND


When we say that we launch the plane into the wind we mean that the nose of the plane is facting into the wind, facing upwind, when you take-off or you hand launch it. The plane is facing upwind.

If the nose of the plane is facing away from the wind it would be facing downwind. We always try to launch upwind and avoid launching cross wind or downwind.

KEEP THE PLANE UP WIND

I mean that, as you stand on the 50 yard line you should not let the plane fly past you toward the downwind goal. Reason? In order to get the plane back to you from that downwind position you have to fly upwind, against the wind. IF you get in trouble, that wind can carry the plane away from you and you could lose it.

However, if you keep the plane upwind from you, and you get in trouble, the wind will bring the plane back toward you and you are far less likely to lose it.

A basic skill is to be able to keep that plane upwind of your position. If it gets behind you, then you do not have control and you are not in command of the aircraft.


LANDING INTO THE WIND

A normal landing pattern used by full scale pilots and by model pilots is to fly a down wind leg, a cros wind leg and then an up wing leg which has the plane flying into the wind.

You can execute that entire pattern while you keep the plane UPWIND of your position.
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Old Oct 27, 2012, 09:18 PM
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I thank you for ya'lls help. I just bought the stratos firebird today and waiting for wind to die down some in order to fly. I hope it all goes good without a bad crash. I would like to eventually move up to a mustang electric plane.
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Old Oct 27, 2012, 10:31 PM
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Originally Posted by chaddlee1978 View Post
I thank you for ya'lls help. I just bought the stratos firebird today and waiting for wind to die down some in order to fly. I hope it all goes good without a bad crash. I would like to eventually move up to a mustang electric plane.
Best of luck with the Firebird Stratus. I hear it is an excellent trainer.

Be sure you read the first post in this thread as well as the post at this link:

> THINGS TO CHECK ON AN RTF
> http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=767681
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Old Oct 29, 2012, 04:03 PM
Your Pilot Ryan
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United States, IN, South Bend
Joined Nov 2008
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we explain torque and p-factor


Why does my airplane always go left (10 min 44 sec)
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Old Jan 01, 2013, 09:59 PM
crazyflyer
Joined Jan 2013
21 Posts
flying in the wind

I am a fairly new pilot.
I started with a super cub 3 channel.
I wanted more control so I purchased a Bixler O.
It has been a good flyer.
I fly in wind now but I couldn't handle the wind in my Super Cub.
I fly in most winds now. Here is a video of a flight at the tail end of Sandy
The winds were about 25mph aloft. As you can see I didn't make much headway into the wind but I just had it hanging almost in place into the wind
P.S.don't go by the clock and date, I never could get it to set right.
6Nov12a flight windy day (3 min 57 sec)
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Old Jan 01, 2013, 11:14 PM
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Anyone have any flying tips for keeping the plane upwind?
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Old Jan 02, 2013, 12:33 AM
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NE Denver, CO
Joined Sep 2007
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Ahh Wind, The bane of pilots through history.

I think for a risk free intro to flying in wind nothing beats a sim. Practice what we call ground reference maneuvers in full scale. Your probably already doing this and just don't know it. A ground reference maneuver is one where the model is flown on a track that uses the ground for line up or reference. We need to be able to do this in order to fly a rectangular traffic pattern, an aerobatic maneuver centered for the judges or just to line up with the centerline of the runway. To track a specified course over the ground we must take wind into account. When flying a straight course, lined up with the runway centerline for example the aircraft must have its heading canted, called crabbing, into the wind. When flying a circular course the ground speed varies continuously therefore bank angle must be continuously varied from a maximum directly downwind to a minimum directly upwind. I'm sure there are far better explanations and illustrations of ground reference maneuvers available online by doing a search.

As far as letting the model drift too far down wind you have to recognize that your ground speed can easily triple or more when going from upwind to downwind. Lets say your model is flying at 20 mph which is probably pretty normal for a lot of entry level planes. Lets say the wind is blowing at 10 mph. When flying upwind the models groundspeed will be 10 mph. Now turn around and fly directly downwind with the same 20 mph airspeed. Your groundspeed is now 30 mph. If the wind is 20mph the upwind speed will be zero and the downwind 40 As the wind becomes a higher percentage of the models airspeed the ratio between the upwind and downwind speeds will grow.

The fact that your groundspeed changes by twice the windspeed is the biggest reason for always trying to land upwind. Many new pilots do not recognize this and think "It's just a little wind, what difference does it make if I land downwind?" The high groundspeed causes all sorts of issues just two of which are runway overruns and attempts to force the aircraft onto the ground at too high an airspeed with loss of control as a result. If landing down wind is no big deal ask your self why the maximum tail wind limit for many large transport category aircraft with touchdown speeds in excess of 130 knots is only 10 knots.

All of us who have trained people have seen this again and again. I think it stems from the fact that someone learning to fly often doesn't appreciate just how fast a model can go out of sight down wind. When they realize they are getting downrange they will turn upwind. Often times however they don't get the model headed directly back upwind and that further compromises the models ground speed coming back to the pilot. The strong wind can also cause a strong ground track drift that can disorient the pilot leading to the feeling that the model is not under control. It often is and if the pilot were patient the model would eventually get back home. Unfortunately panic frequently sets in and that causes a big deterioration in stick skills.

One thing that can help is to fly at a lower altitude as the wind gradient caused by the earths friction normally causes wind speed to be lower.

By recognizing that the upwind turn needs to be started earlier in strong wind you avoid being caught too far out.
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Last edited by Steve Graham; Jan 02, 2013 at 12:44 AM.
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Old Jan 02, 2013, 08:26 AM
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Good discussion Steve. Thanks.
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Old Jan 04, 2013, 02:22 PM
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If you are a new pilot, trying to figure out how to select your first radio, you may find this article of interest:
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1801792
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Old Jan 11, 2013, 08:01 AM
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good stuffs, very useful, gota read it carefully
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Old Jan 11, 2013, 01:34 PM
Neuton was on to something
Joined Jan 2013
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Model Recomendation

I grew up around R/C but haven't flown in about 25 years. I purchased the Phoenix simulator to prepare and plan on joining a club that flys indoors during the winter. I am going to the E-Fest in Champaign IL and looking for a recommendation for a profile foam plane that flys relatively slow, but has reasonable 3D abilities once I get the hang of it again. What model would you suggest?
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Old Jan 11, 2013, 02:27 PM
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Originally Posted by Ground Hog View Post
I grew up around R/C but haven't flown in about 25 years. I purchased the Phoenix simulator to prepare and plan on joining a club that flys indoors during the winter. I am going to the E-Fest in Champaign IL and looking for a recommendation for a profile foam plane that flys relatively slow, but has reasonable 3D abilities once I get the hang of it again. What model would you suggest?
Welcome back. This is not really the topic of this thread adn franly I don't have a recommendtion for you. I would suggest you start a thread in the beginner forum titled, "looking for recommendation for a first plane". Define what you want and you will be flooded with recommendations.

Best of luck at e-fest.
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Old Jan 15, 2013, 07:45 AM
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Wasaga Beach, Ontario
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aeajr View Post
Anyone have any flying tips for keeping the plane upwind?
If you're in strong winds, these are some of the 'tricks' I've used:

-Don't feel you "have" to turn the plane. I've done many a flight where 90% of it is spent with the plane facing more or less one direction. There is still a lot of fun stuff you can do without having to turn downwind. IMO these are great days to practice finesse and smooth handling.. the kind of stuff that might normally be "boring" but is much more challenging in strong winds.

-If you need to turn it downwind to bring it back to you, do a full 360 degree turn, and re-asses. You can repeat a couple of times if need be. The idea here is that you're already in the mindset of returning the plane to an upwind direction before you even execute the turn. It gives you more time to think if the end result isn't exactly what you want.

-Bring an experienced friend with you who isn't flying at the same time. If necessary you can pass off control to him (buddy box works too) to rescue the plane. This wouldn't be high on my list, but I saved a friend's plane once for this very reason. High winds and he passed control to me when it got away from him.

-Know the limitations of you and your craft. If you have a small, light plane and the wind is too strong, don't fly. If you feel really uncomfortable with the conditions, don't fly. You might feel bad for not flying, but you'll feel worse when you lose or crunch a plane.
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Old Jan 15, 2013, 08:15 AM
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Originally Posted by kalnaren View Post
If you're in strong winds, these are some of the 'tricks' I've used:

-Don't feel you "have" to turn the plane. I've done many a flight where 90% of it is spent with the plane facing more or less one direction. There is still a lot of fun stuff you can do without having to turn downwind. IMO these are great days to practice finesse and smooth handling.. the kind of stuff that might normally be "boring" but is much more challenging in strong winds.

-If you need to turn it downwind to bring it back to you, do a full 360 degree turn, and re-asses. You can repeat a couple of times if need be. The idea here is that you're already in the mindset of returning the plane to an upwind direction before you even execute the turn. It gives you more time to think if the end result isn't exactly what you want.

-Bring an experienced friend with you who isn't flying at the same time. If necessary you can pass off control to him (buddy box works too) to rescue the plane. This wouldn't be high on my list, but I saved a friend's plane once for this very reason. High winds and he passed control to me when it got away from him.

-Know the limitations of you and your craft. If you have a small, light plane and the wind is too strong, don't fly. If you feel really uncomfortable with the conditions, don't fly. You might feel bad for not flying, but you'll feel worse when you lose or crunch a plane.
I REALLY like that 360 turn mind set idea. I am going to start to incorporate that into my teaching.

Thanks alot!
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