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Old Mar 22, 2005, 02:35 AM
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I agree with Everydayflyer.

And one more connector option: I looked at those polarized Dean's micro connectors, and decided not to use them on my batteries for the very reason you mention: they have a pin sticking out of both the "male" and the "female" connector, and a pin sticking out of a battery connector is just an invitation for trouble.

I use the 3-pin Deans micro connectors instead. With these, all the pins are on the male connector, and the non-uniform spacing between the three pins ensures the correct polarity when you plug them together.

If you wish you can simply ignore the middle pin. I myself use these 3-pin Deans micro connectors only on my small 2S lipo packs, and I bring out a tap from between the two lipo cells to the center pin. This lets me use a charge balancer when charging the packs.

If you use 3S packs, you can use the 4-pin Deans Micro plugs (instead of the 3-pin ones), as they will allow you to bring out taps to both cell junctions.

I had one incident where the heatshrink moved just far enough on a Deans Ultra connector to let the soldered joint come in contact with one of the current/voltage jumper pins on my Apache 2500 lipo charger. Hey presto, instant dead charger .

I'm no longer a fan of the concept of using only heatshrink tubing as electrical isolation, so I have just ordered my first dozen Anderson Power Pole connectors.

-Flieslikeabeagle
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Old Mar 22, 2005, 06:45 AM
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It is misguided advice to think you are in someway safer by changing the exposed male (positive) lead to the non-exposed pin in a polarized connection. The short in the battery does not occur to ground but to its other pin. Switching pins will not help as the short occurs when some metal such as the ESC pin in this particular thread connects the pins. The most common short concerning battery shorts is when two batteries are mistakenly connected together and your 4-pin connector would not work to ensure improper connection unless one of the pins was offset. The 4-pin connector is more likely to cause accidental pin connection because you have two more exposed leads.

The only sure way to eliminate accidental shorts for the 2-pin mini Deans is to cover the connector so neither pin is exposed.

Ed
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Last edited by no stick; Mar 22, 2005 at 06:56 AM.
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Old Mar 22, 2005, 09:46 AM
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Another problem with 3 and 4 pin deans is that the charger has exposed pins. If the + pin on the charger should come in contact with your cars body, dead charger. This is why the + pin is on the battery on the micro deans. I remember back in my RC car days when we used deans 4 pin connectors, shorted chargers were common. But all the chargers had fuses back then therefore an easy fix.
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Old Mar 22, 2005, 10:10 AM
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Haralson County GA. USA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by no stick
It is misguided advice to think you are in someway safer by changing the exposed male (positive) lead to the non-exposed pin in a polarized connection. The short in the battery does not occur to ground but to its other pin. Switching pins will not help as the short occurs when some metal such as the ESC pin in this particular thread connects the pins. The most common short concerning battery shorts is when two batteries are mistakenly connected together and your 4-pin connector would not work to ensure improper connection unless one of the pins was offset. The 4-pin connector is more likely to cause accidental pin connection because you have two more exposed leads.

The only sure way to eliminate accidental shorts for the 2-pin mini Deans is to cover the connector so neither pin is exposed.

Ed
Each person must look at the evidence and reach thier own conclusion.
To me there is no way the Micro 4 pin with the female on the battery could have shorted under such conditions. The first thing I look for in any setup is what could possibly go wrong. I expreseted my conserns with the Deans connector which cause this accident months ago and the general feeling was that they were not a problem.
There are no exposed leads on a female connector which is correctly installed with the solder joints properly insulated.
The Dean Micro Plug 4R is polorized . Not sure how you connect two batteries together if they all have female connectors on them.

Charles
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Old Mar 22, 2005, 10:20 AM
Heli Bouncer
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I'm not setting my charger on any part of my cars engine compartment from now on, I've got a small fiberglass TV tray on wheels that I'm using for my charging station.

I'm looking into some way of making a small sun screen to go over the top that doesn't act like a kite in wind. Has anyone noticed that plastic engine bits of cars used for flightline charging have a noticeable amount of sun-fading. That could be another issue here as we use our cars more for field recharging.
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Old Mar 22, 2005, 10:22 AM
Southern Pride
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hybris
Another problem with 3 and 4 pin deans is that the charger has exposed pins. If the + pin on the charger should come in contact with your cars body, dead charger. This is why the + pin is on the battery on the micro deans. I remember back in my RC car days when we used deans 4 pin connectors, shorted chargers were common. But all the chargers had fuses back then therefore an easy fix.
Smart chargers will not start a charge ( apply any current) to the charge leads unless they detect a battery( volts). The only way to short out the charging leads on An Apachee 2500 ,Triton,Astro Flight 109,TP425 and most likely others is to have more than on battery connector on the leads and have a battery connected to one of these leads.A very simple test,start your charger without a battery connected use your DVM and check volts on the exposed charger connectors. <edit: The Triton will send a very short burst when the start button is pushed.I am not quite sure why anyone would start a charger without a battery connected but I guess this could cause a problem.>
This is was the first thing I checked when I started using Li Polys and Deans Ultra Connectors as I was extremely concerned about the exposed male connector on the charge leads.Most of the time I have 4 to 6 chargers on my bench at any given time and was concerned about the exposed metal face plates and housings.

Charles
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Old Mar 22, 2005, 11:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by everydayflyer
Each person must look at the evidence and reach thier own conclusion.
To me there is no way the Micro 4 pin with the female on the battery could have shorted under such conditions. The first thing I look for in any setup is what could possibly go wrong. I expreseted my conserns with the Deans connector which cause this accident months ago and the general feeling was that they were not a problem.
There are no exposed leads on a female connector which is correctly installed with the solder joints properly insulated.
The Dean Micro Plug 4R is polorized . Not sure how you connect two batteries together if they all have female connectors on them.

Charles
Exactly and that is my point.

All micro Deans female pins are exposed regardless if it is a 2, 3 or 4-pin connector.

I stand by my previous statement that it is misguided advice.

The only way to protect the Micro Deans connectors is to cover them when not in use.

Ed
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Last edited by no stick; Mar 22, 2005 at 12:29 PM.
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Old Mar 22, 2005, 12:06 PM
Southern Pride
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Haralson County GA. USA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by no stick
Exactly and that is my point.

All micro Deans female pins are exposed regardless if is a 2, 3 or 4-pin connector.
I stand by my previous statement that it is misguided advice.

The only way to protect the Micro Deans connectors is to cover them when not in use.

Ed
No they are not, only the male half of the Deans Micro 3R and 4R have pins sticking out. The female half of the pairs has recessed connectors.
The only Deans which has exposed pins on both halfs of the connectors are the ones (Micro Polarized) which caused the incident which started this thread.
I have used Deans connectors for 40 years and have never had a short caused by them,but then like I said before I refuse to use this particular on due to what I perceived as a hazard.

Charles
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Old Mar 22, 2005, 12:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by everydayflyer
No they are not, only the male half of the Deans Micro 3R and 4R have pins sticking out. The female half of the pairs has recessed connectors.
The only Deans which has exposed pins on both halfs of the connectors are the ones (Micro Polorized) which caused the incident which started this thread.
I have used Deans connectors for 40 years and have never had a short caused by them.

Charles
The fact that the female pins are not sticking out has nothing to do with whether it shorts or not because the metal pin is exposed.

Please take another look at your Micro Deans connectors and you will see the female pins even though they aren't sticking out still have metal exposed and are subject to accidental shorts.

I stand by my statement that all Deans micro connectors have exposed pins and the only solution to fully protect them is to completely cover when not in use regardless whether the pins are recessed or not.

Ed
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Old Mar 22, 2005, 12:30 PM
Southern Pride
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Quote:
Originally Posted by no stick
The fact that the female pins are not sticking out has nothing to do with whether it shorts or not because the metal pin is exposed.

Please take another look at your Micro Deans connectors and you will see the female pins even though they aren't sticking out still have metal exposed and are subject to accidental shorts.

I stand by my statement that all Deans micro connectors have exposed pins and the only solution to fully protect them is to completely cover when not in use regardless whether the pins are recessed or not.

Ed
OK you win, ., but only by using what I fell is very poor logic,by your standards all connectors have exposed"pins" and therefor are unsafe.

Charles
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Old Mar 22, 2005, 12:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by everydayflyer
OK you win, ., but only by using what I fell is very poor logic,by your standards all connectors have exposed"pins" and therefor are unsafe.

Charles
How true, hence my logic is to cover the battery connectors.

Ed
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Old Mar 22, 2005, 12:54 PM
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Thanks Hybris !!
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Old Mar 22, 2005, 09:02 PM
Noise......
Queen Creek AZ
Joined Jul 2004
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Two words.....Deans Ultra. Can't hook em up wrong as long as you wire em right. Granted, the are a gold plated pain to seperate sometimes, but I like em. I bought a few sets of the micro's to make a splitter for my TX pack, and I was nervous soldering a Nimh in that tiny space. Never mind a lipo. The APP's look good too, but I already have the Deans. And I paint the area directly under the plastic with liquid electrical tape to ensure that little bit of exposed area is covered.
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Old Mar 23, 2005, 02:47 PM
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rilysi wrote:
Quote:
Two words.....Deans Ultra.
Rilysi, these are very nice connectors, and based on advice I got here on RC Groups, I have these on almost all my lipo packs. However - I have decided to change to Anderson Powerpole connectors for all my 3S packs.

Why? A major weakness of the Deans Ultra is the fact that it needs heatshrink to insulate the connections. A second is that when trying to tug apart the rather tight-fitting connectors, it is very difficult to avoid applying mechanical stress to the soldered connections, a big no-no in the electronics world, as solder is quite weak mechanically. AFAIK, Powerpoles are free of both these issues.

I have already been bitten once by the first of these two weaknesses in the Deans Ultra. The heatshrink on one terminal managed to move a fraction - maybe 1/32 inch - and then that tiny exposed sliver of metal managed to contact one of the jumper pins on my Apache 2500 lipo charger. Those pins go directly to the onboard microprocessor (PIC), and they do not take well to 8.4V being applied to them. Hey presto, my charger suddenly transformed into a paperweight.

I think your trick of using liquid electrical tape rather than heatshrink will reduce the chances of this sort of thing happening, but having been bitten once, I'm reluctant to risk it happening again.

-Flieslikeabeagle
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Old Jun 07, 2005, 04:47 PM
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I, being in the Marine industry, use the best heat shrink money can buy. It is the waterproof type, when you heat it, there is glue inside the tubing that melts and creates a waterproof and no slip bond. This shrink is VERY durable and it can be had at any West Marine or Boat U.S. store. Try it and you will not go back to the inferior junk that comes with the Deans! Mark-
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