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Old Sep 22, 2008, 08:56 AM
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Vienna, Austria
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chas
I suspect that it would then be called radio-assist, which of course is an abomination.
C
Well,as R/C, F/F or C/L refer to how the model is controlled, I fail to see why you would call a tracked model "radio-assist" as it's not the mode of control and there's of course no possibility to change the model's flight path once airborne. Which is the reason why it still is pure F/F in my opinion.


Dennis
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Old Sep 22, 2008, 11:07 AM
flight999
England
Joined Dec 2002
2,344 Posts
Terrible things trackers. That is why the r/c
people use them too!! They have nothing to do
with controlling the model, as Dennis said
- and everything to do with saving a precious,
expensive, model whether f/f or R/c and please
don't say r/c models are the only expensive
toys that are worth saving.
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Old Sep 22, 2008, 11:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chas
But you won't sully the purity of free flight with radio control? I suspect that it would then be called radio-assist, which of course is an abomination.
If you read this properly guys, I am sure you will see that the "abomination" referred to was radio control , not radio tracking.

But since you mentioned it, just what is free flight? I say that a radio controlled model is free flight. If you doubt this, you must discount as "free flight" any attempt to influence the model's flight behaviour by such shenanigans as auto-rudders, timers, dt's, or folding props. Not trying to be awkward, just illustrating (I hope! ) that the "free-flight" ideal is about as pure as Arianism.

C
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Old Sep 22, 2008, 11:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chas
But since you mentioned it, just what is free flight? I say that a radio controlled model is free flight. If you doubt this, you must discount as "free flight" any attempt to influence the model's flight behaviour by such shenanigans as auto-rudders, timers, dt's, or folding props. Not trying to be awkward, just illustrating (I hope! ) that the "free-flight" ideal is about as pure as Arianism.

C
Is freeflight not simply a model that is free from external control after launch?... Auto rudders and D/T's are not 'external' control but RC clearly is.
Of course taken literally this would mean UAV's which fly ‘by themselves’ to some pre-set computer/GPS controlled program are ‘freeflight’ too

I've got to say on the subject of mega-buck trackers... This is not my idea of freeflight (i.e simplicity, accessibility, low cost, but most of all FUN) but each to his own I suppose.

Steve
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Old Sep 22, 2008, 12:28 PM
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For me a model airplane is freeflight when there are no gadgets that can be triggered from the ground.
Hence flying free from the moment of launch as Steve said, no adjustments can be made after that point. Losing a model does belong to it at times, though chasing a model can be quite exhilerating and good chase stories make for great hangar talk afterwards.

Trackers are necessary in large model FF such as F1x outdoor models though they are probably not very enticing to newcomers as regards to additional complexity of the flying activity, that said I do quite like the site of a gaggle of F1B's hunting for thermals.
Seeing the increasing number of proponents of R/C DT's in FAI outdoor F/F models, it does seem to be reasonable in central Europe where there isn't much open space to fly these type of models to a sensible max that fits the flight capabilities
Personally that doesn't fit my definition of pure freeflight though.
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Old Sep 22, 2008, 01:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FFlover
in central Europe where there isn't much open space to fly these type of models to a sensible max that fits the flight capabilities
This goes double for the crowded little island called the United Kingdom... There cant be more than a couple of places in the UK that you can really fly a serious high performance free flight model to it's max (Middle Wallop is the only place I know of).. In most locations such models are about as relevant as a bicycle is to a fish
IMHO If you want to build a high tech, high complexity, high performance duration model (nothing wrong with that) then why not stick RC in it and fly it in any space large enough to launch and land it, the local sport field will do nicely. With the current cost of even good quality RC gear you would also SAVE yourself a pile of cash compared to the cost of a tracker.
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Old Sep 22, 2008, 01:44 PM
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I hate to break up this fascinating discussion, but the title of this thread is 'Post your freeflight model pics'.

I see from the head of each page 'This thread is privately moderated by Tony Oliver, who may elect to delete unwanted replies. '

Oh, the power I have......

How about someone starting a thread on what is or is not freeflight, while the rest of us enjoy the pics.?
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Old Sep 22, 2008, 01:52 PM
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carbondale il
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Who really knows why I fly free flight? I enjoy the building process, either of a self designed or kit plane, and both scratch building and pre cut parts building. It's a thrill when a plane flys. Having stayed with it I want to say sometimes the process including trimming isn't easy. It's often a challenge, maybe that's why. As far as using a tracker, after all the building and trimming, I'm thrilled I can use one. After all, to me the goal is to fly as long as ingenuity will go. In no way am I knocking RC. In a lot of ways it's different than free flight. Usually the planes are bigger and the pilot has complete control. The control in FF is in the designing, building and trimming ( to a degree ). Getting a FF plane to do basically the same thing twice or more is maybe nearly really difficult. But that's my goal and for each plane I build that will be different. I guess flying RC is like driving - it was scary at first but now that I know how it's been a pleasure.

Kevin
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Old Sep 22, 2008, 02:32 PM
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Fair enough Tony, though any discussion is better than inactivity IMHO...

Anyway here is a photo:



The design is called 'Tailless Terror'. Mine is modified a bit by using a slightly reflexed airfoil rather than the flat bottom job shown on the plan... It does fly but is in no danger of ever needing one of those tracker gizmos . One of these days i intend to stick a canard forplane on the thing and see if it goes any better.

Steve
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Old Oct 02, 2008, 02:10 PM
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Columbus, OH
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Model Aviation Magazine

Kudos to the AMA magazine for having more free flight coverage this month, in particular, an article on the indoor NATS:
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Old Oct 02, 2008, 02:29 PM
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Believe me JPF, if I don't say something, some jobsworth will be along and possibly close the thread down for being off topic.

To help keep things going - a pic of a few years ago at Old Warden.
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Old Oct 02, 2008, 04:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tony Oliver
Believe me JPF, if I don't say something, some jobsworth will be along and possibly close the thread down for being off topic.

To help keep things going - a pic of a few years ago at Old Warden.
You may like to know the 'FLYING PUNT' was designed by Aussie JIM FULLARTON.
Jim lives in Melbourne Australia and would have turned 90 years of age, and at last heard of was still going strong.
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Old Oct 02, 2008, 04:15 PM
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Australia, NSW, Mona Vale
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JetPlaneFlyer
Fair enough Tony, though any discussion is better than inactivity IMHO...

Anyway here is a photo:



The design is called 'Tailless Terror'. Mine is modified a bit by using a slightly reflexed airfoil rather than the flat bottom job shown on the plan... It does fly but is in no danger of ever needing one of those tracker gizmos . One of these days i intend to stick a canard forplane on the thing and see if it goes any better.

Steve
LOOK FAMILIAR ?????



Paddy.
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Old Oct 02, 2008, 10:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gossie
You may like to know the 'FLYING PUNT' was designed by Aussie JIM FULLARTON.
Jim lives in Melbourne Australia and would have turned 90 years of age, and at last heard of was still going strong.
And now the more I think about that was probably Jim's model when he visited Old Warden about 20 years ago.
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Old Oct 03, 2008, 03:44 AM
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Hi Gossie!

The model is Ken Croft's - we trekked down to Old Warden in Sept. 2002 and he flew this one. It's powered by Mark Lubbock's design engine the Mite (this one built by Ken - see http://modelenginenews.org/index.html ).

I have one other of Jim Fullarton's models on my must-build list - his Pelican.

I think we discussed both of these in the Vintage forum a while ago. There must be some pics and further info there.
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