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Old Oct 29, 2004, 07:57 AM
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Perth Westen Australia
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Originally Posted by Highflight
Arbo is simply making an observation about societal trends. It's up to YOU to answer your own questions... I'd be interested.

Highflight
Highflight you old dog you, shouldn’t you be working or something.

I after all have an excuse.

Over here its 9pm and its been a long day of gala openings and wine.

Trying to construct a philosophical thought might be stretching it a bit, so I will leave your question till tomorrow and see what Arbo has to say and maybe then provide the answer.

Cheers
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Old Oct 29, 2004, 08:12 AM
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Originally Posted by gtstubbs
Interesting comment in bold:
a. what is the balance people should strike between looking out for themselves and looking out for others?
b. who are the others people should be loooking out for?
c. what is the relationship between looking out for yourself/themselves and not being responsible for your/their actions?
d. In what way should peolple be looking out for yourself/themselves, economic, moral etc etc?

Tell me please
Do I know the balance? Heck no. But it seems there used to be a day where everyone in the neighborhood knew each other, they looked after each other, when something bad happened, they supported each other. This is not the case in our modern day society. More and more people keep to themselves, don't bother to know their neighbors, and could sit and watch a burgular break in across the street and never call the police.

Paul
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Old Oct 29, 2004, 09:15 AM
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People have grown to where they feel they are not responsible for their actions, where they are only looking out for themselves. Take this and put millions of people crammed into a little space... what do you get? Nothing good.

Paul
Hi Arbo,
Are you basing this from any recent personal experience of the people in NYC.
I was here (nyc) for both 911 and the blackout even walked home across the bridges. The sense of community and society coming together against adversity was overwhelming. Seeing the community come together like that was really was a life experience that gave me new respect for the people living here.
New York is also THE top place in the world to be for certain careers, well mine anyway, especially if you are in your mid 30's trying get to the top of your profession.
I have lived in a few buildings here when sometimes you dont feel like going to the corner store because you dont feel like saying hello to and chatting to 20 people (ok 20 in summer, maybe 3 in winter :-) )

NYC is not for everybody at every stage of life. But if you like a fast pace and are trying to make business happen or do something creative or with music, its hard to beat.

ian

This opinion is based from having lived on 4 continents and been in cities including london paris rome madrid tokyo hong kong singapore jakarta sydney melbourne miami chicago LA etc I point this out say that as far people of the world go New Yorkers are a great bunch !!
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Old Oct 29, 2004, 09:21 AM
Out of Time
United States, TX
Joined Jul 2003
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Originally Posted by gtstubbs
Highflight you old dog you, shouldn’t you be working or something.
Cheers
I AM working. It's just that I'm one of those "winners of the lottery of life" who worked his *** off for most for my entire life and paid for my "win" with high blood pressure and a numbness in my arms that won't go away. I'm SO lucky.

But yes, I am working. However, being self employed means that I delegate most of what's done around here and therefore come in to RCG a few times each day as a diversion. If I don't do that, the stress and pressure would build up so much that I'd end up putting a bullet in my head.
And you wouldn't want that on your conscience, would you.

Highflight
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Old Oct 29, 2004, 09:28 AM
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Originally Posted by iankraus
Hi Arbo,
Are you basing this from any recent personal experience of the people in NYC.
I was here (nyc) for both 911 and the blackout even walked home across the bridges. The sense of community and society coming together against adversity was overwhelming. Seeing the community come together like that was really was a life experience that gave me new respect for the people living here.
I have no doubt great things happened with people comming together. The bad thing, is that it's not the norm. I have spent more time avoiding being in that city than I have spent in that city for that reason.
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Old Oct 29, 2004, 09:34 AM
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I can't coment on the details. What I want to say is this: It is a matter of amazement to me how any rational American citizen could possibly want another 4 years like the past 3.5 or want to have anything further to do with the gentleman who presided over it. Let's face it we would probably be cruising for a war in the far East (on even poorer intelingence than we had on Iraq) as well as an escallation in the Middle East to Syria, Iran and even Saudi and that's not a far cry from world war. Who could say this is an improbable outcome of another 4 years of the Bush crusade. The Bush campaign spin offers you the carrot of "safety for you and your family" - like come on! Please wake up and smell the coffee. It is so important for all of us in the US or otherwise that this whole mind-set is brought to a full stop. It's time for a fresh start, please.
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Old Oct 29, 2004, 09:39 AM
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Originally Posted by FlightPower
I can't coment on the details. What I want to say is this: It is a matter of amazement to me how any rational American citizen could possibly want another 4 years like the past 3.5 or want to have anything further to do with the gentleman who presided over it. Let's face it we would probably be cruising for a war in the far East (on even poorer intelingence than we had on Iraq) as well as an escallation in the Middle East to Syria, Iran and even Saudi and that's not a far cry from world war. Who could say this is an improbable outcome of another 4 years of the Bush crusade. The Bush campaign spin offers you the carrot of "safety for you and your family" - like come on! Please wake up and smell the coffee. It is so important for all of us in the US or otherwise that this whole mind-set is brought to a full stop. It's time for a fresh start, please.
Thanks for your comments. But personally I believe you can keep your 'fresh start' to yourself and your country.
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Old Oct 29, 2004, 09:39 AM
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Originally Posted by Arbo
I have no doubt great things happened with people comming together. The bad thing, is that it's not the norm. I have spent more time avoiding being in that city than I have spent in that city for that reason.
You REALLY have no idea whatsoever what you are talking about. None.

Me, I live in the city, but spend a lot of time in the country, and I love them both, and have nothing ill to say about "hillbillies" or "flyover states" or all that jive. Stupid is stupid, and there are morons around both with Georgia accents and Brooklyn ones, smartness or stupidity is not really a regional trait.
That being said, NYC is the biggest small town in the world, it has a stronger community spirit than most small towns.
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Old Oct 29, 2004, 09:43 AM
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Originally Posted by Arbo
Thanks for your comments. But personally I believe you can keep your 'fresh start' to yourself and your country.
So typical. "We don't give a crap what you or anybody else thinks!"
So facile, so short-sighted, so deadly. So ARROGANT coming from 250 million people surrounded by 6 billion others. People like him make me ashamed. And I have never before in my life felt shame at being an american. I want to be proud again, I want to be on the right side.
There should not be this huge debate as to whetehr we are right or wrong. We should be right.
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Old Oct 29, 2004, 09:49 AM
Motors beat engines!
Milwaukee Wisconsin, United States
Joined Feb 2001
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"It is so important for all of us in the US or otherwise that this whole mind-set is brought to a full stop. It's time for a fresh start, please."


So by your comments it seems your a bigger fan of Chamberlin politics than Churchill's?

Difficult to understand your comments if this is not true.
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Old Oct 29, 2004, 09:52 AM
Motors beat engines!
Milwaukee Wisconsin, United States
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" And I have never before in my life felt shame at being an american. I want to be proud again, I want to be on the right side.
There should not be this huge debate as to whetehr we are right or wrong. We should be right."


Unfortunately there will always be a big debate as long as one group is so desperate to regain power as to say absolutely anything.
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Old Oct 29, 2004, 10:01 AM
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Originally Posted by easytiger
So typical. "We don't give a crap what you or anybody else thinks!"
So facile, so short-sighted, so deadly. So ARROGANT coming from 250 million people surrounded by 6 billion others. People like him make me ashamed. And I have never before in my life felt shame at being an american. I want to be proud again, I want to be on the right side.
There should not be this huge debate as to whetehr we are right or wrong. We should be right.
You know, I figured maybe I should removed you from my ignore list just to see what you are saying.. and I think I made a mistake.

First, I want to thank you for taking my words and working them into something different. One of the reasons you made it to the list to start with. Good to see not much has changed.

If you want to be on the 'right side'... go ahead. From what I gather around here the 'right side' is Europe... so feel free.

I truely can't comprehend how you can be so upset. We constantly have people from other nations commenting on America. And yes, it is a big world full of lots of people. But so what? I don't dabble in their business, and while they are free to have their opinions, I don't think they should matter in terms of what America does. If we did that why not just throw away our constitution and join the EU? We're holding onto that founding document by a thread as it is, when we have people like Sandra Day Oconner saying that our law should be more in tune with international law. Hell, what's the point of being a sovergn country with an attitude like that?

We aren't perfect, nor is any other country out there. Life goes on, love us or hate us, we go on.

If you feel ashamed of any American, than that's you, not them. We have loads of people, with loads of different views. I don't agree with many, and think many do foolish things, but the last thing that would enter my heart is the feeling of being ashamed of them. They are fellow Americans either way, and one day they may come to see the light. There is always hope.

Paul
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Old Oct 29, 2004, 10:06 AM
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Sometimes it's just a matter of having the right friends to show you around at first. That can make a big difference. Anyway if we all liked the same things it would be a boring world.

It's no crime that different people like different things.

but expect a real quick response if anyone wants to criticize me for my choices and talks trash about a place I love living in (we are mostly grown men building and often spending way too much $$$$ on minature rc aircraft after all )
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Old Oct 29, 2004, 10:17 AM
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Unfortunately there will always be a big debate as long as one group is so desperate to regain power as to say absolutely anything. [/QUOTE]

Unfortunately there will always be a big debate as long as one group is so desperate to maintain power as to say absolutely anything.
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Old Oct 29, 2004, 10:26 AM
Motors beat engines!
Milwaukee Wisconsin, United States
Joined Feb 2001
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"Unfortunately there will always be a big debate as long as one group is so desperate to maintain power as to say absolutely anything."


Yup, your right. It was pretty sad to watch Dems try to minimize the importance of Clintons perjury.

I think its ironically funny though how those actions directly led to the backlash that allowed Bush to beat Gore. " Gore should have been a shoo-in. "

Serves all those apologists right IMHO.
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