HobbyKing.com New Products Flash Sale
Reply
Thread Tools
Old Nov 20, 2004, 10:31 PM
Senior Member
zagisrule!'s Avatar
Edgewood, NM
Joined Jan 2002
1,038 Posts
I know that Allegro has several sensored BL controller IC's and they do provide free samples. http://www.allegromicro.com

Samples are given by just about any company for development purposes.



-Matt
zagisrule! is offline Find More Posts by zagisrule!
Reply With Quote
Sign up now
to remove ads between posts
Old Nov 20, 2004, 11:36 PM
wsc
Registered User
wsc's Avatar
Oklahoma
Joined Nov 2004
9 Posts
Slowflyer -

One thing you have to be careful of when making a logic circuit like you are is that any glitches on the input will cause a corresponding glitch on the output. IE, the hall effect sensors will have some bouncing and jittering on the transitions from one state to another, and these bounces will cause incorrect commutations on the output. I cant say whether or not this will be a serious issue for your design to overcome, but it could cause you some grief down the road. Anyway, good luck. Very simple idea, could come out very nicely.
wsc is offline Find More Posts by wsc
Reply With Quote
Old Nov 21, 2004, 04:51 PM
Registered User
Joined Sep 2004
40 Posts
WSC-
I'm not sure if the glitches would affect the controller, but theres one way to find out! If it has problems, buying less sensitive Hall sensors could reduce glitching.
Matt-
I checked out their website and I'm impressed that they give free samples on so many of their products. However, the controllers that use Hall sensors all have a minimum supply voltage of 7v or higher. This would be a problem, as I use 7 cell batteries. The voltage will drop well below 7v before the battery is run down. There is a controller with a minimum supply of 5v, but it uses emf sensing. I could use it if I didn't use any Hall sensors.
slowflyer90 is offline Find More Posts by slowflyer90
Reply With Quote
Old Nov 21, 2004, 05:23 PM
"Simplify, then add lightness"
Raleigh,NC
Joined Nov 2000
2,700 Posts
I don't know about Allegro, but my experience lately is that a lot of semi manufacturers seem to be getting a little stingy with the online samples. I have ordered a lot of samples online before that were shipped quickly with no questions asked, but lately it seems that a lot of online sample requests just get routed to a local rep or distributor who calls to verify your needs first. Has anyone else noticed this?
jeffs555 is offline Find More Posts by jeffs555
Reply With Quote
Old Nov 21, 2004, 06:31 PM
Senior Member
zagisrule!'s Avatar
Edgewood, NM
Joined Jan 2002
1,038 Posts
Yeah,

Samples are a little harder to get, I have had to actually call distributors trying to get samples. All said and done though, I have never not gotten a sample of a product I needed.

My favorites are probably Microchip and ON Semi, both of which are blisteringly fast service-wise. ON requires a $11 shipping fee on all sample orders, but they will allow amazing numbers of samples without any question.



-Matt
zagisrule! is offline Find More Posts by zagisrule!
Reply With Quote
Old Nov 23, 2004, 07:10 PM
Registered User
Joined Sep 2004
40 Posts
Well, I've requested Hall sensors from allegremicro yesterday, so I'm expecting them to arrive within a week or two. The questions on the order form weren't too bad and they claim that your order will ship within 1 day of confirmation. When they arrive, I'll post how long it took.
Matt:
I may end up using your simpler design just because its simpler. Another idea is to try both and see which works better. Parts shouldn't be too expensive.
slowflyer90 is offline Find More Posts by slowflyer90
Reply With Quote
Old Nov 27, 2004, 02:13 PM
Registered User
Joined Sep 2004
40 Posts
Hall sensors arrived yesterday, so shipping only took 5 days . However, it turns out that I requested the wrong type of sensors. The Hall sensors I got were intended for surface mounting, so I requested some with longer leads today.

On a side note, I discovered something interesting this morning. I have a slowstick and was testing how many amps my existing motor would draw. With an 8 cell nihm, it drew around 7 amps. The incredible thing was that my controller was only rated for 2 amps and I have been flying with it for over a year! It just seems odd since I'm obviously pushing it past its limit, but it is rairly even warm after flying long flights at full throttle. Makes me wonder if it's ever going to burn out on me one of these days...
slowflyer90 is offline Find More Posts by slowflyer90
Reply With Quote
Old Jun 10, 2005, 04:57 AM
Registered User
Joined May 2005
14 Posts
circuit deagram

hello sir,
sent me circuit deagram of 9-pole cd-rom brushless esc.
giri arjun is offline Find More Posts by giri arjun
Reply With Quote
Old Jun 10, 2005, 07:45 AM
homo ludens modellisticus
Ron van Sommeren's Avatar
near Nijmegen, Netherlands
Joined Feb 2001
10,510 Posts
A cd-rom motor does not need a special controller, as long as it's a brushless controller it's ok. Several do-it-yourself brushless esc designs, notably the Speedy-BL, the Quax and Takao Shimizu's designs:
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=140454

Vriendelijke groeten Ron van Sommeren
e-motor building tips & tricks
diy outrunner discussion group
int. E fly-in & diy outrunner meet, August 28th, Nijmegen, the Netherlands
Ron van Sommeren is online now Find More Posts by Ron van Sommeren
Reply With Quote
Old Jun 11, 2005, 11:19 PM
Registered User
e-sailpilot86's Avatar
Joined Jun 2001
1,569 Posts
I wish there was a far easier design for brushless controllers... I'd have to take an electronics class to learn this stuff. I haven't even taken Java yet...

R/C microflight had a pretty simple one, easy to understand. Used hall sensors.
e-sailpilot86 is offline Find More Posts by e-sailpilot86
Reply With Quote
Old Jun 19, 2005, 01:28 AM
Registered User
Columbia, MS
Joined Jan 2004
10 Posts
I hope this thread isn't too old already, but since I've spent a lot of time looking for ICs recently...

I've checked out every datasheet I could find and then some for sensored brushless drivers (trying to make a starter/generator (not hobby related-well a different hobby anyway)). I only payed attention to the full-wave 3-phase pre-drivers. Anyway here's the ICs I like best (mostly because their the simplest without a million pins and features I don't need) some don't have speed control:

NJM2624 - - - 4.5-18V - - - - 16Pins all N-channel Mosfets
NJM2625 - - - 8-18V - - - - - 20Pins
NJM2626 - - - 6-26V - - - - - 16Pins
http://www.njr.com/index4.html

MC33033 - - - 10-30V - - - - 20Pins
http://www.onsemi.com/site/products/summary/0,4450,MC33033,00.html?tax=407

LS7260 - - - 5-28V - - - - - - 20Pins
LS7362 - - - 5-28V - - - - - - 20Pins
http://www.lsicsi.com/products_files/body_products-brushless_dc_motor_controls.htm

I didn't check all of them but the ones I checked are availiable from digikey or mouser for a buck or 2.

For the people that know electronics better than me (I just know what I've learned on the net the last month or so), I was wondering if you can drive mosfets from a non-pre-driver IC. Can you use a P and N totem pole connected to whats supposed to go directly to the motor?

Joel
Joel is offline Find More Posts by Joel
Reply With Quote
Old Jun 19, 2005, 03:32 AM
Registered User
Joined Aug 2004
21 Posts
ICs

Some time back I was looking for ICs for an ESC, I found some fro Sanyo. they have brushless,sensorless controller ICs that are voltage controlled and work on voltages from 1.5v to 3v if I remember correctly. I have lost the the part numbers but I think that they were LB16**. I never found a supplier.
cheers,
Robin
robinhood is online now Find More Posts by robinhood
Reply With Quote
Old Jun 19, 2005, 05:25 AM
We want... Information!
Bruce Abbott's Avatar
Hastings, New Zealand
Joined Jan 2001
5,173 Posts
It is possible to use a non pre-driver IC with external FETs. Connect a resistor from each motor phase to the supply, and another to ground. Then you can detect three voltage levels using two comparators, one per output FET. This requires 6 comparators and lots of resistors, so is probably more complex than using a pre-driver IC.

I chose the NJM2624 pre-driver for it's simplicity, availability and low cost (just $0.90 each at Mouser Electronics). One thing to watch with this chip is that although it can work down to 4.5V, its outputs can only go up to 1.5V below the supply voltage. Therefore at least a 6V supply may be needed to drive logic-level MOSFETs.

My circuit makes a stock CDROM motor act like a brushed DC motor, which can then be driven by a normal brushed ESC. The breadboard prototype worked very well, so I am now working on a surface mount version. The output switches will be SI4542DY dual N&P MOSFETs, for a total of only 24 parts on the PCB.
Bruce Abbott is offline Find More Posts by Bruce Abbott
Last edited by Bruce Abbott; Jun 19, 2005 at 05:32 AM.
Reply With Quote
Old Jun 19, 2005, 11:03 PM
Registered User
Columbia, MS
Joined Jan 2004
10 Posts
Bruce:
Thats the IC I like best and since you have already made a circuit with it and I don't know much about electronics I was wondering why you didn't just use 6 N-channel MOSFETs instead of Ns driving Ps?

Also what hall sensors do I need? I'm guessing bipolar analog? 4pins?

I have a question about mosfets in general too, if you don't mind. Since I'm making a starter/generator, the starting voltage is 12v and the generated voltage could be to about 120v unless the stator saturates before then, not sure how the saturation stuff works, but on to the question.... The generated AC would be rectified by the diodes in the mosfets which is cool, but what if I'm not using any of the power, will the high voltage jump from the source to the gate? Is that what the Vgs is? How would I get around this? Could I just use a shunt regulator to keep the voltage down? I need a regulator to charge the battery anyway. I was gonna have a diode with the regulator in parallel with it so the battery doesn't get the high voltage strait from the generator. I know the Vdss has to be high enough too, but I just need to know if a high enough voltage can go from source to gate?

Thanks,
Joel
Joel is offline Find More Posts by Joel
Reply With Quote
Old Jun 19, 2005, 11:24 PM
Registered User
Columbia, MS
Joined Jan 2004
10 Posts
robinhood:

I haven't looked too much for sensorless drivers since I need the starting torque, but I haven't found a sensorless ic that doesn't need a centertap, or is a pre-driver. I'll probably keep looking though, since I do have several cd-motors.

Sanyo's current sensorless drivers

All Sanyo 3-phase brushless Drivers

Joel
Joel is offline Find More Posts by Joel
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools

Similar Threads
Category Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
FAQ five(5) diy brushless ESC designs Ron van Sommeren DIY Electronics 105 Feb 13, 2014 07:39 AM
Best DIY Brushless ESC Kit? gfcermak DIY Electronics 10 Aug 25, 2004 01:23 AM
group order for diy Speedy-BL brushless ESC family Ron van Sommeren Electric Plane Talk 5 Jul 27, 2003 10:56 AM
group order for diy Speedy-BL brushless ESC family Ron van Sommeren Power Systems 0 Jul 24, 2002 08:15 AM