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Old Sep 15, 2004, 01:35 PM
Tinkerer in Training
RGinCanada's Avatar
Guelph, ON
Joined Sep 2004
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Sardine Carrier - A Bread and Butter Scratchbuild

I am currently scratchbuilding my first hull. I chose the bread and butter method because it seems pretty straight forward to me. As I browse the pages here however, I don't see anyone else using this method. Is there a reason for this?

(Things are going tickety-boo so far, but am I heading for an unseen disaster?)
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Last edited by RGinCanada; Nov 24, 2004 at 11:54 PM. Reason: Changed title to accurately describe the thread
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Old Sep 15, 2004, 03:03 PM
KC8WPF
CG Bob's Avatar
Euclid, Ohio, United States
Joined Sep 2004
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One reason is that you have to cut away the center of each plank to install the R/C gear. Most people find it easier to build plank on frame or bulkhead, this usually give a lighter hull.
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Old Sep 15, 2004, 03:30 PM
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Hi RG . Bread and butter method is ok , but as CG Bob said , the problem is gaining the space required for the RC equipment . I also find that it is also a lot of work , shaping the Hull on the outside also. Even with Bandsaws , power files etc , it seems to take for ever. Having said that , when you can't get the correct profile with the plank on frame method , i sometimes wish i had gone b&b method.
Happy modelling
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Old Sep 15, 2004, 03:56 PM
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Guelph, ON
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As a beginner, I get hives just thinking about planking the rounded bilges and the steep curves under the stern of this boat!

I was thinking about carving a plug, making a mold and doing a fibreglass hull, but that seemed like a big bite to chew on for a first keel-up project.

As far as room for R/C goodies, I don't see a problem on this project (I'll post pictures shortly)

As for weight... Hmmm... Once I'm done rough carving, I think I'll slap a couple coats of spar varnish on the hull and drop it in the tub to see where the waterline sits.

Regards, Ray
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Old Sep 16, 2004, 05:47 AM
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North-East England
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I did the opposite to yours!

In the early days of my boat building I used b&b and finally did a couple of planked hulls. After 30 years off from boat building (apart from simple models) I got a fishing boat kit to get me back into it. It was planked. I was fairly apprehensive about the planking but it worked out far better than I'd hoped - the awkward bits were as much of a problem as you suggest though!

The big advantage in planking was the space as others have already said. It took a long time to complete as I am allergic to cyano fumes so much was pin and glue a bit, wait a bit, then do a bit. A very 'bitty job', but still a bit quicker than the work on b&b.

The disadvantage of planking on my boat is the thinness - about 1/16th inch so I epoxy/glassed the outside when done, and brushed epoxy on the inside. The planking looks attractive and can be seen both inside and out. I would not like to take on the job of scribing planks on a 'solid' hull, but neither would I like to make a planked version of a plated hull. Swings and roundabouts I suppose.

From your line drawing it looks interesting. What is it? How big?

As for weight, I've not made a boat yet that didn't need a fair amount of church roof to get down to the waterline. At least you can remove more to get there.

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Old Sep 16, 2004, 09:06 AM
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Here are some pics of the project so far. I'd conservatively guess I've put in 10 hours so far. I've rough faired one side from the stem to back around the sternpost (nothing finer than 50 grit sandpaper yet) and its taken about four hours. The going was pretty slow until I set down my chisels and went to town with a spokeshave and surform. The hull just seemed to jump out of the lifts!

The boat is a 85' sardine carrier, done at 3/8" = 1'-0" scale. It comes out to 31" or so. I wanted something slow and beamy as this is for my 6 year old and 8 year old boys to tool around with while I sail my Victoria. They picked the boat from "Dynamite" Payson's book, "Boat Modelling the Easy Way". I scanned the plans and traced them in Autocad, then scaled them full size before plotting them at 1:32.

I am so pleased with how things are going that I wouldn't hesitate to do another boat the same way. As my skills improve, though, I will take a shot at a plank on frame boat.

Regards,

Ray
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Old Sep 16, 2004, 12:30 PM
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North-East England
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Looks great! Keep the pics coming as you progress? There must be a good few readers of these pages who have never seen b&b construction.

It certainly brings back memories for me.

tony
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Old Sep 16, 2004, 03:03 PM
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Near Muncie, IN.
Joined Aug 2004
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I was just about to ask what Bread and Butter construction was...now I see. Nice work and an interesting method of construction and a very nice design. Im a first time builder myself and I had excellent results with the plank on frame method. It was not nearly as difficult as I thought it would be.
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Old Sep 17, 2004, 07:03 AM
Say no to ARFs
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Manchester Municipal, New Hampshire, United States
Joined Sep 2003
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Ray,
A friend of mine built that same boat a few years ago, he did it plank on frame. This is a great looking boat when finished and he said it sailed very well. I'm very sure you will like it when you finish.
Hans
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Old Sep 17, 2004, 10:11 AM
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Thanks for the encouragement. This morning I roughed out the outher side of the hull, and should have the whole thing faired by Monday.

Hans, do you have pics of your friends boat? I'd love to see them!

Next up... Cutting and laying up the lifts for hull #2. (I'm doing two identical boats at the same time)

Regards,

Ray
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Old Sep 17, 2004, 12:09 PM
Say no to ARFs
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Manchester Municipal, New Hampshire, United States
Joined Sep 2003
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Ray,
Sorry, but no pics. I have not seen Roger in about 5 years now. We used to work at the same place and he got me interested in boats. After 5 years, I am starting to take the plunge.
I think his was a white or cream colored hull. I remember that it was a very nice looking boat. He used some small half round wood all the way around the boat as a dock scuff plate or something. Had to steam it to bend around the stern, but it looked good.
Hans
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Old Sep 17, 2004, 12:12 PM
Useful Idiot
Asturias, Spain
Joined Mar 2001
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One advantage of B&B is that no twists are introduced when planking. However, where weight is an issue, eg, racing yachts, it's none too practical.
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Old Sep 21, 2004, 10:49 AM
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What would it take to use the lift method/bread and butter hull I have faired to create fibreglass copies? Can anyone direct me to information on doing this?

Thanks,

Ray
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Old Sep 21, 2004, 01:35 PM
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PDX, OR
Joined Dec 2002
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Actually, James just made a small 8" tug boat using a method you could try to duplicate.

Essentially you seal(with lacquer) your hull, and then put several coats of wax, and then a parting agent over the out side of your hull. Then you fiberglass over the hull, and then pop the plug(your wood hull) out after the fiberglass has cured.

Here is James quick thread on his tug boat.
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=274180
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Old Sep 21, 2004, 01:51 PM
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Hi Umi,

Thanks for your reply. I did read that thread, but something still isn't clear to me. Wouldn't the fibreglass cast that came off the plug be the master for creating additional hulls? That way if you laid up your fibreglass inside the master (created from the plug...), it would come out the same dimensions as the original plug with a nice smooth finish?

I have no FG experience, thats why I'm asking. Either way, I doubt I'll try it this time out, but enquiring minds want to know...

In the "Forgive me for wandering off topic" category: While checking out a link to your site in the "Retrieval boat" thread, I stumbled across your trebuchet video. It was so cool I had to build one! Thanks for the inspiration!

Regards, Ray
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