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Old Jul 25, 2004, 11:45 PM
Air Traveller
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Baby Joe Turbine Engine

I found a link on a forum to this website "jetjoe.com". They make a micro turbine jet engine called the Baby Joe JJ-1200. It puts out a max of 12lbs of thrust and costs $599 as a kit, and $699 fully assembled. Does anyone out there have any experience using this engine? Is anyone running one in their RC plane? I am looking for an entry-level low cost turbine engine, and if this engine is any good, I think it is something I could afford..
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Old Jul 26, 2004, 08:50 AM
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Dunno. Never heard of it before. But it is so cheap, it's worth a shot. I am ordering one. Chinese made.
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Old Jul 26, 2004, 09:11 AM
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Looks interesting! A full kit w/ ECU and accessories comes to $949, still a rather affordable price The replacement parts are cheap as well. I'm sorely tempted.........

If anyone orders one, post your experiences! I'm sure we all would love to read about it.
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Old Jul 26, 2004, 09:17 AM
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This could be the great chinese breakthrough. We shall see. I asked for the top of the line version with full autostart and FADEC controller, it was $1050 or so.
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Old Jul 31, 2004, 03:45 PM
Air Traveller
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EasyTiger,

If you have ordered one, please let us know when you get it and how it works out. What kind of plane will you be putting it into?
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Old Jul 31, 2004, 03:51 PM
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I am scheduled to take delivery in a few weeks. It looks like the real thing, it really does, we shall see. Support and service, we'll see about that, too.
I have high hopes.
I have a T2J Buckeye about ready to go, and an F8 Crusader. So far, all indications are that this is NOT some sort of scam, but just cheap Chinese manufacturing finally getting in on the turbine market.
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Old Jul 31, 2004, 04:33 PM
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Where are you located Easytiger?

The F8 Crusader is a single engine plane.....so I assume your gonna try one of the JJ-1200s in it first? The T2J Buckeye Navy trainer jet has 2 engines, if I am correct.

I would hope it is NOT a scam! They talk about using a German made GRW ceramic bearing for the turbine wheel which is rated to 160,000 RPMs. Implying that they have targeted a low cost / quality engine as a product.
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Old Jul 31, 2004, 04:48 PM
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I am located in NYC. They have an office in Fresh Meadows, but to get one shipped from NY to NY adds $100 worth of sales tax, so I asked for one directly from China, they said Aug. 10.
The Crusader may be slightly underpowered with 12 pounds of thrust, so I may do the buckeye...
There were both single and twin versions of the buckeye, mine is, thankfully, the single!
The quality of the castings IS a concern, as turbine failure can be deadly...it's not the money, losing a $1000 engine, what worries me is blades coming out and hurting someone.
I do absolutely beleive that what they are promising is totally do-able, a wren 54 kit is not that much more(at least, until the euro rose against the dollar)...subtract a lot of the labor costs, and you have a jetjoe priced engine.
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Old Jul 31, 2004, 07:10 PM
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I don't think anything would happen during a turbine failure... dangerous anyways...the engine would just stop running ..
I just don't see how it would explode
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Old Jul 31, 2004, 07:29 PM
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Not explode, like a big fireball, but blades seperating and flying out, most certainly. US AMA regs required that the case be able to contain catastrophic blade failure, but now that that the regs have changed, who knows?
I do know that it IS something of a concern to me, blade failure, once some people have gotten some airtime on these, I will be less concerned. I mean, it DOES need to be really precision stuff.
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Old Aug 01, 2004, 12:39 AM
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I could not ensure the “blade failure” ,but I have known how much mony for a turbochanger rotor in China . real price is $80--100
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Old Aug 02, 2004, 02:01 AM
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It's the parts shooting out of the engine at high speeds that is the danger in an "uncontained" turbine failure. If the parts stay in the engine then there is no real danger, but when they pierce through the engine housing traveling at high velocities there is a possibility for injury/death/property destruction. Uncontained turbine failure has brought down full scale planes:

In 1979, a United Airlines DC-10 suffered a catastrophic center engine turbine failure (#1 compression blade assembly) where the exploding parts severed the main tail flight control hydraulics.

Because the model engines have to be light, the exterior housing probably isn't going to put up much of a resistance to a 100,000+ RPM chunk of metal!
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Old Aug 02, 2004, 07:19 AM
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Someone from Wren issued a statement in RCUniverse:

Quote:
We have seen on RCUniverse references to a low-cost turbine being advertised by JoeJets. Having made some enquiries we have discovered that JoeJets has a link with one of our customers in the Far East who purchased a MW54 Mark 2 Turbine kit from us last year. We have studied the pictures on the JoeJets website and believe that the turbine, shaft, combustion chamber, diffuser, guide vane and shaft tunnel in the pictures are the ones we supplied in the kit.
It is unethical, and in most countries illegal, to pass off someone else's product as your own for the purpose of soliciting orders. In our opinion that is what JoeJets are doing.

We are not associated with JoeJets in any way whatsoever and will certainly not be supplying them with turbine wheels. We would like to remind jet pilots that all parts in turbine engines have to be made to extremely high standards in order that the engines can work efficiently and safely. Turbine wheels need to be made to exacting aerospace standards and subjected to rigorous inspection. A turbine disc failure is a life-threatening event and a serious incident could have repercussions for everyone involved with model jets.

Roger Parish
On behalf of the Directors, Wren Turbines Ltd.
Interesting if true... but as others point out on that forum, there's only so many ways to make a jet engine, and Wren's design is in turn based on an earlier one that many others have also used as the basis for their design. (AMT is an exception, apparently).

As for quality... I hope we'll be hearing some user reports soon! (If easytiger suddenly stops posting here, we'll know not to buy one, tee hee ). But I am fully convinced that it is theoretically possible at least to produce turbines this cheaply in China. Heh, I got an outstanding, feature-packed Chinese DVD player that cost less than the ink cartridge in my printer....
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Old Aug 02, 2004, 07:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mwraight
It's the parts shooting out of the engine at high speeds that is the danger in an "uncontained" turbine failure. If the parts stay in the engine then there is no real danger, but when they pierce through the engine housing traveling at high velocities there is a possibility for injury/death/property destruction. Uncontained turbine failure has brought down full scale planes:

In 1979, a United Airlines DC-10 suffered a catastrophic center engine turbine failure (#1 compression blade assembly) where the exploding parts severed the main tail flight control hydraulics.

Because the model engines have to be light, the exterior housing probably isn't going to put up much of a resistance to a 100,000+ RPM chunk of metal!
PREVIOUS AMA regs mandated that the case needed to be strong enough around the rotor section to contain blade failure. Don't know if that reg is still in place, don't know if non-us spec engines conform to that standard.
I do know that about five years ago, a friend of mine actually got hit by a rotor blade...I was not there, so I got it all second hand, but he was videotaping at a contest and an engine burst and a bit JUST missed his family jewels...other guys in my club witnessed it, it really DID happen.
So, again, catastrophic failure IS a concern of mine....
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Old Aug 02, 2004, 07:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Muxje
Someone from Wren issued a statement in RCUniverse:



Interesting if true... but as others point out on that forum, there's only so many ways to make a jet engine, and Wren's design is in turn based on an earlier one that many others have also used as the basis for their design. (AMT is an exception, apparently).

As for quality... I hope we'll be hearing some user reports soon! (If easytiger suddenly stops posting here, we'll know not to buy one, tee hee ). But I am fully convinced that it is theoretically possible at least to produce turbines this cheaply in China. Heh, I got an outstanding, feature-packed Chinese DVD player that cost less than the ink cartridge in my printer....

Ugh. RCU! I bet they are FLIPPING over this one!

Wren, well...wren's design may have STARTED with the basic KJ66, but, over the years, they have developed and refined it to the point where they can definitely call it their own.
Copyrights? Bootlegs? Protecting your design? Jeez, welcome to China, pal! Fuhgeddaboutit! They knock EVERYTHING off...don't complain, because WE buy it.
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